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  • Old Guild Username: Kadaeux Architect of Fates, Forger of Universes, Slayer of the Weak, Overlord of Overlords.
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    1. Kadaeux 11 yrs ago

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xAsunaWolfx said Science or Faith?

Both have facts.


No. Stop right there.

Faith does not have facts.
Shy said Intelligent Design - the belief that evolution DOES exist (certainly on a micro scale though macro is under debate) but there are things such as "irreducibly complex cells" that could not have possibly developed by themselves. This theory does not imply a Christian God, simply a designer of some sort (some scientists have claimed aliens). This is based PURELY ON EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE, not any sort of religious text. While a smaller chunk of scientists than the Evolutionist belief, there is still a significant amount of scientists who have this belief.


I'm sure you have purely empirical evidence that a significant amount of scientists have that belief. And more specifically. RELEVANT scientists. Specifically scientists in the relevant fields. Since there are fields of science where said scientists need not be any more aware of evolutionary principles than anyone else.

No, in most cases Intelligent Design "scientists" actually ARE creationists trying to bury the obviousness of their biases. They often compact things into scientific psuedobabble, cherry-pick their results and so on. THAT is why Intelligent Design "Science" is becoming as ridiculed as explicit Creationists, because the majority population of the "Intelligent Design" movement ARE mostly creationists.
Bestine System: Sarace Khen Athan meets Tohkran.


Sarace sat down on the Divan that served as the unconventional command seat of the Aetherius Primus, and while he had great respect for the authority of command he also was of the great opinion that one didn't have to be uncomfortable to command. Indeed, his people often commented that his bridge was the most comfortable in the galaxy. Indeed, the Aetherius Primus, while very functional, was built with a degree of comfort in mind. Though he didn't admit to anyone that the 'Meditation Chamber' was just a rephrasing of Massage Parlour. The fact he had some twilek masseuses on retainer had nothing to do with his meditation.

But he'd been travelling in receipt of this strange message to the Bestine System and they were about to.... suddenly there was the juddering of deceleration ... make that, just had, emerged from hyperspace within. The eight worlds and sixty-nine moons were nothing too unexpected, though he was personally homing in on the origin point of the message. A moon orbiting Bestine IV.

"Engage the communications array. Signal reads. 'This is Sarace Khen Athan, CEO of Athan Enterprises. Connoiseur of some very old arts and recipient of a transmission that says the resident governor of this moon might share the same interests.'" Sarace ordered and the man operating the communciations console relayed the recorded sequence to the target moon.

Saya cocked her head. "Isn't that just a little bit vague?"

"Given the galaxy's opinion of our kind, caution never hurts. Navigation, keep the Hyperdrive powered and ready to escape at a moments notice. Shields on 10% standby mode."
Sarace ordered.

Thrall looked at the message and nodded, "Yep, this is something beard face wants to know, relay it to him personally." He said to the communications officer and then turned to one of the others, "Inform the rest of the fleet to inconspiciously fly over here and closer to our new guest." A wookiee crew member yelped something and Thrall rolled his eyes. "How should I know? Tell them to fly casually or something!"

Meanwhile on the surface Tohkran was listening to the relayed message and nodded, activating the comm terminal in his office. He was still wearing what his friend still called 'the monkey suit' and hailed the vessel. "Greetings, I am Tohkran Disonic, of the Disonic Corporation, mister Athan, how nice of you to accept my invitation. I had heard about your fondness for certain old arts and may have a few... objects that hold mutual interest. I would be happy to invite you to the planet's surface."
Sarace frowned as his sensor operator spoke up. "Sir, we have ships 'flying casual' in our rough general direction."

"Weapons hold." He ordered as he frowned. They weren't on a hostile vector, but this was hardly unexpected. "But bring them to readiness power, but don't engage in any weapon locks unless they do." He took over from the comms officer. "I'd be very interested in accepting your invitation, though your defences aren't inspiring a lot of confidence, they do know that highly armed ships don't do casual very well, right?"
Tohkran looked genuinly surprised, "Excuse me?" He frowned and then sighed, holding up a finger. "One moment." He did not end the call with his guest while he opened a second line to Thrall. "My good friend, if you were worried for my safety, please don't bother and send the ships back on their regular patrol schedule please."

Thrall blinked and seemed to study his hands. "I have no idea what you are talking about beard face..." He started humming.

"Thrall... I am on call right now with my guest, who I invited, whose safety is my responsibility since he is my guest and I don't want him to feel threatened."

The Sluissi blinked and sheepishly replied. "Ah... oh... it's, yeah ok I get it. Sorry beard face." With that he terminated the call. And shrotly after that the ships returned to original courses.

Tohkran sighed, leaning back and rubbed his temple. "My apologies, he is a good friend but somewhat protective of me, a landing pad is cleared for a shuttlecraft at my compound."
"Many thanks. I find my confidence that we can do business somewhat restored. I'll be there shortly with a small contingent of my crew in a Shorien class Shuttle." Sarace remarked.

Heading for Hangar A-1 Sarace put out the call over the intercom. "Rorken, Ssark, Lleyan and Saya to Hangar A-1, Saya, bring two units of Trianii commandos with you. First impressions and all that." Climbing into the craft it didn't take long for Saya to pilot the shuttle down to the surface alighting lightly on the landing pad within the compound with a sultry grin.

"So, who we meeting." She asked.

"Tohkran Disonic, or so he claims. Politeness tempered with paranoia is readiness, and be ready." Sarace said as he hit the ramp release and walked down.

Tohkran was waiting a number of Cathar and Kiffu with him, although the latter dispersed soon after, resuming their patrols aroudn the compound, leaving him with only a token squad of Cathar warriors. He made a stiff bow, leaning on his cane. "Welcome to Bestine Minor, my home and place of business." He said while subtly trying to sense the force potential of his guests, blinking when he sensed a great deal of potential in four of them, most importantly in his main guest. He was using his own concealment to hide most of his force presence he focused on his guest, armoured he saw and wearing two interesting items on his belt, "I ca nsee already that you may have a interest in what I have." He said, gesturing to the lightsabers on his belt.

Sarace smiled a sort of half-cocked grin. "Indeed, though you shouldn't restrain yourself like that, you might pull a muscle." He chuckled. "Though I do hope those aren't of a somewhat reddish hue, I find the owners of those tend to be churlish and disinclined to peaceful solutions."

He rose an eyebrow, gesturing to the Cathar to remain calm he unscrewed the top of his cane loose and ignited his yellow blade. "Yours?"

Sarace took his blades and ignited them and signalled his people to do the same. In all instances the blades were a rich white in colour. "I find white has a rich purity about it." Shutting down his blades he returns them to his belt. "It's a pleasure to meet you Tohkran." Sarace said holding one hand extended.

He turned his lightsaber off and returned it to the top of his cane, taking the hand and shook it. "And you, Sarace. Well then if we can dispense with the cloak and dagger rituals. Welcome to my small sanctuary." He gestured to the Cathar, "I think things will be fine now, thanks." Turning back to Sarace he gestured to one of the buildings. "I suggest we head inside, get a drink and talk, shall we?"

"That sounds like a fine idea." Sarace reached back and took something from one of the Commandos. "Indeed, I brought a fine Corellian Brandy procured from my trade routes for the occasion. Of course, I brought them in case it turned out less friendly, do you have somewhere my men and women can mingle with your own in the meantime, guarding shuttles inspires boredom and boredom inspires mischief and mischief inspires unhappy security chiefs." He chuckled.

Tohkran thought for a moment, "Well in that direction." He pointed. "Are the training grounds for my people, my Cathar here can show your people and they can freely mingle there, noticed you had some Trianii with you, I have some in my employ as well who are currently on the surface who would no doubt like to interact with more of their kind. That would suffice I imagine... though best to stay away from the area that is warded off with signs saying 'wild beasts' they aren't exactly wild but rather very protective of certain things close to that area."

"Ah. A special enclosure to house your accountants." Sarace remarked with a grind. "Well, you heard the man, you can go mingle, you two guard the shuttle, precautionary, you'll be rotated out in thirty minutes." Sarace said his tone turned authoritarian. "Anyone too inebriated to fight by the time we make our leave of our host here will be conscripted to cleaning the sewage outflows of the factories back home. Am I clear?" Sarace remarked. They all nodded and went off to socialise. "They're a good bunch, trustworthy, but they need guidance from time to time."

"I suppose so, I somewhat more relaxed I guess, as seen with your initial welcome, my friend in orbit who was a bit too protective perhaps." He said as he walked with his guest and eventually entered the building, a smaller mess hall that was currently empty, taking a seat in a lounge area of the mess hall, sighing as he let his leg rest. "Apologies." He tapped one of his legs with a clunk sound. "One leg lost, the other filled with cyberentics. But welcome it is somewhat difficult to find another jedi in this day and age."

"It is good to be welcomed. As you say, we are a rare breed these days, a situation made worse by the Republic's virtual institutionalised ignoring of incidents against force users, or the standing bounty on our heads. A policy that the CIS seemed to have adopted." Sarace sighed. "But with a galaxy at war perhaps there is the potential to turn that around."

"Yes... I hope to see the day that we once again can just reveal ourselves openly without people seeing a credit number over our heads." He asked for a number of glasses and then placed the mon a table between himself and his guest. "I had gathered soem signs you were one of us and figured a invitation was needed to confirm my suspicions, I am glad they have."

"Truly, if it had been a hunter you'd have had your hands full, though given what i've seen I expect you're no easier to attack directly than I." Sarace said pouring a measure of Corellian Brandy and signalling to Tohkran if he'd like some.

"Oh yes, I have some defenses in place to keep my interests and people safe." He raised his glass for Sarace to fill and then took a sip, nodding. "Good brandy, but then it is Corellian after all. But yes, I am actually in contact with some other jedi on occasion, we do not stay together in one place, for safety naturally."

Sarace relaxed at the fiery sensation as he took a mouthful of the strong drink. "Naturally, especially since the Sith play their own hands too, I even heard through the grapevine that there was both Sith and Jedi at Anaxes when... well I'm not quite sure what it was... happened."

Tohkran rose a eyebrow, "You heard about that? Yes... it was a mess... I was there but encountered no sith. It was a disturbing place and I am glad to see it gone and that it was reportedly destroyed by both Republic CIS forces in the area, though there is no conclusive proof for it."

"The rumour mill was full of the Anaxes battle for days, it is beyond strange that it kept as nothing but rumour though. Nobody seems to be able to offer any insights into the fate of whatever that ship was. Regardless, it is a strange time. And I find my position remaining quiet, building up my industry and forces and helping when there can be no evidence of my aid is no longer sufficient. I won't choose between CIS or Republic. And yet action must be taken. I find myself at a loss as to what." Sarace said with some remorse.

He shrugged, "I am in a republic system and recently accepted a rather risky Republic military contract. Some of us feel that perhaps by developing contacts in the governments we can, with time, influence politics or public favour into accepting us once again. I admit I am somewhat supportive of the Republic's effort, others... not so much."

Sarace nodded, "Yes, I inhabit a system nominally CIS, though their presence is mere token, I doubt that a serious effort by the Republic would be challenged by the CIS. But I can't support a government that supported four centuries of prejudice." Sarace took another mouthful of drink. "Though I can certainly help friends."

"Well that settles my question if you were itnerested in meeting with other jedi, with what I ahve heard so far, that would be a yes? You do strike me as a warrior more than a business man I must admit."

Sarace nodded. "I am, I take on those more martial jobs who's causes fit what I believe are good ones. The unfortunate so often fail to have a strong hand to protect them. I strive to be that strong hand where I can." Leaning back Sarace relaxed a bit. "As for meeting other Jedi, certainly. While we must be apart for safety and securty, we are strongest together."

He nods, "Indeed, it is up to my friends and collegues however if they wish to meet you. So perhaps, with your permission I can give the myour contact details and they can make their own introductions. I can however give you the name and location of a person who is a friend to us but not a jedi herself."

"I'll allow it, and I might be interested in meeting your friend." Sarace looked over his shoulder as Saya came in. "What is it Saya?" He said fondly putting a hand on her waist.

"Soldat, uhm, how am I going to phrase this...." She seemed hesitant. "He uhm, fell down the stairs..... and died."

"Well shit..." Sarace said dejectedly.

Tohkran coughed in the middle of a sip, slapping his chest in a coughing fit. "Excuse me?"

"Well contrary to popular belief heads aren't meant to turn around that far..." Saya remarked.

Tohkran looked horrorfied, "I... well , my apologies for the loss." He seemed shaken at his and cleaned his face. "I... sorry my thought process was somewhat interupted, but yes. This friend is quite the face in busines circles, Neia Kahleesi, she is based on a station called the Nova Retreat in the Kwenn System. Just tell her you are a friend of me and she'll know what that means."

"Please don't tell me she's a funeral director as well." Sarace said... "Saya. This is an ill tiding, I want you to go and take Soldat's body back to the shuttle, recall our people." Sarace turned to Tohkran. "This was.... entirely unexpected...."

"I'd say... not the kind of thing I'd imagined or hoped for when we would meet." Tohkran said still somewhat shaken. "I, my apologies, I never knew the stairs on my compoudn were that dangerous..."

"They probably aren't. Soldat was probably trying to show off with some stunt." Sarace replied. "He was known for somewhat less than intelligent action."

"Well not the end-note I was hoping for, still, I hope that meeting a new jedi with the prospect of more in the future are still a good tidings for us both." He said standing up to show his guests out.

"I agree, feel free to call on me if you have need in the future, but for now it seems I have a funeral to arrange." Sarace said with some remorse.

He nodded silently and walked his guests back to the shuttle launch pad, speaking up before Sarace would leave. "If you have a need, feel free to call on me as well if I can in any means offer assistance."

"Farewell Tohkran. And may the force be with you." Sarace bowed deeply and backed onto the shuttle as the last of his men and women climbed aboard. It lifting moments afterwards.
Protagonist said
In my opinion, immortality is a bit underrated. There's actually quite a few perks that people tend to forget about when it comes to immorality. It's basically the opposite of being terminally ill. As for the issue of love, I'd agree with dervish to an extent. Time heals all things, so you'd eventually get over your deceased loved ones.l and go on to meet new people.


No no, Immorality is much more fun. :p
xAsunaWolfx said *snip*


Did you pick that Knights icon for the start of the thread title in order to represent the dead horse we'll all be beating on?
Gat said
Hatred, no. Contempt maybe.Let me ask you a related question mate; Are you Pro-Abortion?If the answer is yes then I suppose I see where you're coming from, you simply don't place the same value on life as Kad any myself. Life is the most precious 'commodity' so to speak on the planet becuase one its ended you can never get it back. As has also been stated in the thread many times, the majority of suicides never try to seek help, they keep it all bottled up until they snap and off themselves. Oh sure others have brought up that they cant get help becuase parents etc don't want to hear that the person wants to commit suicide etc. but lets be frank here, how many parents want their children to die before they do, thats simple parental instinct. Despite that, at least here in the western world there are numerous options beyond parents one can seek help from. Another clarification. not all suicides are the result of depression, in addition not all supposed depression is actually a medical condition. If you had actually read the thread btw you would see that both Kad and myself agree that euthanasia is acceptable for severe quality of life effecting illnesses and conditions. Neither of us see even clinical depression as qualifying for that because you can medicate it just fine and the person can live a normal life.


QFT
K-97 said
There is not a single person (including myself) I would trust with a Death Note, it's got to be destroyed (in the most epic way possible). Who would like to join my Fellowship?


*Writes down "K-97 trips over and drowns in the Bree"*
Magic Magnum said
Death is the result of Cancer.Suicide is the result of having a mental condition. A condition which like cancer the victim has no choice over having, it is inflicted on them the exact same way.Most of the thread has already covered this, so instead of spending a long time saying the same point's again I'm just going to urge you both to go back and read the rest of the posts on the thread. Specifically the one's Jorick made. Until you've bothered catching up on said posts and the debate you're not in a position to be calling anyone an idiot or acting as if you know for a fact if you're right or wrong.


No. Suicide is not a "result of a mental condition" suicide is a result of people deciding that that condition is too much for them.

I don't "act as if I know for a fact" whether i'm right or wrong. I DO know for a fact. I suffer from severe clinical depression. I've considered suicide before, and every time discarded it as weakness.
Magic Magnum said
So next time I see someone die from Cancer I'll just blame them for not getting the right help and being to weak to fight it off.


People with cancer didn't go seek it out and go "Ima going to get me some cancer unf!"

People who commit suicide do.
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