[OOC] The League - First Blood (Persistent World Superhero Sci Fi and Fantasy, Always Open)

[Yog Sothoth]

*double post*

[Yog Sothoth]

Abysse said
I just realized...Why have none of us grabbed theme songs for our heroes? LAME. YOU'RE ALL LAME.

Theme songs are so cliche, Hot Rod and Ocean Warrior are to cool for that lol!

[Archmage MC]

So.... Whats going on now? Topic got quiet all of a sudden.

OK Yog, posted. Hope I didn't go too far there, but I will say, Kidney punches hurt like hell. Also, not sure if I should continue that, or what. I'm not sure what the plan is or the rules are for these villains.

For themes.... I only really know rock/metal stuff from the 90s or video game music, so maybe Blitzkrieg for killjoy is my guess? My repetuare of songs is very shallow compared to most of you.

Appriciate any song ideas for my chars, but if you can't think of any, probably my fault for not fleshing them out more xd.

repost

[MrDidact]

My thoughts

I'll respond to both of you since responding one by one would be cumbersome. Do not take the following response as dismissive for I do admit as a GM I have a ways to go and am willing to listen to any and all criticism. In fact I agree on some points.

1) Abe's attack could be easily traced because from the way it was described his attack was something of a shockwave that made it's way across the floor to the villains. This would leave a pretty obvious trail from the collapsed hole back to his booth, what with up-torn bricks and the like. It'd be pretty hard to hide that kind of thing.

2) By Leeroy Jenkins I mean rushing in without a plan which is pretty much what happened. HWWB's comparisons are inadequate. The criminals and villains are not a coherent army, they are a mob comprised of violently rioting opportunists and a few people who actually know what's going in. Hot Rod was punished for his attack, he's being suffocated to death as we speak. Sonja is about to be slammed into dust but as that would kill a PC, it didn't immediately happen. And Agnes was almost killed as well I in fact had to use a NPC to remind her that she shouldn't be there because she almost got killed by a giant monster. Zenith and his team are all the heavy-hitters and it was part of their plan to distract the horde so that the rest of the League could engage, it's a high risk plan but they carefully weighed the risks against the benefits, that's the difference between what they did and what Abe did. The villains did in fact anticipate a counter-attack see undead, artificial, demon army and magical wet blanket for that.

3) I explicitly said the VTOLs only fired on the horde of monsters or on people who were trying to fly away. Next-gen transports with advanced weaponry would be pretty accurate enough to do the job. I never said Zenith was the most powerful man on Earth and besides he's not even fighting in there anyway, he's out on an open field. Yes superheroes and supervillains duking it out would cause collateral damage. There's a difference between doing it on purpose and doing it accidentally. Of course, there's a rule against killing innocents. It's called reckless endangerment and people get locked the hell up for it, superhumans aren't exempt. I made it clear in Killjoy's sheet that she was supposed to be willfully avoiding civilian casualties so as to work within the story. And there's nothing in Cordella's sheet to suggest she'd wantonly endanger innocents, the opposite actually given all her moralizing about the little people. Killing innocents because you don't care is as bad as executing people when they aren't a threat, much different than accidentally causing casualties or killing somebody in combat. You're not an antihero if you purposefully endanger civilians with no regard for their safety and get them killed. You're a villain.

4) Part of the reason for shutting it down was precisely because of the common room scene, It's been said to me that I should have intervened much earlier instead of letting it play out into a chaotic mess that made everyone look like a massive asshole. I've stated before that any kind of non-combat scene shouldn't have too many people from now on and I'm making it clear now that if anything happens to derail the story for no reason I have to intervene. Note this is for things that happen for no reason. Like the common room scene which basically resulted in nothing happening that changed the plot in any significant way while making things into a mess. However I'm not saying this is the same as Leonerdo's post and I do maintain that a large degree of freedom is important but there will be some things that have to remain in order to have enough structure to proceed. From now on I will explicitly discuss these kinds of things. I had allowed Leonerdo to remain in the restaurant because I felt asking him to be cut out would have allowed less freedom but again this is the kind of thing that we need to communicate about in the future. And I'm not sure what your complaint about the common room scene is since you seem to both use it as a good thing and a grievance, but I will say again that Agnes was clearly punished for her actions and I'm pretty sure nobody brushed it off.

5) Again he took out two of them. Repeat. Two. Two who were meant to show up later and be more trouble but it actually paid off in someway. Also I'm not sure anything in Abe's sheet makes it in-character for him to make himself look like an ass and get arrested for causing innocents to die. Also I find saving the hostages seems to be a secondary concern IC wise to Abe if you're going to cite not caring about collateral damage as a character trait. Also there are all on the second floor and still aren't going anywhere. Also the doors are frozen shut, nobody on the first floor is going anywhere. And I did in fact leave room for Abe because I didn't freeze him in a solid block. I can tell you know that he was like King Bumi he could have moved all the brick with his face, caved in Shrieker's and Permafrosts' heads in, and probably used some rock nearby to break the ice if he tried. Or he could have bided his time. Also the phaser and the acrobat woman are two separate characters. However I do see your point about limiting his options

6) Now both of your concerns about the rest of the fight, on reflection I find them to be perfectly fair. I do see how shutting down the scene immediately is a problem and I do apologize for that and resolve to not make the same mistake again in the future. As such if you wish I'll edit the Maroni's scene back to where Abe did his attack and go from there. Like I said in the future if there's somethings I need to remain static for some plot coherence I will make it explicitly clear and communicate this with all of you. And I will again make all efforts to preserve the player freedom I promised you all. Also let's use hiders if we're going to write essays.

Repost

[Heat]

Killshade's theme song.

[MrDidact]

The Founding Themes

[Leonerdo]

Response to MrDidact

1) I can see how it can be interpreted that way, but neither has it been said that the floor began crumbling from Abe's position. I hit a rut at that point where a particular word was not coming to mind. His foot hit the ground, and his control of the bricks stretched out towards the five where they were. The attack was explicitly describe as the floor falling beneath their feet. "The bricks and stone of the floor and its support beneath the five upstairs was deconstructed and fell apart..." Regardless, it may have not been described clearly enough, so perhaps we may both be in error.

2) I have very little to talk about concerning this since much of it does not concern me (and is a response mainly in accord to HWWB). However, while the villains anticipated a counter-attack, they created a shield outside of the restaurant anticipating League heroes. A random customer with some stones, though? Pardon the pun.

3) I am going to argue Zenith by saying he is a Superman copy. Regardless whether or not he is the strongest man on Earth, he is easily the most powerful character within the roleplay. Nigh god-like. You also already made a comment on Abe's remarkable disregard for collateral damage - which in comparison to the jail fight, it is insignificant. And people also get locked up for terrorist threats and vandalism and so on, but that was dealt with by someone rolling their eyes and issuing good old fashioned "go to your room" grounding. As for villainry, it's a subjective subject. Yeah, putting an innocent at risk is obviously a shitty thing to do and I'd definitely hate Abraham should I ever meet him in person. That's his character. He's ambiguous - he fights crime because he hates criminals with a passion, not to save lives. That makes a huge gray area to be explored. And the way Abraham was played in the past, his allegiance was always tricky to identify. Obviously it is to himself, but I am talking terms in alignment. Some scenes, he's a noble hero. Other scenes ruthless villain. And it always changes in the perspective of different characters. But Abe knows what he wants and is true to his goals. Regardless of Abe's character, what has that to do with what was done to deal with him? Do you feel his personality justifies your post to a degree? Because that doesn't make sense.

4) This makes me feel suspicious. You shut it down because of what happened before... but just a couple posts ago, you explained that you did it based on what you thought was logical and admitted you were hasty. I don't understand, which is true? Because just now you made it sound like shutting it down straight away was by all means intentional while the older explanation sounds like it was bad judgement. As for allowing me to stay in the restaurant, presenting him as a customer as well as instigating a fight was all in the same post. You make it sounds like you allowed one thing, but the other was uncalled for. I even asked you, and you said the post was okay. I was told it was okay to stay in the restaurant, but received no warning that acting the way he did would prompt a very blind-sighting response from you. HWWB's complaint with the common room scene was that a bomb threat was taken uncharacteristically calm and that it was an even greater Leeroy tactic than what Abe did (bringing and setting explosives with super-power justice center) - and Agnes walked away with nothing more than a slap on the wrist whereas Abraham was instantly knocked unconscious. Literally everyone brushed it off except for Cordelia and Volt. Those are the only ones I can think of that reacted realistically.

5) I don't understand how taking out two faceless NPCs is a consolation for eliminating my ability to write spontaneously. I repeat again that his personality should have no bearing on how you handle the post aside from what the character's derive from him or how the characters decide to react against headstrong actions (the action wasn't even blunt, it was subtle) - and the villains don't know Abe or his personality. Also, thank you so much for not automatically freezing Abe solid and instead automatically putting him in agonizing pain, getting kicked in the face and knocked out cold (which is something that HWWB covered in his last post) and waking up tied up with guns pointed at his head. I can feel your mercy.

6)In any case, yes, an edit would be much appreciated so that we can proceed appropriately (where I'm not locked up and unable to do anything by a forced scenario). I agree that we should all attempt more constant and clearer communication between the participants and GM. I hope we can maintain this communication and future player freedom.

[Archmage MC]

Leo, hiders don't work with quotes, just an FYI

[Leonerdo]

Thanks mate. I'll keep that in mind.

[Mixtape Ghost N]

MrDidact said
Mr Allen J, That was in response to your query about the actual hostage situation in Maroni's.

I thought you were talking about the prison. My mistake.

[TheBiddz]

So I have to ask, I know there's gonna be character development, with our characters growing stronger as the RP goes on, with stronger villains to match. Hoooooooow is that gonna work?

[Mixtape Ghost N]

TheBiddz said
So I have to ask, I know there's gonna be character development, with our characters growing stronger as the RP goes on, with stronger villains to match. Hoooooooow is that gonna work?

Our enemies will take heavy dosages of badassid.

[MrDidact]

Response

1) I feel then we are both wrong here because stomping the ground should have some pretty noteworthy effects. If he wanted to fine control some stones you could just have him hide his hand under the table and move them that way.

2) Fair enough, and I did try to portray how they were taken off guard but how a few them were quick enough on reflex to avoid it.

3) He's a framing device, a reflection of the RP, he's not meant to be a PC. The roleplay is contingent on what the PCs do along with how the NPCs interact with them. The whole point of having him fight the monsters is to allow the players to decide how the Prison scenario unfolds. Also there's nothing about him that is nigh God-like. He's powerful, but frankly quite a few of the NPCs and Villains I've made up can fight him and even kill him. The higher-level PCs could probably give him a drubbing if they were smart enough about it. The scale of the damage in the Prison fight doesn't excuse anything Abe does in a crowded restaurant filled with people when he has other choices. If you fight a villain and somebody dies because of an honest mistake it's different. But in the eyes of the law when an Officer's actions result in the citizens he's sworn to protect dying because of an intentional disregard for their safety, he's done a serious crime. It's no different for Superheroes. Sure it could be part of his character not to care, but isn't also in-character for him to want to avoid being implicated for a crime or have his reputation besmirched? None of it is based on what I think of a character's personality. Because frankly I hate Cordella and If I wanted to I could have Emily bitch-slap her to death but I don't because that'd be bad GMing and another mistake I don't wish to make.

4) Neither is mutually exclusive, the one and the other fit hand in hand. On the one hand I don't want a situation to get out of control. On the other hand at the time I thought it to be a stupid action and what followed to be a logical conclusion. I do still own up to my hastiness. I did in fact talk about my concerns about civilians and the fact there was someone who could imprison him, but I admit I wasn't explicit which I have said I will change. And on the whole terrorism/vandalism thing, sure it was dumb but that's overplaying the scale of Agnes's actions and downplaying her punishment. You don't get kicked out and sentenced for pulling a dumb prank, because that's what it was. A poorly thought out prank. It was like if I threw those little firecrackers at somebody else. Confiscating all her materials, putting her under escort, and restricting her from sensitive areas and social contact is hardly a slap on the wrist. If individual members decide to get mad it's their choice, but if the organization decides to be lenient it's not a plot hole. My NPC even had a full speech about why she acted the way she did, but of course the PCs could still react the way they did. And the NPC even admitted IC that it was a mistake to let the scene proceed, which was a reflection of my own acknowledgement of the fact. Emily did in fact act realistically as somebody whose job is to try and get all the outcasts to fit in and overlook the eccentricities. I can't both allow characters to have moral lapses and then disproportionately punish them for the most minor of offenses.

5) There will be situations where your options are limited because of the choices you made. This however is a poor example of that as I have repeatedly said. See above for character personalities. The villains made conjecture that was in-character. Well I thought it to be a blunt action because of Number 1. I've stated before that I made a mistake, but honestly Hot Rod was being suffocated at the same time and had even less choice to do anything so it's not as if I single out Abe.

If it's alright with you I'll proceed as if a giant trail was made and then Abe can fight the three who are left, as well as any reinforcements they may have. If you wish to discuss this further we should take it to PMs because I personally feel in my opinion, it's relevance to the other players has now been discussed. I reiterate my hopes for clearer communication and freedom within reason.

Mr Allen J, Not at all I have to be more clear about these things.

TheBiddz, You'll just have to see. I can say the threats get bigger but then so do your Characters.

[Mixtape Ghost N]

Should I edit my post? I could just change it so that she keeps hammering at the spooky monsters.

[MrDidact]

Well she could send the bugs to scope out the place, see what the situation is like and I'll respond with what she sees on a cursory examination. Because it's a big place, largest prison in the country apparently, so there's only so much she can see in one post.

[Mixtape Ghost N]

Edited my last post, she's now only scanning. You also have to consider the creepy crawlies already in the prison.

[TheBiddz]

MrDidact said
TheBiddz, You'll just have to see. I can say the threats get bigger but then so do your Characters.

Auuuugh, but waiting patiently is my one true weakness!

[LeeRoy]

Hey, hey Didact. Are you on Skype? I need to ask a couple questions.

[MrDidact]

Edited. And will probably have a reply up in the morning.

[Polyphemus]

Oh, we're doing themes?

Sixgun.