Reply With QuotePsh. They can be, they just need to learn first.Originally Posted by Kadaeux
It's fine--this thread is a cooked goose anyway.
Not gonna lie.
I've broken out in evil laughter at the thought of RP plans before.
Mainly because I got way too into character in that cleverly constructed Death Note roleplay and became the GM's psychology experiment, but whatevs.
Psh. They can be, they just need to learn first.
It's fine--this thread is a cooked goose anyway.
This article (?) was useful and I'd like to use it at some point, but being a victim of the academic world I cringed by the lack of "proper" referencing. Did you use tvtropes as source for all of this, or are you implying that you just sat down and conjured all of this from your mind (#7)?
Last edited by Gravija; 11-23-2012 at 11:25 AM.
I've rephrased my first sentence to more accurately reflect my overall inquiry. While questioning the actual source was originally unintended, I see no harm in answering your question anyway; according to tvtropes' main page it's a wikipedia, which means that anyone (?) can create and edit articles, thus becoming an highly unreliable source no matter if the articles are correct or not. What I meant to ask of Brovo was if he used any further sources beside tvtropes for the parts of his article that he did not "properly" provide any references for.
This is an overly complicated way of asking "hey, are there any other sites like tvtropes with good stuff related to your thread?".
Thank you for putting out wissdom. I for one is always running my games with characters in mind and plot as a tool to give them shit to do. And I have to sy that I don't think I could ever run a RP any other way. I ususally have my plyers come up with their own places and participate in the world building. Hell silver Leaves also has a mechanic for actual game changing events set up. Not that I have gotten to use it yet.
made by the ever charming and talented Lillian Thorne.
Tameri.com does a pretty good job at explaining the difference between plot and story, and the various thematic/"repeat" elements one can disseminate from them, but not how to apply it to role playing.
Part of the problem with writing an article about plot and story for role playing is that unlike articles for other types of stories, like novels, or movies, or literature in general, role playing is not writing in that sense. It's not. Therefore anytime you try to "write" for a role play like you would for a novel, or a film, you will encounter severe difficulties until you either abandon the process or modify it to the point where it is no longer the original process.
Simply put: It's hard to find real, genuine, verifiable articles about plots in role playing because role playing is far, far more a game-archetype than it is a story-archetype. Which means finding journal entries about it, or even trade magazines that don't focus entirely on the game aspect of role playing, is very, very hard and very rare, if at all possible. I mean just look at companies like Wizards of the Coast. They never talk about how to create a plot. They talk about how to balance issues between classes in D&D, or changing the random encounter table, or adjusting the power of a few spells here and there or selling a campaign they made without explaining how they made it.
The closest thing I could find was an old AD&D book back in Gen 1 of Dungeons & Dragons. (D&D 1.0, 2.0 was right around the corner then.) The Dungeon Master manual and the Deities manual each teach you how to create NPC's, how to generate a world including weather patterns and biospheres, and teach you how to create the "cradle", which is the world and the cities and nations, which naturally generate some level of background information to use for plots. Like Kingdom A was randomly generated to hate Kingdom B. Now all you need to do is create a reason why A hates B.
I use TVTropes as a source because very very often if articles are edited, it's by people who wish to contribute a legitimate piece of information. There are few parasites who pollute the place, and any articles they touch are generally repaired within a few hours at the most. Also because it's designed specifically for role playing, video games, movies, books, really just tropes & stereotypes in general across all forms of storytelling, it also receives a more dedicated base of people to protect it than Wikipedia ever will.
Plus, Wikipedia actually trusts TVTropes enough to make it a legitimate article to be linked in their own versions of the same articles. That in of itself should say something. Even though Wikipedia can be edited, it trusts TVTropes enough to use it as a legitimate source of information because it is simply that reliable.
The fact that they, quite willingly and happily, compare and put side by side in value IPL, which is potentially one of the most reliable sites on the face of the planet for accurate information on literature in general, with TVTropes?... Is pretty impressive.
The vast majority of my article is comprised of examples for this reason. These examples you can try for yourself.
As for the academic world, this argument would definitely apply... If it was for something better known like novels. Or films. Role playing is a harder beast to tackle and I'm doing my best with limited information. Now I could link Legend of Renalta, an RP I made and tear it apart and show where the flaws are, what it does right, and use it as an example, but it puts into question my ethos argument by basing my logos off of my ethos, and it harms the chances the article will actually be read as it's already pretty lengthy--I have to keep information on this site pretty short otherwise people tend to just... Not read it, and then the purpose of it is defeated.I could attempt to tear into LoR if you want me to give you a more academic-level example by adding citations and direct-from-source examples that you can see for yourself in action in an RP that's lasted 2.5 years or so.
Plus the aim of the article is to simplify a giant--its one and only purpose is to provide to people what a plot is. How you can use it in a role play. What adjustments you need to make. What you need to acknowledge about it in the first place so that you can prevent confusion about it. TVTropes was a good link because TVTropes also leads to the natural exploration of other concepts--like tropes, and stereotypes. If you explore that site for a couple hours you'll find yourself reading up on tons and tons of information about character archetypes, and typical plot twists, Chekhov's Gun, etc. Plus on the vast majority of their pages, you can see examples derived directly from television, video games, comics, manga, anime, novels, etc, which you can trace and read for yourself, kept in spoiler tags to prevent readers from potentially spoiling the plots of these stories.
Simply put: I wasn't out to write an academic-level article because people here wouldn't have read it. Even if they did, half of them likely wouldn't have understood it. That's not insulting the base of RPG by the way--it's simply that the majority of members on RPG are likely still in high school. Thus academic-level writing is not something they've even truly encountered yet in their lives. Therefore I need to write to a high school level to have the largest impact. Which means linking sites like TVTropes, which are easy to understand and use snark and other forms of comedy to keep a reader interest.
However you ARE correct when you state that TVTropes would be a poor academic link due to the fact that it is information that anyone at any time can edit and update, or even delete.
Oh well, thanks I suppose.Feel free to ask questions. I prefer questions more than compliments.
Brovo.
You could totally post this stuff in the Articles/Guides section.
In fact, you could probably have a ton of your latest threads from this section moved there, so they won't just get buried in Roleplayer Discussion- cuz the Articles forum is so slow-moving that all your threads will be on the first page for everyone to see for the next two years.
It's part of the reason I put it up here first.Brovo.
You could totally post this stuff in the Articles/Guides section.
In fact, you could probably have a ton of your latest threads from this section moved there, so they won't just get buried in Roleplayer Discussion- cuz the Articles forum is so slow-moving that all your threads will be on the first page for everyone to see for the next two years.
#1: Discuss it actively first, then if nobody disagrees with it/if everyone finds it clear...
#2: Post it up in the articles section to survive forever.
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