I apologize then. I've been on severe edge since my family has come and gone. As for the hiatus bit. . I feel that I am often unsatisfied with the Guild, but it's also like my home. I also run the Discord. Leaving the site permanently is not really an option for me. Besides, it's usually only a lack of Roleplays and a few bad apples that ruin it for me, so it's not really that big of a deal.

No need to apologize multiple times -- it's alright. About a year ago or so I was still living at home, so I could've related more to the idea of family causing stress a lot more back then than I can now that I more or less don't need to deal with them unless I feel like it.

I don't know if I'd say I'm unsatisfied here, since I'm aware that it's usually just a few bad apples - as you put it - that end up causing the problems, but more than anything I just feel like I'm currently letting this place drain too much of my time. I'm in the process of trying to get on top of a few OOC posts (outside of actual role-playing threads) that I want dealt with, and then I really don't want to need to deal with more distractions -- I'll still manage this thread though.

Would've thought the Discord ownership could be transferred over to someone, but I'm hardly encouraging you to leave or anything. On my end, I wouldn't say I have a lack of role-plays -- there's a lot of role-plays I either want to GM or want to take part in (far more of the former, honestly) that I don't have the time for. I tend to put my all into something if I take part in it, and that's a problem when I've got my main project needing most of my attention.

@NekoMizu
How goes? Got cheese?

@shylarah
I want to give myself more time to answer you on the 'literary fiction' discussion, since I'm way too dizzy and sore to properly elaborate on what I'm thinking of with that yet, but I figured I'd at least get the other stuff out of the way.

Hm, in writing, sometimes hiding details can add more to the story. If a character is angry, and there's no obvious reason, then this adds tension to the scene, instead of coming out and saying how this and that happened to them in the past and it affects the way they see things. That part will come out later, when the issue is resolved, or at least discussed. It's possible to create tension by giving that information and showing the reaction, but which way I personally would go with generally depends on which character is the dominant perspective. If the perspective character is aware, then I'd include it. If they're baffled, then I won't.

This is why I've already made a point a few times that I'll always explain everything in my work eventually, but it might not be given immediately. I'll use plenty of foreshadowing and misdirection, but - when all is said and done - the truth and details will be revealed eventually. From my perspective, failing to eventually get back to give those details is half-arsing things and leaving the story incomplete, unless the purpose is to leave things open to interpretation (which requires the story deliberately miss details and be incomplete) -- I personally despise doing this though for the most part, at least once the story is 100% finished.

As for the concept of the 'dominant perspective', I technically have two. The main character I've mentioned a few times now is one of them, and they're very enigmatic in some senses and know far more about the setting and lore than a lot of the other characters -- they don't reveal everything immediately for a variety of complicated reasons. The other focus point character is one of @Ailyn Evensen's characters, and she's a more down to earth or 'relatable' character. While the former character is the actual 'hero' of the story, the latter is the audience's eyes to an extent. Several other characters take the main perspective at times too.

Hamilton is the Broadway musical about Alexander Hamilton and Revolutionary era America. It's got some pretty awesome songs, and the language is clever. Check it out if you have a chance.

If I remember, I will -- my tab of things to remember doing keeps growing exponentially.

Characters don't exist in a vacuum. To understand why they interact with the world nd even other chars as they do, you need to know about the world. In fact, the world is essentially a very complicated character, at least to my mind. Possibly even more important.

I agree with everything here except the notion that the world could be more important than the characters -- from my perspective, the quality of a story is almost always dependant on how well done the characterization is and the interactions between the characters and between them and their setting. With that said, having a well-thought-out world definitely enriches how those characters are portrayed since it gives you more ways to characterize them. I definitely think having a good set of concepts and lore is important, but not as much as having fleshed out characters.

On the other hand, your comment about the world being a very complicated character amused me... for reasons that are a bit difficult to say without spoiling some things. I suppose I'll leave it at saying I have a very literal example of what you just said in my work.

@Shoryu Magami
Funny that you mention cheese, because I just got done eating the rest of it.

@NekoMizu
Hmmm, I see. That's probably depressing for you.

@Shoryu Magami
Devastating. So how are you mate

@NekoMizu
Basically just deprived of being rested, and dizzy in general.

@Shoryu Magami ...Are you pulling a Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri? With a sentient planet? *amused* Wouldn't be the first time I've seen that. There's...hm. Think it's by Anne McCaffery, The Powers That Be, that planet has a consciousness as well. And I vaguely recall other instances too. <3 It's a fun idea to play with.

In terms of importance, I mean that, while it might be possible to have a story without a certain character, it is /never/ possible to have a story without a setting and a background for where a character come from. Thus, the character of their world is part of a fully-developed character, and if A exists on its own and is /part/ of B too, I'd say A is more important. ...This even goes for if you have the setting of a black void, because you'd better believe that's gonna freak some people out. And did they grow up there? Is it all they've ever known? Or did they suddenly find themselves there? And so on.

Also I keep getting double-notifications from you, thinking someone's pinged me with a post, and invariably being disappointed. =/ Why?! *flailing*

@Shoryu Magami
How long has it been since you slept? Have you still been unable to sleep?

@NekoMizu
I've slept, but not as much as I could. Overall, I've been sleeping really badly for the last week and my pattern is entirely out of balance due to it. I'm hoping to fix it today, which involves staying awake for another twelve hours or so.

@shylarah

...Are you pulling a Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri? With a sentient planet? *amused* Wouldn't be the first time I've seen that. There's...hm. Think it's by Anne McCaffery, The Powers That Be, that planet has a consciousness as well. And I vaguely recall other instances too. <3 It's a fun idea to play with.

More like... sentient cosmos, but you're on the right track. When we're saying world, I assume we're talking about the whole setting, not just a single planet. Anyway, I believe I've already said too much.

In terms of importance, I mean that, while it might be possible to have a story without a certain character, it is /never/ possible to have a story without a setting and a background for where a character come from. Thus, the character of their world is part of a fully-developed character, and if A exists on its own and is /part/ of B too, I'd say A is more important. ...This even goes for if you have the setting of a black void, because you'd better believe that's gonna freak some people out. And did they grow up there? Is it all they've ever known? Or did they suddenly find themselves there? And so on.

It's possible to have a story without a certain character, but I believe in the case of mine every character is vital to an extent due to each one offering some of the social commentary and philosophy -- my work's more complicated than a lot of stories though, so I understand you can afford to remove characters in a lot of other works. On the other hand, it's impossible to have a story without characters. I'm not saying that having a setting isn't important, but prioritizing it over the characters is a bad idea in my eyes. Even with the example you gave with that black void, the focus of the narrative wouldn't be on that void itself -- the focus would be on how the character perceives it. I actually work with this exact example you've given in my project. It isn't going to be the world that'll be memorable; it's the characters. It isn't going to be the world that people love and cry over or despise and want to see the death of; it's the characters. You can't have characters without a setting, but without characters a setting has no story, so it's sort of pointless discussing importance based on that. I understand the logic of what you're saying, but not that it proves settings are more important than the characters.

Also I keep getting double-notifications from you, thinking someone's pinged me with a post, and invariably being disappointed. =/ Why?! *flailing*

Because life is full of great joys and great disappointments.

@Shoryu Magami
What if people were made in china?

@NekoMizu
That meant to be a setting idea? You should've put it into the absurd anime ideas thread. A world where people are actually made in China and then shipped off to countries -- that's a whole lot fucking more absurd than a stork, if you ask me.

@Shoryu Magami
I was asking because I couldn't think of what else to say so I looked around and saw a remote and it said made in china. Basically it's just random bullshit. But yes, that would be an absurd but interesting idea. I actually have an idea that I can post in that thread. Perhaps I'll do that now lel

Going live for those who can/care to watch!

@CrazyShadowy
Wot is going on tho lel

Fuck it... this heatwave is sucking the life outta me. I'm heading off to bed.

@CrazyShadowy
All the best with that.

@Shoryu Magami
All right mate good night.

CURSE IT refreshed the page and lost my half-post. Anyhow. @Shoryu Magami, I've seen the cosmos/existence done only once, but it was fun. Noice~

The delay was because I was looking for Character Calculus terms that I didn't manage to find, but basically I think that it is possible to have a story without (main) characters as such. Telling the story of a lake over time, or the movement of glaciers in the ice age, or the slow decline of a dying rural town, these would all work, because the setting itself is a character.

For that matter, while it might be possible to have a story in a black void, the void will have an effect on the characters, and they may not have started there -- thus the settings of their pasts are also important. If A is part of B, and also important on its own, I'd say A is more important that B. ^.^

@NekoMizu
Fucking called it due to OBS, Firefox, the game itself and my pc shutting down due to unknown reasons. Fucking BS if you ask me, pissed off right now. Might try again later.

@Shoryu Magami
The above states the current situation with it and my mood.

@CrazyShadowy
Well now I need a new monitor.

@NekoMizu
What happened?