Black Rainbows

[VioletWhirlwind]

I'll admit the zombies may be a bit much. In which cases, I don't mind them getting retconned. But I was under the impression that adding it would add more obsticles to surmount would end up being even more epic. I admit I'm not exactly familiar with running a zombie-plot, or with necromancer characters...I was just trying to do something different than my norm...which seems to have failed. :/ We could make it so that its only a small zombie outbreak that gets destroyed before it gets out of the hotel, or Strychnyne's spell fails when it gets over-taxed by too many zombies, and they fall dead again and cease to be zombies...or something...I'm willing to get rid of them. And his portal is still probably open...or he can make a new one if that's gone, and go back through that and not come back if needed.

I hate to be the cause of so many problems for this RP. >__< I just thought it would be fun to add the zombies, I didn't realize it would cause such a problem.

Also, as I've stated before, I really don't know where I was going with Freedom. She can fade away into the background and not come back if that's what's needed. Right now, the only characters of mine that really matter to me are Reni and Faul.

[Rexaura]

I have a quite a handful to say, so I'll try to keep this as brief and organized as possible. tl;dr note at the end if you're too lazy to read this textwall. Apologies in advance if I seem irritated or swear-y; admittedly I'm not in the best mood right now.


Re: CHARACTER COUNT & SUBPLOTS
I agree, our involvement with minor characters in this enormous RP has gone haywire. We have minor antagonists; we have a lot. But we should keep them as they are - minor antagonists. We shouldn't feel the need to go into detail on all of the SEO experiments. Really. Before I created my three new SEO guys, I thought up their entrance, their short-lived role(s), and their exits, so I know I won't get carried away with them. I don't want to delve in on their disturbing pasts or selfless reasons for joining the organization or any of that; keeping them minor is the primary reason I haven't mentioned them again. The next time they'll be mentioned will either be when some Runners make it to the compound or if someone updates on something in the compound and it's convenient/logical for my character(s) to react.

I'm not saying I disapprove of how many characters we have. I'm just a bit "oooh :/" @ how in depth/involved we're going with all the backgrounds with those who are minor. If it helps, we can think of the characters here as those in some J-RPG. The main playable guys (our Runners) get the focus, with the lead antagonists also stealing spotlight every so often, and all the NPCs/minor guys/minor antagonists do their thing and that's it. Like what we did with Viola/the RBC; I like how she popped in, had her reasons and motivations for doing what she did, and exited promptly.
If we work on our focus some more, then character issues/pasts/subplots etc. won't be an issue any longer.

We don't need to have "'characters being thrown back to being minor, but still having their stories eventually told blahblahblah". It's all about focus. *I'm* not going to delve on Donner's, Mildred's, Ethan's, or Valentine's stories and motivations once they've been KO'd - or at all, because the story's not about them. Same with Baltimore, despite her current role. They're minor characters and need to stay that way.

If character count is an issue, then as I've mentioned before, expect my count to up by 1, then drop by 6-9 (incl. minor characters). I'll literally be stuck with 3 to 6 characters max once Circle II closes. May or may not bring in a couple of guys for the third circle should the need arise, but they'll be minor. I'm done adding major characters once my new guy enters lol. Don't worry, I have all of my character exits planned out; they won't be spontaneous or nonsensical. (Of course this isn't all I plan to do to help remedy the RP & whatever's going on right now. Character count is a problem that's been brought up, so I thought I'd go ahead and cover what I'm doing on my end on this issue.)

My defense aside, if character count is an issue and there's no way to remedy it properly, then maybe we just need to chuck some out the window. As Ash said, I hate the thought of doing that, but if it helps bring this RP to its feet again, then let's go for it. (I'm trying to avoid this option though for said reason, hence why I said I'd contact Vi with regards to what to do with Strychnyne.) I'll bring this up again in a later note.

Nothing will work if we insist that they won't work.


Re: POST-SIZE
As Ash said, huge posts have upped the expectations as well as the burdens of this RP. It started off like 3-5 paragraphs max per person, and suddenly somewhere the bar got jumped and now Katy, Ash, & myself are writing an average of 5-8 pages per post. If it wasn't noticed before, I'm trying to chop down my post sizes for reasons. My last post was under a page long. Maybe if we continue with shorter posts, it'll be easier to facilitate interaction between other players - this especially helps me for instance, since I know I want Glitch to interact more with other characters like Lani, Nathan, & Kari, since he's practically butt-buddies with Wren & Seipher now. Short posts will also keep the pressure/burdens down and raise activity since we have less to dish out per post. Maybe it won't be daily, but definitely more than one post per week.


Re: ACTIVITY
I'm getting into the same boat as Kim, especially since I'm taking more classes this quarter than I took last. I don't have the capacity or patience to be up-to-date with and posting in an RP *every single day* now that my break is over. I dislike how slow this RP has been admittedly, with regards to activity since we've hit another block it seems, but at the same time, it's a blessing for me that it's not every single day and someone or two getting left behind because they can't keep up. It's why I haven't, can't, and won't join another group RP anytime soon, unless it's with two to three people total, because I can't afford obligating myself to something on a day-to-day basis, not while I have class for the next four years. Maybe during next break I'll join something short-lived. Who knows.

Frankly it's not that I lack free time whatsoever, but I have other hobbies as well. If me deciding to skip out on using the computer for a couple of days because I'm busy or wanted to play video games or whatever results in people having to wait for me... ugh. So no, I'm not for having everyone post something everyday. I mean, if it turns out we're all motivated enough to post every day, then by jove that'd be splendid. I'd love for this RP to become active again, & I'd be extremely happy if it does reach that peak again - whether there's a post every day, every three days, or whatever. But I'm not promising to post something every single day.


Re: PROGRESSING FURTHER & SUBPLOTS AGAIN
Instead of conversing with only two or three other posters, I suggest if everyone's still on board with this RP, we actually ignore posting ICs for a while and talk on the OOC board on what to do to progress, what to do with minor characters who have accidentally gone major, what to do with major characters we don't care about anymore, that kinda shit. We can make a list of every subplot/scenario that's going on right now and, like Katy said, talk about when to close them or which ones to expand on, whatever. (On my end, I'm doing my best to link some to others so we don't have like 8 million lol. It'll be apparent in my next post.) I'd make the list here, but this comment is long enough already.

Sounds like making an outline/synopsis of something that should really be spontaneous (it's more fun that way, of course), but if some people really don't know where to go next, maybe it'll help soothe things out a bit. I have plot twists and secrets for my own characters, but I don't mind bringing some of my ideas to light if maybe it'll help bounce ideas back and forth to get things rolling again. Once the Runners leave the hospital and decide with which option to go with, I seriously know exactly where I want to go with things for both groups (or at least the direction to push everything in, since of course it's not my story lol). I have ideas of where to go next. If you guys need to, talk to me if you need ideas with where to go from here, at least main (Runner) plot-wise. I encourage it.

But I'm not going to bring said ideas and all to the open if no one is willing to hear them or to go through with this suggestion. If anyone has a better idea with how to help get some writers out of their writing block, we're all ears. .. eyes.


And now for everything else. Aka me defending myself for three paragraphs.

If it sounds like I'm defending myself, I am. Ash, who exactly are you talking about when you say "how little some other players have done", "what other players have contributed", and "babysitting weaker players"? It's a dead serious question. This RP consists of you, me, Katy, Jenny, Gem, & Vi (James & Kim more or less, but I've excluded them for their own reasons). Obviously you don't mean yourself or Katy, so are you talking about us other four? Instead of saying things like "some people" and "you guys" & going to Katy/James to talk about everything, maybe you could confront us all as well, whether privately or through this OOC board? That may or may not spawn fights depending on how you approach it, but if something's caused you to leave twice and basically borderline leaving a third time, you need to address it, more directly than you already are.
(If it's something you have been doing, then, well, idk. Apparently it's not direct enough or it's something we all need to discuss publicly, since you're still in the 'I'm tired of babysitting you guys' boat again.)

I really don't know if I'm included in this "weaker players" batch or not, but I've mentioned before, I'm doing my end of the stick to try and push the plot forward after failing to do so in Circle I. I've introduced two new characters (well, one not yet - though he's been mentioned) with multiple different roles and motivations for future plans I have for them. Too much planning in advance? I have at least four backup plans for each character should something turn up, so I'm not at all worried about something interfering or screwing me up. I've spoken to Katy about half of my plans with one character to verify if my moves would be okay, and since I got the okay, I've been working on them. I know my communication & interactions with Jenny's & Vi's characters have been limited, but I've already told Vi I plan to message her about something lol (that & I plan to have Mordie be the one to bust out Reni, or at least the one most motivated to find/help her, since it's in her character), & I've been messaging Jenny with regards to her new character(s) & interacting Glitch with Lani more. I know it's not apparent in the RP as of yet because of their situation/location right now, but once the ball gets rolling again, it should be.

Again, I don't know if I'm in this aforementioned batch or not, and I sound defensive. I acknowledge that and would be happy if someone wouldn't point it out. I have questionably low self-esteem (honest to God, it's why I make ugly faces in 90% of my photos, because I can't take myself seriously), so if I feel the need to defend myself by putting forth my stance in this kinda situation, I will. But all that said, if someone - anyone needs to talk to me about something I've fucked up on or something I need to improve on, please please hit me up. Low self-esteem or not, after living with my brother again for eight months, I can take criticism a lot better than I used to be able to. (I've always loved constructive criticism, but I'd whine & sob if it was presented all-hate-no-love. That's the kinda low self-esteem I've got, though I respond to criticisms a lot better now than I used to. I just feel the need to defend myself in a "you guys" type of message when it's not clear who the "you guys" is directed to.)


tl;dr

• Nothing won't work if we insist that they won't work.
• It's not the amount of characters that has gone nuts, it's our focus on who's important and who's not; it's one reason why there's too many characters to give screentime to, too many histories and pasts to delve into, and too many subplots going on. If we keep our mind on who actually matters in the story, having many characters will not be an issue and will not detract importance from the others.
• If we've hit a block, I suggest we use this OOC thread to go over every subplot going on and perhaps our plans with certain characters (we don't have to reveal *everything*). For characters with short-lived roles/plans/what have you, we could find a way to use or deal away with them, so we don't have too many "idk what to do with him" guys popping up.
• Maybe we could actually talk to one another, publicly, on who's inactive, who's not contributing often/well enough, who's not pulling their own weight, as opposed to only talking to the major/big posters with regards to plot progression, what to do with characters, and everything else. It sounds mean but it's something I feel should be addressed.

I have spent 2+ hours writing this post and revising it countless times. Thank you if you took the time to read this.


LOL Vi you posted before I could get this out.
Don't worry about Strychnyne too much. Adding him isn't too bad, whether or not you had any idea of what you wanted to do with him. I'll shoot you a message once we get more words on our current situation about what I had in mind for him. I took Strychnyne's into consideration before I even introduced Forrest, because S' appearance helps me flesh out a lot of scenarios I have planned out lol.

[BandageKid]

To be honest, I agree with absolutely everything K said, Ash.

I'll elaborate later and if I see the point.
I approached this in the most objective manner I could by sending you a pm first since you are in charge of Circle II, with an objective to revive the RP but your recent OOC post comes across as really negative and undermining towards people.

If you're that fed up maybe you really should just leave.
I won't think any differently of you for it and have enjoyed your contrebution. And always have in other RP's.
But I honestly can't keep up with this turbulent attitude of yours and if it's going to make you a happier person then maybe you should pursue leaving this particular RP.

[VioletWhirlwind]

Oh and one other thing about character count...I know I introduced a few new faces in Reni's past...but that's where they're going to stay: in Reni's past. XP So once this flashback arc is through, they will go away back into Reni's memories.

[BandageKid]

Ok, now I'll add my sentiments.

Again, I'm mixed about your recent post Ash.
You start off by making some suggestions on how to make the RP easier but then appear to spiral down into a negative mindset that this RP can't go on. What do you want to do?

I would've been fine if you could maintain your new introductions of characters such as Warwick and the Swallow which I found compelling characters. However, it seems you can't even follow up a post from where K last posted. Which started with Kenneth's response to a text exchanged between Forrest and Jack. I would've left that post to you but you really weren't confirming much on the FB discussion so I had to take over which I am fine with. What isn't great is that you're complaining again about things which were discussed earlier.

What's worse is that you speaking so cryptically about 'weak' players, which can ruffle everyone's feathers.
And you're only complaining now after a Christmas holiday break from the RP. You make it sound like no one is doing anything but yourself about this RP. Did K go and write that summary and set up a bridge for Circle III for nothing then?
I honestly feel like I'm walking around eggshells now trying to keep you happy in this RP. Especially this is the 3rd time you're kicking off.
And I suggested a Skype call between you, James and Kristena because you're controlling circle II, K circle III and James so that he can get involved again because he has a lot of ideas. It made sense to me to have an open discussion rather than tally notes back and forth.

I am far from perfect too. Definitely there's loads of times in this RP where I didn't carry my weight or post for a long time. What can I say. I get really tired after work and often like to have a mind numbing session of LoL or play other games.
However, I do make an effort to respond to people when asked things instead of stewing my resentment in silence, and exploding with criticisms on everyone when approached.
Yes there are things I feel should fall into remission in this RP but I am willing to act on it rather than woe that this is the end, 'it's my fault', 'it's your fault', 'it's everyone's fault'.

Anyway, I really don't mean to have a go at you but I really have to be brutally honest that I can't tolerate this sort of mindset any more. If you can't work on this then you can't.

I want to do other RP's but I'm not interested in high school dramas and I want to see the story continue in this one.
You're clearly not enjoying this so again, if it's that bad, just go.

[Pachamac]

Alright, main thing I'll say is I did not specify players because I did not want to make things seem personal towards those players and insult them. But just to clarify, no K, you are not included in what I was referring to as weaker players.

The main problem I have here is activity and contribution. I do not expect or want this rp to be updated every single day because for an rp this big right now, that would be insane. And like people say, they have their own lives. I get that. But I cannot hold my interest in something where I am sometimes waiting a week to two weeks for an update.

The other issue that concerns me with regards to 'weaker players' and post contribution is the fact that I don't have the confidence that that will ever improve from them, after watching their activity in this rp over the space of a year. And no, K, this does not include you, you've improved the most. Sorry if my wording made you feel otherwise. But if people need me to spell it out, then Vi and Shy predominantly. I love these guys, I really do, and I understand that they have their own limits with what they can write and contribute towards the plot. This is not a personal attack towards them and something I did not specify earlier for fear of hurting their confidence. The issue I've had with 'babysitting' is that I've had to talk in private with a number of players and give ideas for them on how to proceed and having to have these ideas double/triple checked constantly. I do not mind sharing ideas but it came to the point in Circle 2 where I was literally planning everything and all the IC came down to was essentially writing it all out, with nothing new coming up that served as surprising and inspiration for me to write. Kate's posts were the only ones that did because she and I have never planned together, being able to instinctively work on this type of thing and being able to bounce off each other's posts without a problem. Me and K used to be like this considering how close we were with regards to planning together, but after the last time I quit, K has improved that and gone on to become amazing in that regard. So no, you're not a 'weaker' player. Weaker isn't even the right word to use. It's like you guys say, it comes off extremely negative and it makes me sound more elitist and feel that I am better than everyone. Which isn't right. It's just that there's a disparity between some players and their willingness to contribute, and I don't think that can be denied. This rp went big in scale and skill quickly and some couldn't handle that, which I don't blame. But after over a year and a bit you'd have thought there'd be more improvement to be able to do so or at least the asking for those of us who were doing more to scale back a bit.

And Kate, sorry if I sound extremely negative or whatever. My sincerest apologies. And since I seem to cause a lot of drama for everyone about this all the time then I have to wonder if I should leave, and this time for good if everyone else also feels like that would be the best option. I don't want to, but I won't deny that I do have issues other than the amount of subplots and characters that we've got, and those issues do seem to only be affecting me and not everyone else. It's not fair on you or anyone else for me to be bringing stuff like that up all the time, so yeah... maybe I should. I don't know. If so then it was fun whilst it lasted and hopefully I'd be able to rp with you guys sometime in the future.

--------------

Also to clarify a few things. I am more than willing to communicate my issues and problems within the rp and I've done that. It's not a case of me waiting for everyone to pick the rp up again before I'm venting those issues, simple fact is (in the first time) I didn't raise those issues sooner because it seemed like the rp was dead, and I can't see the need in expressing my problems when no one wants to be active at that time, because that achieves nothing.

If I did not care about this rp since the first and second times I have moaned then I would not have helped K do half of the summary. If I didn't want to still be in it then, I would not have wasted her and my time doing that summary. As I've expressed several times before, summary writing is DEAD BORING. I would not subject myself or anyone else to that hell if I never cared to try and carry on.

Also I am sure that everyone would appreciate my honesty when I have an issue, and so now, and the last two times that it has happened I have been completely honest about it. Granted, the wording of that could have been expressed better and it's difficult for tone and emotion to be properly conveyed by reader and writer but some people think I am going overboard on issues way more than I actually am (and I am guilty of doing that when reading other people's posts).

I have mentioned about 3 times now my problem with activity, which is a problem just for me and something I either need to deal with and accept by going at other peoples' pace or quitting. I am undecided on that and would like to again clarify that I don't, nor ever expect people to post every day, but going months within posts that we sometimes have is a pace that I do not consider fun for me. Again, people have real life issues and they will always trump writing for an rp, but at the same time I can't be expected to be committed to an rp that has little consistency with regards to activity. And again, my other issue which seems to once again be a personal issue is the level of disparity between skill, and again is something that I either need to deal with or leave. Still not sure on this one but am considering leaving if only because it is something that will always bug me and which is not fair for you, me or anyone really. I have high standards. I understand that. And that is an issue with me. I don't think having high standards is bad per se (if I was that elitist about poorer player than I would not have tried to help anyone in this rp. I don't think it can be denied or argued against that I've been more helpful to some players than others have, so have at the least given it my all to helping people) but that is causing conflict and putting myself at a crossroads with everyone else.

I'm editting this a lot, lol.

I just want to clarify to Shy and Vi especially that neither are bad writers or rpers in the slightest. Both are terrific and their characters are fantastic. If they weren't then I never would have tried to help either of you with ideas or interact with either of them. I made a few of my characters integral to your own simply because of how good they are. But the issue with BR is that it's an advanced rp with a high skill level. It wasn't always like that but because of mine and other players' fault with regards to post size and expanding concepts (like K said, the focus on this was lost big time) both of you guys got lost behind a bit. I think the theme and idea of the rp, about characters seeking redemption from hell seemed to specify that it'd be a bit high concept at times was obvious from the start, but it did still get way too big way too quickly and that's my fault. I'm not going to say it was only mine, but I do feel guilty for doing more of it. That said, most of the concepts I've introduced are ones that are expanding on other stuff as well. I think in a smaller, more casual rp sense both of you would really excell at that. You two were two of my favourite players in my Tales of the World rp. But it's just a case of BR being a bit too high level for you guys, is all, and doesn't reflect negatively on you so much as it does on me and the others who took BR to an extreme and above your skill levels. Still love you guys.

And again, yeah. If no one else as any issues with the pacing and posting speed of this rp or the disparity of skill level between players then by all means I should go. There is NO reason why I should be dictating or forcing any changes in anyone if everybody else is happy with how this rp is. Obviously rping is meant to be for fun, and because there are some issues within an rp that do not make it completely fun for one player does not mean that changes should be made to everyone else that would negatively affect their own enjoyment. That's all this should ever be and never ever serious business or something that should break friendships because of a difference of viewpoint in rping, is all. Any of the issues I have is with the rp as a whole and never, EVER meant to be taken personally. I cannot stress this enough, I am not insulting anybody or meaning to do so if people take it that way. You are all fantastic people and people who I consider myself extremely lucky to have as friends, so I do hope none of that changes because of this type of issue affecting the rp, which is why I do hope I can rp with you all again in the future.

But just to clarify again, my issues with the rp is posting consistency (which is a problem only I have for this particular rp) and disparity of skill level (which again is a problem I think only I have but is an issue I'm sure can be agreed upon does exist).

Also Kate, I want to say thank you to you for everything you've done. I know I'm being a pain in the arse about this and I know how compromising and helpful you've been about it. I did notice the first time I moaned about post activity how much you quicker you posted, almost on a day to day basis, not that I expected that. But, and I know I should have mentioned it sooner, I was always grateful for that. Absolutely. I don't want you feeling like you're tiptoeing around me. Never.

I guess I just cared about this rp too much and got too invested in it to the point where I was trying to help everyone with ideas and contributions and with hoping to see this rp be the best that it can be at the expense of my own burnout. Whilst people have had to take their own occassional long-term breaks every now and then, and this rp has always had bouts of inactivity, have I not always been there when people tried to start it up again? Have I not tried to start it up again myself numerous times? Granted the last times this happened and people tried to start it up again, I was less than helpful, because of the problems I have with this rp. What I want is a break. A long term break, just as long as some other players have had. I'm not sure that's unreasonable, and I know that sounds like I'm quitting and leaving any of the hard work to fixing this rp to everyone else. But I've contributed a lot to making this rp good and it's annoying that I feel I'd have to contribute a lot to fixing it as well whereas some people who can or can't due to skill level don't. I want a long term break.

[VioletWhirlwind]

I realize I'm not at the same level as you, and I think I can accept that fact, and I can't stop you if you're determined to leave, but I just wanted to say that, despite some of the setbacks, I HAVE enjoyed playing with you, and urge you to stick around, at least until...um...certain plot points we discussed come about. (purposely being vague here) I'm not sure what I would do if you were to pull out before then, since you kinda implied to follow your lead.

For the record, I do have my next post idea planned out....I just have to type it up and put it in, as soon as we're given the go ahead to start posting again.

[Pachamac]

I appreciate that, Vi. A lot. It's a very mature response to a very immature guy, so I appreciate that a lot. All the same though, I'm sure you could still go through with the ideas that we discussed, not because of me leaving or because you're not skilled enough, but because you ARE skilled enough. You need the confidence to believe in that and you don't need me holding your hand to see that through, or follow my lead either. You're an imaginative girl and a smart writer. Not following my lead or being dependant on my advice would help you more than if I did tell you everything. You need the confidence and courage to grow and do things without being told. And granted you have done that, to various degrees of success, but it's always a learning curve. Best thing is to not get discouraged and keep on trying until you can't try anymore =)

Saying that though I do understand that me leaving would leave people in a lurch since I've had a lot of other people's characters become dependant on mine. I see the problem but I also see that as a good point in which I contributed enough to the point where some may feel that I, and my characters are indispensable. Everyone should feel like that and every character should feel like that. But do they? Have a think about it. Including major and minor characters, if they were removed or never in the rp to begin with, how much of a difference would this rp have been or not? I could say a fair few of mine could be removed and not a lot would be different, but I think a vast majority of my characters have made that much of an impact that without them the rp wouldn't resemble anything quite the same. ...maybe for the better if they weren't ever there but lol I digress. The point I'm making is not to be even more of a narccist than I already am, but again just an example of thinking how much contribution everyone's put into the rp, and also a good place to start of for those of you still interested in staying in thinking what could or couldn't be trimmed.

[VioletWhirlwind]

Blarg. parts of my new post were awkward. It comes and goes. Mostly goes. XP

[Rexaura]

Yo yo yo, sorry for the late notice, guys. Just wanted to let you know that I have indeed started on my next IC lol, but it most likely will not be up until this weekend. I've been working on it bits at a time haha, but better that than not at all. Apologies for the wait! But at least the activity in this thread has returned (:

Vi, I'll shoot you a pm regarding Strychnyne when I get home tonight. I know it's difficult to interact Reni with... well, anyone at all right now because of how she's been separated & locked away, but I appreciate how active you've been with her to say the least lol. Maybe she'll hit some revelations about herself & all that soon? but that's besides the point lol
Anyway yeah, about Strychnyne. Hopefully what I've got in mind will help you interact and explore options/doing more things than contemplating the past or reacting with a line of dialogue. (: but I wanna run it through with you first so you're not all like "0__0 what's going on" lol

Anyhoo. Smell you guys later!
Deuces~! *scuttles off*


EDIT: by "when I get home tonight", I kinda meant this weekend! LOL >.>