The Writer Assembly: The Next Era of Quality Stories

[MasterCrew]

The Writer Assembly
The Next Era of Quality Stories
Advanced Role Play OOC Thread


The WA is a circle of innovative author’s that coalesce to brainstorm quality story ideas, produce convincing treatments of the ideas, and introduces these tales to the world.

It seems that at the moment, most stories that regulate around the role playing community are declining in quality. The majority of stories appear to contain “write as it comes” movement and understandable but less than suitable plot expanse. This is the reason why the WA was brought into existence.

Meetings to discuss ideas and treatments will be held weekly to biweekly. Below are a few of the steps the WA takes in consideration whilst discussing story/plot ideas and treatments:

Phase 1: Brainstorming

• What genre is the idea categorized in?
• Does the idea effectively capture interest?
• Is the idea clear?
• Does the piece have an appropriate title that generates interest?

Phase 2: Analyzing the Treatment

• Does the treatment effectively capture interest?
• Does the treatment make sense?
• What are the pros and cons of the idea?
• Is the treatment’s theme clear? Are any parts confusing?
• Where does the treatment stand in the category of the Four Comprehensions?

o Incomprehensible: Due to serious problems with content and/or mechanics, the message simply cannot be understood.
o Understandable: Although the message may contain many errors of various kinds, the basic point seems clear. This is a good start for any treatment.
o Favorable: In addition to having a plot and theme that seems clear, the writing gives a favorable impression. Content is probably well organized and well supported; mechanical errors are probably few. All treatments should strive after the 2nd-3rd revision to reach this level.
o Eloquent/Profound: Not only does the clear plot create a favorable impression, something about the content, word choice, sentence structure, figurative language, etc. moves the reader to “Wow!”

• Does everything in the treatment contribute to this main idea?
• Should anything be deleted because it is irrelevant to the story?
• Does the treatment “flow” between plot suggestions?
• Does the piece have an appropriate title that generates interest?

Phase 3: Final Composition/Introduction

• Does the introduction effectively capture interest?
• Is the introduction clear? Are any parts confusing?
• Are ideas supported and developed in the OP?
• Can you identify a main idea that pervades the introduction?
• Does the ending of the introduction leave the reader with a final impression that reinforces this main idea?
• Does the introduction use concrete images that bring the composition to life?

If you are interested in joining the Writer Assembly, please post your interest!

[Dorian Gregory]

Greetings,

I'm not quite sure what to make of all this. The generally idea is quite clear. It is parallel to everything I am learning as law student. It is actually vaguely reminiscent of the Administrative Law concepts that I am currently learning about. However, it also reads very elitist and if you have actually paid attention to your time spent on the Guild you'll notice that such things do not fly so well in that aspect. Unfortunately this is extremely too similar to my Legal Writing class to make it even remotely valuable to me. Placing such a complex formula in conjunction with creative makes it feel too systematic and not very creative at all.

However, my question is this...What is your true intention here? Obviously it appears on its face to try and promote more uniform progression and improvement across the board but what do you get out of it? What would be the purpose for people to join or help in any manner?

[MisterGrey]

Well, with that attitude you'll never find a good RP. Improvisation and letting events flow naturally is actually a lot of what makes up text-based roleplay. At this point you might as well write a novel.

[MasterCrew]

What is your true intention here? Obviously it appears on its face to try and promote more uniform progression and improvement across the board but what do you get out of it? What would be the purpose for people to join or help in any manner?

Greeting to you as well,

My true intention for creating the WA is to form a group of innovative writers that work together on coming up with quality story ideas. After we have zoned in on a few great ideas, the group tweaks the ideas into treatments (an in-depth look at the history and information behind the story), providing a enough story information for an Interest check.

What you get after pouring over fantastic ideas and treatments are stories that will have profound depth, brilliant themes, and realistic background information.

The purpose for people to join or help in any matter would be the same as above, to come together and create quality stories with profound depth, brilliant themes, and realistic background information.

I am more than glad to answer any more questions you have on the WA! If you are interested in joining Dorian, I can pass by a few plot ideas that have been bouncing through my brain.

[MasterCrew]

Well, with that attitude you'll never find a good RP. Improvisation and letting events flow naturally is actually a lot of what makes up text-based roleplay. At this point you might as well write a novel.

Greetings MisterGrey!

Improvisation is a key attribute that all authors need to obtain. The problem is not with improvisation, it is with unorganized, aimless writing. When writing, author's have to write with an endpoint in mind. Stories need structure, and in order to have structure in a story, you need a standard, a high standard.

I admire your writing style MisterGrey! You are a author of a fine quality! Hopefully I will have the pleasure of authoring a RP with you sometime in the coming weeks.

[Marrone]

Really, this is just the medicine RPGuild needs. It wont like it, and it might refuse it, but you know it works when you feel an initial distaste towards it. It indicates a need to actually work on creating a serious miliue that invokes creativity. Speaking of which, you might want to consider this aspect:

To me in my Sci-Fi Dungeon & Dragon RolePlays, the contribution of a characters past as well as any additional information a player wishes to invest into the project, is critical to expanding the depth of the story. The host can only go so far in creating the atmosphere; I believe it might be important for the host to also create an environment that's malleable enough for other players to play with and meld new ideas into, as long as it is appropriately cannonical. But in light of this, I think there either just needs to be a rewording or just another mindset when regarding this point:

Does the treatment “flow” between plot suggestions?

Plot suggestions, I assume, come from the other players. So in this, there wouldn't need to be another pesky policy (since brevity is best, I assure you!) but perhaps rewording to make the statement more broad. But of course, it's up to you to weigh the need for this. If that ends up not working, for any reason, I don't see any reason to change it. I think it might focus too much on the host, and while that's certaintly important, the players who accompany the topic creator are the ones who enliven the environment, so further concepts and ideas might be beneficial to create a better experience.

Additionally, I would suggest creating two policy-based questionaires: one for short-hand, the other for long. It is invaluable to have a much more brief version, especially concerning the very early upbringings to a roleplay (since too much questions can be daunting), however, upon the projects dawn I believe a more verbose and interesting range of questions that aim to strengthen the colors of the plot will help bring a bud to flower. Of course, if that just doesn't seem plausible, or if it doesn't ring true to your heart, then I believe you shouldn't do it at all. These rules aim to help, not recede, and I think you do a fine job at that.

[Brovo]

I'm not interested in joining the "writer assembly", nor any potential affiliates. I agree with Dorian Gregory in that this reads with an air of profound and disturbing elitism. Primarily in declaring that "most stories that regulate around the role playing world are near child’s play and pointless." What role playing world? Do you mean this site and its series of disconnected, non-related role plays that I might add are disconnected and non-related, behaving as individual units, not as parts of a whole? Besides, what constitutes as terrible for one person, be it using clichés or having a flawed plot, is typically up to the individual to decide for themselves. For example: I'm sure when you wrote this you didn't aim for it to come off as pretentious and snide, yet as Dorian and I read it we each came to the conclusion that it came off as elitist towards us.

First: While the idea of a group coming together to create an idea together and proofread it and cure it of imperfections is nice on paper, it struggles in execution due to different people's different expectations.

Second: While some of these ideas in each phase are sound, such as the genre the idea is categorized in, others are bizarre and misplaced. Like most of phase 2. Did you mean this kind of treatment? If so, this doesn't apply to role playing, it applies to film scripts. Two different beasts altogether. Also, what constitutes as irrelevant information? How do you determine flow, which people's enjoyment of "flow" differs wildly? (Contrast: Classical music against dubstep.) Maintaining interest is exclusively a time-based concept. Ergo testing this is impossible to do immediately, and can only be done by waiting for a while. Which is... What every idea ends up going through anyway. The biggest curiosity-inducing one here though, is...

"Are your ideas supported and developed"... By... What? Support would indicate that you took your ideas in an essay-like fashion, that you based your claims on certain works of fiction or tropes or otherwise that could "back up" your claims, which doesn't... Really apply to fictional writing in general, leave alone role playing, while the development of ideas comes about by actually participating within and then advancing those ideas through actions, reactions, interactions, protagonist growth, plot advancement, antagonist growth, adventure, interpersonal relationships, etc. You can develop a plot idea for a role play without using it for a while, but the more you develop it on its own, the less likely players will feel like their contributions will really matter if they join.

A fully developed plot is, in essence, a complete plot. Any additions through characters or otherwise are merely growths on the plot, their forced to do things in the plot to keep the plot stable and they don't actually integrate for quite some time due to the size and complexity of a fully developed plot. Instead, leaving the plot as more of a teaser for more information, to draw potential players in and then develop the plot from a simple concept to a grand scale with their direct involvement through IC actions against obstacles which you create based on the characters you have rather than on static events planned out already, is a far stronger plot for a role play because it can adapt to differing situations with different types of characters, and altogether different ways of solving the same problems.

Third: Part of the reason this comes off as elitist, by the way, are some of your word choices. Specifically, in no particular order and not taking all of them into account: "Incomprehensible, eloquent/profound, treatment, child's play, pointless, coalesce, inconceivably pathetic plot expanse, "Honestly" instead of "What I believe", absolutely appalling, etc.

Using these word choices damages your argument. It damages them because it, without intending to, demeans the people reading it. For example, when you note that "most stories that regulate around the role playing world are near child’s play and pointless", you fail take into account that most of your potential audience is comprised of those very people who wrote the very things you're targeting with that line. In a marketing sense when you're trying to sell an idea, like this one, which by the way I'm going to repeat myself in saying that IT'S NOT A BAD IDEA AND COULD RESULT IN SOME GOOD FOR SOME PEOPLE, it is a bad idea to declare that most role plays on this site (or at least stories within those role plays) are "childish" and "pointless". Because... That would mean that most of "us" (the potential audience) is creating the supposed "problem" which you are attempting to "fix". While that may not sound bad on the surface, when one really thinks about it, it's basically saying "I'm better than you, and I'm going to fix your terrible terrible damaging writing." Again, I'm sure this is not what you aimed for, but it's what it ended up coming across as.

Fourth: You use a lot of language that strikes me as being more essay-writing. I touched on this above but I'm going to fully explore it here. "Treatments", "supported and developed", "precise vocabulary", "concrete images", "final composition", "mechanics", etc. This style of writing is FANTASTIC for creating, well, essays as well as other more systematic-style writing such as analysis and argumentation. Something I'm using right now. That is: Quote the source, list what is either right or wrong with the source in a logical manner, give a situation or example illustrating this, and explain why in a constructive manner.

It is not good for constructing creative writing assignments, role playing, or fiction in general because fiction tends to avoid the very foundations of systematic, essay-like writing. Do these things have systems? Yes. Simple, vague ones that can lead to several different results depending on who uses them. For example with the genre question. I could choose fantasy, or science fiction, or real life. I could modify those genres, such as taking magic out of fantasy but leaving the fantastic races and weapons behind, or removing alien races from a science fiction role play and stickin' purely to human tenacity, I could add magic to real life. There are a thousand different combinations one could create just by mixing preconceived notions crafted by genres. In essence, it's an extremely open ended question that only serves to constrict options to make the creation of a story easier for a person to do because they've intentionally quartered off other options.

Most importantly, what is good to me may be awfully contrived and just general junky crap to another person, especially since I am no professional author and neither is said person reviewing my work. We both have coloured views based on our personal tastes. In an essay, you have good argumentation and bad argumentation, and it's very clear to see which is which. In creative writing, the same can't be said except in extreme cases, like Tolkien versus Stephanie Meyer. Even then there are some people who greatly dislike Tolkien and find his works to be long and preachy and just chalked full of slow endless murky dialogue and environmental descriptions, and there are some people who think that Twilight is the next best thing to apple pies.

Why is this important? Because this essay-style writing seems to be colouring your view towards others works, be they "good" or "bad" to you means little to them so long as they enjoyed it. There are certain systems to role playing, like action and reaction, or a GM's relationship to their players, how to handle character death or combat, etc. There are tools that can help, like basic psychology, and effective marketing, but they aren't required. I mean I know an anime-loving fifteen year old on this site who's written one of the most successful RP's of all time here. Probably by accident. I wrote my best RP mainly by accident. I understand why it worked now, I can see why some would levy criticism, but I enjoy it anyway. So I can tell you from personal experience, at least on this site alone, that plot doesn't mean everything, and that you can have a faulty, shitty, hole-filled plot work if the players enjoy their time within it.

Understand that even if you and the members of WA create the best plot imaginable with no errors in it, that it could still fail. Quite easily. A plot helps, but it doesn't make or break a role play. Interactions do, actions and reactions do, activity does, the (un)healthy relationship between a GM and his or her players does.

There. All the constructive criticism I could offer. I hope it's helpful to you so that you can create something healthy, something instructive, something to gather the like minded without being necessarily elitist or misleading. That's what this entire tirade was, by the way--constructive criticism, not an attack on you. Just your idea. Because if it holds up, then you'll know you have something. If it doesn't, well... Back to the drawing board then, eh'?

[Kestrel]

It seems that at the moment, most stories that regulate around the role playing world are near child’s play and pointless. The majority of stories appear to contain “write as it comes” movement and inconceivably pathetic plot expanse. Honestly, the constitution of chronicles these days are absolutely appalling. This is the reason why the WA was brought into existence.

This is pathetic to you, I guess and... In a way you're right. The average game here will never be bundled and sold as a book.

That's exactly where this gets amusing. You see, roleplaying does not equal to writing a book and any roleplay. By it's very nature, roleplaying a poor form of storytelling (constantly swapping perspectives and writing styles, impaired when planning, slow pacing and little control over that pacing, etc. just to name a few obvious reasons.) Even more simply put; your goal with a roleplay is entertaining yourself. The goal for writing a book is to entertain others. So for the WA to be effective, it would assume everyone in the roleplay in question would be, per default, getting most enjoyment out of a 'deeper' and more 'prepared' plot. But that is exactly where the WA falls apart and becomes a niche. You might think it's not a niche, but people with 'pathetic' storylines are still having fun, not breaking away from the concept of roleplaying and... Remember this very well; you are a minority! Your opinion is not commonly shared. Your audience is limited.

That said, let me help you, should you choose to continue this endeavour;

Phase 1: Brainstorming Honest question; do you know what the term brainstorming means?

• What genre is the idea categorized in?
• What are the pros and cons of the idea? Way too early, you have only decided the genre so far. You need the complete concept itself to be ready to even address this.
• Does the idea effectively capture interest? See above. This, 9 out of 10 times, has to be tested. By then we are way out of the brainstorm phase.
• Is the idea clear? Question for presentation, not brainstorming.
• Can you identify a main theme that pervades the idea? Why is this important?
• Does the piece have an appropriate title that generates interest? Test, test, test.

Phase 2: Analyzing the Treatment What is the treatment? I cannot address this section without knowing what you mean by 'treatment.'

• Does the treatment effectively capture interest?
• Does the treatment make sense?
• Is the treatment’s theme clear? Are any parts confusing?
• Where does the treatment stand in the category of the Four Comprehensions?

o Incomprehensible: Due to serious problems with content and/or mechanics, the message simply cannot be understood.
o Understandable: Although the message may contain many errors of various kinds, the basic point seems clear. This is a good start for any treatment.
o Favorable: In addition to having a plot and theme that seems clear, the writing gives a favorable impression. Content is probably well organized and well supported; mechanical errors are probably few. All treatments should strive after the 2nd-3rd revision to reach this level.
o Eloquent/Profound: Not only does the clear plot create a favorable impression, something about the content, word choice, sentence structure, figurative language, etc. moves the reader to “Wow!”

• Is the treatment organized logically?
• Does it maintain interest?
• Are ideas supported and developed?
• Does everything in the treatment contribute to this main idea?
• Should anything be deleted because it is irrelevant?
• Does the treatment “flow” between plot suggestions?
• Does the piece have an appropriate title that generates interest?

Phase 3: Final Composition/Introduction Assuming we're past interest check phase and have gathered enough interested people? Because you don't want to worry about that exact introduction until you get the show on the road.

• Does the introduction effectively capture interest?
• Is the introduction clear? Are any parts confusing?
• Are ideas supported and developed? Don't fully develop ideas beforehand; it takes power away from your players and removing player initiative means removing their investment, affecting their staying power in your RP.
• Can you identify a main idea that pervades the introduction? Optional.
• Does the ending of the introduction leave the reader with a final impression that reinforces this main idea? Optional. More importantly; how does this introduction attempt to motivate others to start writing?
• Does the introduction use concrete images that bring the composition to life? Think of to what extent you're taking power away with this. Players have creative minds as well and will want to create in addition to following.
• Does the introduction use precise vocabulary? 'Is the introduction clear' covered this already.
• (If there was a specific assignment) Does the final composition fulfill all of the requirements? *fulfil. What specific assignment?
• Does the piece have an appropriate title that generates interest? Aren't we a little late with that?

Your 'WA' requires a lot of work to achieve the goals you pursue. I suggest taking another look at elements such as social dynamics and order of events, before you re-attempt this. And explain what you mean by things like 'treatment.' Failing to explain yourself directly contrasts with the question you pose about the concept and introduction being clear. As is, the 'WA' strikes me as both inefficient and ineffective.

[MasterCrew]

There. All the constructive criticism I could offer. I hope it's helpful to you so that you can create something healthy, something instructive, something to gather the like minded without being necessarily elitist or misleading. That's what this entire tirade was, by the way--constructive criticism, not an attack on you. Just your idea. Because if it holds up, then you'll know you have something. If it doesn't, well... Back to the drawing board then, eh'?

Brovo, thank you very much for your time and feedback!

As I read over it again, it does come off quite elitist and at times misleading. The words I chose could be more tame in approach. My brother, who is a filmmaker (primarily works in post-production but some in pre-production), taught me how to manipulate a film treatment into a story treatment. In the scheme of things, a treatment probably isn't the perfect second step. I do however use it in my work with different writings including my newest book that will soon be released.

Structured "Novel" writing is my form of role playing. What I mean by structured is this: Start writing at point A, in ____ posts attempt to reach point B, and then after concluding the story, arrive at point C. Forgive me if it came off as snobbish. I as well have been apart of one RP in particular that was brought into existence on accident.

I do strongly believe that coming together and creating story ideas would be helpful for the role playing community. Again, thank you for your feedback! I do appreciate it. I would very much like to write alongside of you one day!

Hope you have a great week!

[MasterCrew]

Kestrel,

You have a high reputation here an the forums, thank you for your time and feedback on the discussion points. I agree with many of your points!

I realize that I jumped the gun on brainstorming. My definition of brainstorming is a style of engaging creative thinking and developing new ideas by participation free and open discussion. I will note that your correction fulfill is faulty. I especially agree with your point on the question, "Does the idea effectively capture interest?" The question is not at the right phase and should be moved up.

Again, thank you for your time and feedback! Have a great day!