We're going to have some Imperials trained especially for groin attacks against targets with armor everywhere except the groin then, Aristo. Thanks for making the job of exterminating the regular Constables so much easier.

We'll be back tomorrow morning. its past sleep time here.

You realize that's not true right? The advent of crossbows did not make armored knights obsolete, and in fact armored troops could have continued being used well into the are of firearms, (as the iron used was enough to block bullets if crafted well, let alone a few measly crossbow bolts) if not for the cost of maintaining such a force and the amount of necessary training. In fact, because your average Knight's armor was the highest quality available besides the king's himself, the only way a crossbowman with as little training as you describe would have been able to fell one is by landing a lucky shot in the chinks between the plates.

AlidaMaria said
Yeah I know, but when I try and click the screen away it posts again for some reason. And also when I just try to go back to the previous page, chrome states that something went wrong.. Kablam, he posts again.

Just go back to your subscriptions bookmark(Or wherever you have the guild bookmarked) then navigate back from there.

chukklehed said
You realize that's not true right? The advent of crossbows did not make armored knights obsolete, and in fact armored troops could have continued being used well into the are of firearms, (as the iron used was enough to block bullets if crafted well, let alone a few measly crossbow bolts) if not for the cost of maintaining such a force and the amount of necessary training. In fact, because your average Knight's armor was the highest quality available besides the king's himself, the only way a crossbowman with as little training as you describe would have been able to fell one is by landing a lucky shot in the chinks between the plates.

He has a point, before Kevlar came along and even after soldiers were quite often equipped with heavy plates of armour.

Sep said
Just go back to your subscriptions bookmark(Or wherever you have the guild bookmarked) then navigate back from there.He has a point, before Kevlar came along and even after soldiers were quite often equipped with heavy plates of armour.

Kevlar? Kevlar was invented in the 1960's if I'm not mistaking. Or had it already been used for centuries and only discovered in the 1960's?

Crossbows and heavy armor coexisted on the battlefield for centuries. It's all in the tactics; how you use your army and the tools at its disposal.

Ellri said
We're going to have some Imperials trained especially for groin attacks against targets with armor everywhere except the groin then, Aristo. Thanks for making the job of exterminating the regular Constables so much easier.

Funny. What did I do to offend the Empire? You realize that not all men-at-arms could afford to arm themselves with full suits of armor, and some liberties had to be taken with what they wore? Are you really going to look that far into a couple images of reenactors to get an advantage IC?

When did this become a dick-measuring contest / Nation RP?

---

Here, why don't I use another gallery image so Elliri doesn't think he/she can pull some crotch poking out of the gutter and get away with making her Imperials seem even more incredible.

Ellri said
those suits of armor are designed for horseback. They don't have armoring between the legs. If you're up on a horse, you don't need armor plating there. But if you're not on a horse (or similar animal) with those suits, you can be sure that the opposition will aim right between the legs.

Also in reference to this, you're referring to Cavelry or Jousting armor, which is only an armor used, as you said, by mounted knights. There were also, however, infantry knights and the king's guard, neither of whomever rode on horseback and so wore armor which covered the inside of their legs, not to mention knee length chain hauberks and a bajilion layers of padding underneath.

AlidaMaria said
Kevlar? Kevlar was invented in the 1960's if I'm not mistaking. Or had it already been used for centuries and only discovered in the 1960's?

That's the point. People wore iron armor in the civil war.

chukklehed said
That's the point. People wore iron armor in the civil war.

Yeah okay, sorry I'm a bit slow :') And armor is really not my forte. So I'm glad all of you guys at least know a lot about it.

Aristo, and yes Ellri also.

You guys want me to shut down this RP? I'll do it, I'm not running an RP with OOC hostility.

I don't, and would like to continue with the RP and the worldbuilding, so long as people don't get overly attached to their creations and try to make them out to be high and mighty in comparison to everything else.

I just don't get how simply talking about medieval tech or my choice of images caused such a domino effect.

Hell, Empire can burn for all I care. Vocators will still kick all your asses. Unless you kill them, and that'd be kinda sad. Though if the Empire fell it'd be fun playing vengeful assassins for a while, hard to recruit new members as well.

I don't see any hostility at all. What I see is an honest sharing of information to those who lack it. In fact, the only person I see showing even a little anger is you, which I find a bit disturbing considering everything thusfar has been a civil debate, and not an argument like you seem to think.

Nevermind, I must have missed the name calling there. I retract my disturbance.

chukklehed said
I don't see any hostility at all. What I see is an honest sharing of information to those who lack it. In fact, the only person I see showing even a little anger is you, which I find a bit disturbing considering everything thusfar has been a civil debate, and not an argument like you seem to think.

I'm not showing any anger, I see two people getting abrasive and I'm telling them to stop. If I was showing any anger, it would towards you for jumping on my back at every possible opportunity.

Edit: Alright then.

Knowing Ellri and from what I saw I can see how an arguement could have been seen when there wasn't one. I do the same thing all the time either I say something that looks arguementative or see something that looks arguementative but really isn't. It is the problem with typing and reading, all in the wording and punctuation.

Aristo: Crossbows I have no idea. I mean I could talk modern weapons or Sci-Fi weapons but that is about it. The groin thing was just supposed to be a joke, it wasn't made to be taken seriously.

Sep said
Knowing Ellri and from what I saw I can see how an arguement could have been seen when there wasn't one. I do the same thing all the time either I say something that looks arguementative or see something that looks arguementative but really isn't. It is the problem with typing and reading, all in the wording and punctuation.

Yes, it's hard to tell whether I'm reading an argument or not so I shake my threatening stick at everything that sounds like one.

Sep said
The groin thing was just supposed to be a joke, it wasn't made to be taken seriously.

I'm afraid that my ignorance was the cause for it being taken seriously. Apologies for that!

Alrighty, I didn't mean to escalate the situation, but I thought he/she/them (???) was provoking me.
I want to figure out where this scuffle started so we can sort it out:

Going back to my mentioning of tech, I brought up the 14th/15th centuries, and somewhere crossbows came into the discussion, with Ell preferring a setting in which ranged weaponry should necessitate skill or something like that:

"...an era when, for ranged combat other than siege weaponry and Evoking, you would be limited to things that take years of practice to become a danger to more than yourself with."

Crossbows are a useful weapon because they're great against armor, and it's easy to train an army to use them, so I opted to include them in the Guard, and informally by extension, the Othean military. They were used throughout the middle ages, alongside plate armor, so I don't see a reason to force a separation between the two.

Then Ell's manner of typing and bringing up historical information I already knew seemed to me like something of a provocation, or a way of shutting down what I had said. At this point, I posted the Constabulary lore entry.

I think I took Ell's post about plate armor being expensive and falling out of fashion due to crossbows as an offensive one. I didn't understand why the effectiveness of crossbows vs. armor was brought up again. (I thought we talked about this already?) I don't think the fact should discourage people from having knights or heavily armored troops - as I said before, they coexisted for centuries on the battlefield.
Ell said,

"But its either those shiny knights or crossbows. Not both."

To this, I ask why would you be unable to have both when they did historically?

Ell then went after the reenactor photos I used for my gallery, with all the groin talk. I just thought it was annoying, and the photos were meant to give the viewer a general idea of the aesthetic, not a literal interpretation of the IC. Both the reenactors and historical men-at-arms had to make do with what they have; so what if a few groins are uncovered?

Ell's latest post seemed to me like an attack and partial metagaming, and I thought that he/she/they were literally going to do just that in order to "win" the siege, which prompted my comment about dick-measuring (which did not help things, I'll be the first to admit).

So in all, a good deal of misinterpretation is to blame, and the tone in which our last few posts were made did not help to defuse the situation any, and I'm sorry about that.

---

In all seriousness though; the OOC comments about "Unit X that I created is awesome and going to wipe the floor with your unit Y" is ridiculously annoying and I've seen it too much in Nation RPs.

I get that you want the Vocators to be cool and strong, Sep; but I don't need to read

"...remember that they have been trained since childhood to be trained killers and to take down people with relics ... trained to adapt easily. Not saying you can't take them down ... it won't be easy .. Oh, me and Ellri have another surprise for you guys ... The Moral blow is enough to destroy you ... the Empire are being good guys to the city they are invading ... Vocators will still kick all your asses."

all the time.

It's like "Alright, alright, your pet faction is uber duber awesome, I get it." It's this "winning" mentality I dislike in RPs - we're supposed to be writing a story, not beating everyone else.

Who is waiting on me to make a post?

I'm scottish Aristo, I talk shit. Don't take it seriously all the time. In the end they're only human. Yes they've been trained for years but none of them have any real power other than the higher ups.

Talking about the "Moral blow" was if the Empire take the city not when me and Spark were talking about things and he mentioned abandoning the city and I was merely mentioning how it would likely effect the population. Don't quote out of context, it doesn't work.

Also surprises is where it is at, don't expect someone to play all their hand at once and I know I talk shit about the Vocators but truth be told they're not constantly going to be hunting you down. if they were like that they would have been sent for you ages ago and not just now. If you want to help build the Empire feel free, both myself and Ellri have said we welcome input. We have bones, not a body.

Guilty Spark said
Who is waiting on me to make a post?

Meeee! (Altough I'm more waiting on Chuckle and Bark)