War is hell, a possible realistic Vietnam War roleplay? (+18)

[Jaredthefox92]

One important part of American history, and also a very tragic and sad part as well, is the Vietnam War. This war was fought between the forces of Communism and the forces of capitalism, as well as with the Vietnamese people. I thought it would be an interesting idea to do a roleplay of historical and non-fiction setting based around this bloody and tiring war. My idea was characters could be from any of the factions, (not just USA and the Vietcong), but others. They all fight to survive and for their countries. However, this will be a realistic mature roleplay. Characters will die, characters will suffer. As stated in the title, war is hell.

[HeySeuss]

What timeframe within the Vietnam War?

@Gunther @Byrd Man

[CaptainBritton]

Consider me interested.

[Jaredthefox92]

What timeframe within the Vietnam War?

@Gunther @Byrd Man

@HeySeuss

I was thinking towards the end of the war, somewhere before the fall of Saigon. Mostly to make it fair for people who are playing the Viet Cong, as American support is slowly closing for the war due to the peace movements. Of course, I can change this, but I thought it would be a nifty way to balance out the fact one side has jets and helicopters.

[Jaredthefox92]

Consider me interested.

@CaptainBritton

Alrighty.

[Gunther]

Interested. @Jaredthefox92If you have any questions about this period in American history, please ask.

Late in the war, US soldiers were wearing subdued patches, the M203 Grenade Launcher had replaced the iconic M79 and the US Army Rifle squad had reduced in size from 11 men to 9. The USMC rifle squad had reduced in size from 16 to 13. The Automatic Rifleman carried an M16A1 rifle with a bipod and extra ammo; firing on full auto all the time. You cannot say drug use was exactly rampant because in those units where esprit d'corp and strong leadership were available, drug use was non-existent. I know the US media likes to portray all americans serving in Southeast Asia as being drug users, but that is simply not true. This may have been true in REMF units, but not as much in front line combat units. REMF = Rear Echelon Mother Fuckers or POG = Personnel Other than Grunts.

[Gunther]

Hello @CaptainBritton, @HeySeuss and @Byrd Man. Ruck up, lock and load!

[HeySeuss]

Depending on the time period, SOG is still running Shining Brass, and getting more blatant about the air campaign in Laos. Could also play an LDNN or Montagnard Mike Force advisor in addition to one of the RT's.

I'm not sure that Vietnam was ever a 'fair' fight in terms of firepower parity, but it was a very frustrating fight in that the enemy dictated the operational tempo in many cases. But if you're looking for a different perspective, I'd argue for the early 1960's before the US massively deployed combat troops there. You had a very different war where the capability of the enemy led to that deployment in the first place.

I'm good with whatever path it takes though.

[Jaredthefox92]

Interested. @Jaredthefox92If you have any questions about this period in American history, please ask.

Late in the war, US soldiers were wearing subdued patches, the M203 Grenade Launcher had replaced the iconic M79 and the US Army Rifle squad had reduced in size from 11 men to 9. The USMC rifle squad had reduced in size from 16 to 13. The Automatic Rifleman carried an M16A1 rifle with a bipod and extra ammo; firing on full auto all the time. You cannot say drug use was exactly rampant because in those units where esprit d'corp and strong leadership were available, drug use was non-existent. I know the US media likes to portray all americans serving in Southeast Asia as being drug users, but that is simply not true. This may have been true in REMF units, but not as much in front line combat units. REMF = Rear Echelon Mother Fuckers or POG = Personnel Other than Grunts.

@Gunther

Okay, I'm fairly knowledgeable about some things, but I won't forget to ask when needed.

I see, well I was considering we implement some balance changes. Maybe an airstrike or two happens with the plot or something, just to even out the battles a bit. Then again, it depends on how many people want to play the communist aligned forces in the roleplay.If everyone wants to be the western alliances then things will be different.

[Jaredthefox92]

Depending on the time period, SOG is still running Shining Brass, and getting more blatant about the air campaign in Laos. Could also play an LDNN or Montagnard Mike Force advisor in addition to one of the RT's.

I'm not sure that Vietnam was ever a 'fair' fight in terms of firepower parity, but it was a very frustrating fight in that the enemy dictated the operational tempo in many cases. But if you're looking for a different perspective, I'd argue for the early 1960's before the US massively deployed combat troops there. You had a very different war where the capability of the enemy led to that deployment in the first place.

I'm good with whatever path it takes though.

@HeySeuss

I see.

I know that, I really meant "relatively fair". I mean, this is not a war the west won, despite all the firepower it brought into the war. Yeah, I could also go for pre-involvement, or at least to where there's relatively few G.I's on the ground. Then again, it all depends on how many want to play for each side.

[Gunther]

Vietnam is a war that was lost at home, not in the jungles of Vietnam. Most engagements the US were involved in, they won. The US won the battles, but the NVA won the war. It was simply unpopular because the American People viewed it as a revolution between the North and the South. The US government viewed it as a war of containment regarding communism; this is following the McCarthy era.

Honestly, bud. I would prefer US troops. You pick the fight, It is your RP. Do you want all of us in one squad (difficult) to manage and always seems to fail, or would you prefer we all take on different roles in very different organizations? That would hinder collaboration, but enable folks to employ much more creativity in their writing.

[CaptainBritton]

I'd prefer US forces as well, though I wouldn't complain if we ended up as ARVN or ANZAC. Just don't expect me to be happy about being a commie if we are forced to be VC or NVA.

[Gunther]

Oooh! I once read a book on an Australian Battalion sent to Vietnam. They were badass. I have very little memory of it. It was a very long time ago--35 - 40 years. I recall they had a high elan, similar to USMC units, 101st ABN, LRRPs or 173rd ABN. I do remember a description of a ROK (Republic of Korea) unit operating in South Vietnam. If a soldier fell asleep on guard duty, the sergeant of the guard was expected to execute the offending soldier on the spot. ROK soldiers were/are Rock hard!. When I was a Battalion staff officer, we had this young 2LT of Korean descent from California. His grandfather had served in an airborne unit in Vietnam with the ROK army. The 2LT told us, his grandfather had to complete 100 jumps in order to earn his parachutist badge in the ROK Army. He laughed at American paratroopers who only needed 5 jumps.

[golani]

It was probably 6 Royal Australian Regiment...and the Battle for Long Tan plantation...The Kiwis sent troops to Vietnam as part of Australian deployments, Victor or Whisky Company if I recall.

I am kind of a historian about Australia's deployments to Vietnam. I'm such a geek, I have copies of the real post battle reports from Long Tan from the American National Archives. Shoot, while traveling overseas several years ago, I MET an Australian Vietnam veteran who served in 6 RAR during the war. He was shocked I knew anything about Australia deploying troops to Vietnam.

Don't forget the ANZACS had SAS in Vietnam as well...and not nearly as much firepower on tap as the U.S. forces.

Consider me interested.

[Jaredthefox92]

Vietnam is a war that was lost at home, not in the jungles of Vietnam. Most engagements the US were involved in, they won. The US won the battles, but the NVA won the war. It was simply unpopular because the American People viewed it as a revolution between the North and the South. The US government viewed it as a war of containment regarding communism; this is following the McCarthy era.

Honestly, bud. I would prefer US troops. You pick the fight, It is your RP. Do you want all of us in one squad (difficult) to manage and always seems to fail, or would you prefer we all take on different roles in very different organizations? That would hinder collaboration, but enable folks to employ much more creativity in their writing.

@Gunther

That's true.

Sort of the second, mostly because everyone in a single squad would make it sort of a Band of Brothers story, and I had the idea of playing both sides to feel the conflict from either perspectives of the war. As far as collaboration, you're really supposed to play who you pick. Americans act like Americans did, Vietnamese at like they did, if you're South Korean you're there for support, ect. This isn't going to be a "I can be a hero and save the day" story, so as far as collaboration issues there's not many things one can get wrong, unless they want to be an arse and totally mock history. (Which will be dealt with soon after for trying to ruin a historical RP where people fought and died for their perspective countries and ideals in history.) So, I was thinking of having limited freedom, as long as people play their roles.

[Jaredthefox92]

It was probably 6 Royal Australian Regiment...and the Battle for Long Tan plantation...The Kiwis sent troops to Vietnam as part of Australian deployments, Victor or Whisky Company if I recall.

I am kind of a historian about Australia's deployments to Vietnam. I'm such a geek, I have copies of the real post battle reports from Long Tan from the American National Archives. Shoot, while traveling overseas several years ago, I MET an Australian Vietnam veteran who served in 6 RAR during the war. He was shocked I knew anything about Australia deploying troops to Vietnam.

Don't forget the ANZACS had SAS in Vietnam as well...and not nearly as much firepower on tap as the U.S. forces.

Consider me interested.

@golani

Alright, we can possibly have those soldiers in this as well. (Maybe some sort of combined-operation?) I was thinking that while we have various real life sides, (like if anyone wants to be a Chinese advisor or a South Korean advisor), both sides would have to work together. (Makes sense, and worked well in Operation Overlord.) Just, if you play those guys please try to work in the roles. There probably wouldn't be some argument over who does what unless somehow orders got mixed up, but that predicament pretty much would probably not be the case that ANZACS or SAS forces would just not know the American forces nearby. It's not like in WW2 so we don't have various generals with all sorts of different orders from all the nations at once. Thus things would be well more manageable if it were the case.

[HeySeuss]

Advisors and liaisons are pretty common fare for Vietnam. Advising the ARVN airborne division was a big deal, SF raised Montagnard troops in the Central Highlands/Laotian border, there were other ethnic minority (Hmong, Nung, Khmer, etc) forces similarly raised by SF, the Marines were working with CIDG's to pump up regional/local security in the I Corps region and the SEALs, later on, were working with the LDNN's.

That doesn't even encompass SOG operations in Cambodia and Laos where the on-the-ground recon was conducted by mixed teams in places where they weren't supposed to be or the Phoenix Program, which had advisors directing Vietnamese 'mercenaries' to eliminate VC infiltration of the RVN government.

There was a similar degree of fluidity between where the advising stops and the operational control starts in the VNAF as well.

Here's a thought in determining things; work out the region of Vietnam and the time period. The border with the North is a very different animal than the Mekong Delta, which is different from the Central Highlands and so forth. From there, we have a much better idea of what the force mix might look like, since ROK and ANZAC forces, for example, operated in two very different spheres.

[Gunther]

Here's a thought in determining things; work out the region of Vietnam and the time period. The border with the North is a very different animal than the Mekong Delta, which is different from the Central Highlands and so forth. From there, we have a much better idea of what the force mix might look like, since ROK and ANZAC forces, for example, operated in two very different spheres.

@HeySeuss

Suggest Central Highlands 1967.

[HeySeuss]

I think I'll definitely work on the concept of playing an advisor to the ARVN or the VNAF. Early or late war, this is a going concern. Mid-war, it's much more of an American-focus on the ground combat because US forces did the heavy lifting. The VNAF is sidelined late war, as the USN and USAF bring heavier and heavier support options. Depending on the region, the mix of airpower can get very interesting, especially in battles like Ia Drang Valley, where everything was routed over to dump down on the Main Force Viet Cong positions.

I always liked the movie "Bat 21" because it impressed on me just how brave it is to rescue a downed pilot in enemy territory and what utter heroes those crews are and I want to take my writing in that direction for this. Same thing with the kind of guys that made resupply runs for the Air Cav or at Khe Sanh.

So I might play a mix of Forward Observer officers, pilots of airlift, resupply and combat aircraft and, depending on the region, this could involve naval gunfire as well.

Assuming this all works for you @Jaredthefox92, I am just brainstorming my thoughts here.

[Gunther]

Same thing with the kind of guys that made resupply runs for the Air Cav or at Khe Sanh.

So I might play a mix of Forward Observer officers, pilots of airlift, resupply and combat aircraft and, depending on the region, this could involve naval gunfire as well.

Assuming this all works for you @Jaredthefox92, I am just brainstorming my thoughts here.

@HeySeuss

I was considering doing something with the 173rd Airborne Brigade. 1st & 2nd Battalions, 503rd PIR made the one and only combat jump of the Vietnam War at Dak To in 1967. I'm not interested in recreating the jump. But I will take 1st Battalion, 503rd PIR and use their assets to support your intentions. I could use a company or two to conduct area ambushes in an attempt to prevent the PAVN forces from finding your downed pilot. I could even use the 173rd LRRS-D to operate within close vicinity of the pilot to help cordon off the area and be prepared to conduct the actual rescue; assuming these "Sky Soldiers" don't get put into a position where they are the ones in need of rescuing. LOL