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Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by Liotrent
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Okay, so this is a pretty big WIP, I'm still trying to figure out a lot of stuff... But basically. I have Space Roaches that focus on industry and trade. There's a lot I need to figure out, but before I go ahead and further develop the idea, I want to run it by the rest of you and see if you guys have any input. There's not much to go on understandably, but I also want to guage if something like this is okay. And, if it helps, they're not a hivemind, they're sort of a corporate game of thrones kind of deal.

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@Liotrent I'm liking what's presented so far, and has some promise. :)
Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by Taeryn
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So it's cool that Humans didn't have natural Psychics/Psionics until the Society did their whole shindig and more or less seeded the species with them?


Best to go with didn't have natural "discovered" ones of any notability, because who knows? :D, apart from that yeah.
Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by Nate1008
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@Nate1008 I recommend you read up on common roleplaying etiquette (godmodding, god mode, etc.) and rethink your nation.


God dammit, fine! Ill recreate my nation! Jesus!
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The Infestation

General Information
The Infestation is a scar on the universe. It seeks to infest all and to steal all creatures will. The Infestation is an incurable virus at the moment. A cure is possible, but it will take massive amounts of research, skill, intelligence, technology and resources. The Infestation hates all that is not blighted by the virus and seeks nothing but to spread their plague. The Infestation is small now, and are thought of as rumors or myths. But soon, they will come out of the dark places of space to make their mark in history.

Nation type
Minor Belligerent

Overview
Population: 718
Queens: 8
Hives: 0
Infested colonies: 1
Infested space-stations: 0
Infested bases: 1
Infested planets: 0
Infested systems: 0
Military population: 718
Navy population: 9
Ships:
Infested Civilian Ships: 5
Hive Strike Craft: 0
Infested Strike Craft: 2
Hive Corvettes: 0
Infested Corvettes: 0
Hive Frigates: 0
Infested Frigates: 1
Hive Destroyers: 0
Infested Destroyers: 0
Hive Cruisers: 0
Infested Cruisers: 0
Hive Battlecrusiers: 0
Infested BattleCrusiers: 0
Hive Battleships: 0
Infested Battleships: 0
Hive Dreadnoughts: 0
Infested Dreadnoughts: 0
Hive HyperDreadnoughts: 1
Infested Hyperdreadnoughts: 0

History
When the virus developed, it was trapped inside an air pocket deep inside a cave-world known as Cyrus IV, in the perfect living conditions to survive. A mining colony was situated nearby. The colony mined into the air pocket and the virus infested the mining crew. From one person to an entire colony in mere weeks. With no response from other colonies because of a short blackout, the infestation took the advantage and took over the colony. Here, after many days, the Hive-Mind was created. It was built by the infested to keep The Infestation under control. It spread its grasp with other creatures to keep its will and steal the will of the other creatures it now has under its grasp.

Major Holdings
Cyrus IV: Infested Mining colony.
116XE1: Infested Asteroid Colony.

Demographics
Infested: 90%
Other Races: 10%

Population
Infested: The Infested Make up the majority of the population. They are the backbone of the Infestation and keep prisoners and slaves.
Other Races: The Infested keep other races as slaves or prisoners. This population is any race they attack. The Infestation use these people as pretend escapees, making them carriers of the virus to spread elsewhere.

Society
The Infestation lets some of their prisoners walk the hives and bases. They selectively choose who to infest and who not to infest. The prisoners are placed in bad living conditions, but do not get infested. At least, not right away. The Infested on the other-hand, don't seem to live any kind of lifestyle. They patrol mindlessly, attack anything that is not supposed to be in the hive and attack if they are ordered to by the Hive-Mind. They don't care how they live. They only care about infesting, attacking and eating.

Economy
The Infested have no use for many resources besides food. They may pretend like they need or use resources to look more diplomatic, but they stay hidden and refuse to use face-to-face communication in any way.

Government
The Infestation is run by the Hive-Mind. It is on the top of its rule and has smaller (nodes) to extend its rule. Queens, Hive lords and Swarm Leaders act as these nodes of power and keep The Infestation under control and balanced.

Technological Information
The Infestation cannot create advanced tech and need to steal it from others. However, they have created biological tech that only they can use, and is useless to others.

Major Techs

Bio-FTL: A biological FTL that has a psionic ability to rip a hole in space to travel short distances around 9000-100000 km in space. Hive ships are the only ships that can use these and the ships have more than one. The travel effects stack for each Bio-FTL that is there and stacks again, for each other ship inside the shuttle dock of the ship. Infested ships do not use Bio-FTL's. They use their normal FTL's.
Hive Strike Craft: 2 Bio-FTL's
Hive Corvette: 6 Bio-FTL's
Hive Frigate: 27 Bio-FTL's
Hive Destroyer: 61 Bio-FTL's
Hive Cruiser: 87 Bio-FTL's
Hive Battle Cruiser: 172 Bio-FTL's
Hive Battleship: 281 Bio-FTL's
Hive Dreadnought: 617 Bio-FTL's
Hive Capital Ship: 2714 Bio-FTL's

Bio-Cannon: A biological cannon that spits a flurry of small flesh balls that have sharp bone spikes. The Bio-Cannon shoots with psi buffed muscular tissue.

Heavy Bio-Cannon: A heavy biological cannon that spits a large flesh ball that has large poisoned bone spikes. The Heavy Bio-Cannon shoots with highly developed psi buffed muscular tissue.

Flesh Ripper: A tentacle that has a blade like bone at its tip, allowing it to slash at other things from a short distance.

Bio-Spore: A spore-shaped cannon that can shoot at massive force. It fires flesh ball projectiles that grow 2-7 flesh rippers on the surface they hit. (this includes other creatures).

Military Information
The entire population of the Infested (other than the prisoners) are military. They each have random mutations to help them adapt.

Military Overview

Fleet/Navy

Civilian Ships
Infested Civilian Ship: Another races Civilian ship. Once used for mining, hulling or transportation, is now used for The Infestations military. Infested Civilian Ships are unarmed and the infestation on these ships is only found inside the cockpit of the shuttle. These ships are used for infiltrating other races bases, colonies or space-stations. These ships transport a single Hive Prisoner that is a contaminated carrier of the virus.
___________________
Dreadnoughts

Hive Dreadnought: A Hive Dreadnought is a floating mass of flesh and tentacles. It is massive in size, approximately 2 km long, 5281 m wide and 1782 m tall. It is armed with 59 bio-cannons, 802 flesh rippers and 172 bio-spores.

Infested Dreadnought: It is another races Dreadnought. It is infested and now belongs to The Infestation. Infestation on these ships is clearly visible and anyone who tries to talk to it through the com will get a response of screeching, roars and other animal-like noises.
__________________
Battleships

Hive Battleship: A Hive Battleship is a floating mass of flesh and tentacles. It is large in size, approximately 1 km long, 4717 m wide and 1272 m tall. It is armed with 28 bio-cannons, 10 heavy bio-cannons, 620 flesh rippers and 50 bio-spores.

Infested Battleship: It is another races battleship. It is infested and now belongs to the Infestation. Infestation on these ships is clearly visible. The Com is normally broken and will not work.
______________________
Battlecruisers

Hive Battlecruiser: A Hive Battlecruiser is a floating mass of flesh and tentacles. It is large in size, approximately 9716 m long, 4281 m wide and 1183 m tall. It is armed with 10 bio-cannons, 4 heavy bio-cannons, 582 flesh rippers and 22 bio-spores.

Infested Battlecruiser: It is another races battlecruiser. It is infested and now belongs to The Infestation. Infestation on these ships is clearly visible. The com is normally broken and will not work.
_______________
Cruisers

Hive Cruiser: A Hive Cruiser is a floating mass of flesh and tentacles. It is medium in size, approximately 8932 m long, 3721 m wide and 971 m tall. It is armed with 5 bio-cannons, 373 flesh rippers and 17 bio-spores.

Infested Cruiser: It is another races Cruiser. It is infested and now belongs to The Infestation. Infestation on these ships is clearly visible. The com is normally broken and will not work.
_________________
Destroyers

Hive Destroyer: A Hive Destroyer is a floating mass of flesh and tentacles. It is medium in size, approximately 5931 m long, 2721 m wide and 791 m tall. It is armed with 518 flesh rippers and 51 bio-spores.

Infested Destroyer: It is another races Destroyer. It is infested and now belongs to The Infestation. Infestation on these ships is clearly visible. The com is normally broken and will not work.
_______________
Frigates

Hive Frigate: A Hive Frigate is a floating mass of flesh and tentacles. It is small in size, approximately 1283 m long, 728 m wide and 282 m tall. It is armed with 4 bio-cannons, 52 flesh rippers and 5 bio-spores.

Infested Frigate: It is another races Frigate. It is infested and now belongs to The Infestation. Infestation on these ships is not always visible. The com is normally broken and will not work.
________________
Corvettes

Hive Corvette: A Hive Corvette is a small flying mass of flesh and tentacles. It is tiny in size, approximately 16 m long, 5 m wide and 6 m tall. It is armed with 2 bio-cannons and 1 flesh ripper.

Infested Corvette: It is another races Corvette. It is infested and now belongs to The Infestation. Infestation on these ships is not always visible. The com is normally broken and will not work.
___________________
Strike Craft

Hive Strike Craft: A Hive Strike Craft is a small flying mass of flesh and tentacles. It is tiny in size, approximately 6 m long, 3 m wide and 3 m tall. It is armed with 1 bio-cannon.
____________________________
Army/Planetary forces

Infested Civilian: A infested civilian. They are the main part of The Infestations army. They use any equipment that they used before they got infested.

Infested Soldier: A infested soldier. There aren't a lot of them but there is still a bit. They use any equipment that they used before they got infested and retain some of their knowledge they had to use their weapons.

Infested vehicle: A infested vehicle. Again, only small amounts of them. They are like the vehicles they once were, but infested. They are made of metal and have infested flesh here and there. Their weapons have a 37% chance of being operational after the infestation prossess.

Queen: The Queen of a hive or base. They stay inside their hive and only leave if necessary. They may act weak and helpless at first, but they are actually skilled fighters. They are intelligent and deadly. However, if the Queen does somehow die, the infested that she was controlling become rogue and start to kill everything, including each-other.

Hive Lord: Hive Lords act as royal guards in a way. They are brute-like and not so brutish. They protect the hive entrance and the queens chamber. When not guarding, they are ruthless commanders and excellent elite attack troops.

Swarm Leader: Swarm Leaders command The Infestations armies. The Swarm Leaders are well protected and help the army use tactics, though they still don't listen well and attack mindlessly, the commanders are major helpers in the battles that they are involved in.
_________________
Hyperdread

Hive Capital Ship: The Hive Capital Ship is a colossal mass of flesh, tentacles and bone. It is 15 km long, 5 km wide and 2 km tall. It has 500 heavy Bio-Cannons, 2893 Bio-Cannons, 8193 flesh rippers and 2814 Bio-Spores. The Hive Capital Ship can spawn 7124 Hive Strike Craft, 612 Hive Corvettes and 16 Hive Frigates every 5 days. The Hive-Mind is located inside this colossal ship, along with 6 Queens. The Hive Capital Ship only enters combat in war and keeps itself hidden beneath the surface of The Infestations home-world: Cyrus IV.

Infested Hyperdread: Another races Hyperdread. It is now The Infestations, and re-armed with new bio-weapons based on its size. It takes several months to fully infest one and must have 2 or more Queens inside to begin infestation. The Infestation can be stopped if the queens inside are killed and the infestation is burned out before time is up. If it is already infested, it will not work unless the other race possesses the cure to The Infestation.
Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by Nate1008
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happy?
Hidden 5 yrs ago 5 yrs ago Post by Aleranicus
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happy?


We're not dogpiling. We're not upset. At its heart, this is a grand story that is going to be told by all of us together. We're just trying to make sure that everyone gets a place in the story, that none of this turns into a case of people yelling "NO! YOU'RE DEAD!" in the comments like four-year-olds. We'll all have strengths. We'll all have weaknesses. But we'll all have a story to tell.

Admittedly, it may be more helpful for people to say "No, but what about if you tried-" instead of just "No. OP."
Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by Archetype Zero
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Archetype Zero 𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕾𝖍𝖆𝖙𝖙𝖊𝖗𝖊𝖉 𝕺𝖓𝖊

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happy?


Not really.
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Hidden 5 yrs ago 5 yrs ago Post by Archetype Zero
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Archetype Zero 𝕿𝖍𝖊 𝕾𝖍𝖆𝖙𝖙𝖊𝖗𝖊𝖉 𝕺𝖓𝖊

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- double post -
Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by Sierra
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@Nate1008 This won't be particularly pleasant but I want you to really read it carefully. I've written an all-consuming hivemind race before and I am trying to help you out, even if it may not feel like it. Your sheet, in its current form, is almost certainly not going to pass GM certification.

All-consuming hiveminds tend to be difficult races to play. I personally recommend them as a second race only to be used as a primary antagonist (this generally requires special GM permission). Otherwise, you're cutting yourself off from diplomacy and making yourself a common enemy. It walks a fine line between being too weak and being promptly annihilated by a coalition of other players, and being blatantly overpowered making the game unfun for everyone. That said, this fine line that can be walked and I can attempt to help with this.

Overview

Nuke these numbers into oblivion. These are absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of a galaxy-spanning NRP. Numbers that do not reflect the true scale of space are going to be a theme of the sheet here. You list population as "718" when a relatively moderately sized nation like my own has population in the hundreds of billions. That's the kind of scale you deal with in grand interstellar space opera. As an aside, population is also a bit of a fluid concept if you have living ships and/or take up the ability to bio-engineer life forms.

Generally speaking, less is more with numbers. The number of main battery turrets on warships I consider important. Exact numbers of ships may matter for large classes like dreadnoughts, but cruisers and sub-capital classes should just be left ambiguous. Having played games with excessive stats tracking, never be in a rush to keep track of statistics you don't have to. Its a large amount of work that, in this case, offers no real reward.

Infection
The entire idea of using other people's assets that you've infected is not going over well. It's widely viewed as lazy. You're not going to make any friends going around stealing ships & population, and I don't just mean within the game. It incurrs ire out of game too. In the past you've implied that your faction posesses the ability to secretly infect high-level individuals within governmental structure and bring down whole nations through a little sabotage. Suffice to say, that didn't go over well. If you wish to retain the ability to infect beings, I would strongly advise keeping it limited. As a general rule, there should never be any doubt to anyone (both infected person and other members of their race) about whether someone is infected.

When I wrote my all-consuming hivemind, I opted for a more Tyranid (from Warhammer 40K) route by which they capture living creatures and consume them for raw biomass. This raw biomass is then used to artificially construct new life forms following genetic blueprints engineered from the best traits of species they've come across in the past. I also incorporated the development and usage of advanced cybernetic technology here, however that remains optional. It is worth noting that the idea of consuming or converting a person's own population into more of you is arguably more nightmare-inducing and is therefore very much in line with the OOC goals of playing this archetype of faction.

Consistency
You have a number of places where you contradict yourself, both in some of your responses to inquiries and within your sheet. At the outset you state the infestation is interested in infecting all, but a couple sections later you claim it leaves some be to be prisoners and slaves (which seems inefficient when it could infect them and integrate them into the collective consciousness for easier control). Consistency is vital in sci-fi writing. I proof my work for consistency as much, if not moreso, than I proof it for grammar. I would therefore ditch the idea of slaves. Prisoners is worth keeping, as a way to store still-living beings you've captured prior to processing them in whatever way you choose to. Choosing to process live individuals rather than recently slain corpses requires more care on your part during invasions to minimize casualties for maximum return, but can also add significantly to the terror factor.

FTL
The rest of the techs will be covered elsewhere because this deserves a section all its own. Recall what I said about numbers earlier. That goes triple for FTL techs. Based on the values you list, it would take about 25 maximum-range jumps for your hyperdread to leave the solar system. I didn't even bother to calculate how many you would need to reach another star system. Throw said numbers in the incenerator, now. If you feel compelled to have numbers here, I recommend listing speed as a multiple of c (the speed of light). This value typically ends up being a 4 or 5 digit figure for the kinds of travel times generally considered normal in sci-fi NRPs.

Bio-Techs
Most people are employing high power energy weapons or some form of railgun-type projectile weapon ... plus missiles I assume. The muzzle velocity achievable by muscle-based projectile launchers is basically nonexistent comparatively. One thing I would consider is to do away with the idea of muscles and consider biochemical. A glob of highly volatile goup is loaded behind the projectile and then ignited, effectively creating a biologic ballistic weapon. You also may have to adopt some technological elements here (perhaps the hivemind is intelligent enough to direct workers in the use of cybernetics) in order to have viable navy forces.

Most of your bioweapons appear to be banking on closing the gap. That's not a reasonable expectation when fighting people with railguns and guided missiles. You will never get within 5 kilometers of most people's warships without getting absolutely pulverized. Some technological adoption is again a good solution here. It gives you some nice potent firepower that can actually be effective at long range. Another idea is to have creatures engineered solely to be self-propelled guided missiles. My advice is to make sure you can win the engagement first, and then close in to rip the ship to pieces and harvest the biomass of the crew after.

As a sidenote, bio-electrical tech can be potentially very interesting. Its short range compared to most other people's stuff but putting some kind of biologic lightning rod on corvettes and swarming enemies would be incredibly dangerous, and cool.

Warships
I said it earlier but it bears repeating. Don't just go infesting other people's stuff. Creating your own stuff in this version of the sheet is a step in the right direction. My personal favorite direction to go with making spaceships for bio-tech races is to have a technological skeleton that includes the basis of some weapons tech (often plasma cannons), power generation, main drive engines, and potentially an FTL system (depending on if I'm going with technological or biological FTL). The remainder of the ship including armor and any actuation, is essentially grown around it, forming hardened keratinous armor and vicious electrified tentacles, and packed to the brim with dangerous life forms within.

Trying to conform to traditional navy archetypes is a waste of time. All-consuming hivemind races work better when they don't and the entire goal is to subvert tradition anyway. Swarming your enemy with smaller "lesser" ships can be extremely effective, especially considering that most warships are built to duel with other capital ships at extreme range. A ton of small agile things up close can be lethal. I feel like your tripping yourself up trying to conform to standard naval classifications. Get creative with this. One idea I enjoy using is a massive capital ship landing craft that crashes into a planet, impaling the ground and unfolding as a massive spire, that then serves as airbase, garrison, and factory to convert collected biomass into more life forms.

The size of your destroyer is, for the record, almost triple the size of an Alduuri battlecruiser. Considering its current lack of long-range armament, you may want to reconsider that. A general suggestion would be to try and keep warships under 5000-6000 meters, not including your hyperdread. I actually suggest setting a finite length for your dreadnoughts, and then letting people assume the size of everything else based on the logical size progression downward.



You can make this work, but its going to require a fair amount of time and thinking. Developing a race that walks such a knife edge is not an easy task and if this is your first sci-fi nation game, you bit off a hell of a lot. It took me months and several iterations to really get the Harvesters (a bio-technological hivemind from the original sci-fi universe Stardust) into a good place in terms of narrative and balance. People have been harsh, yes, but plenty of us are willing to work with you to get this into a good place. That may come with a lot of critical responses that are less than comfortable, but if you need assistance, you have some good resources here. But you have to be open minded, flexible, and willing to put in the work. Without that, we can't help you.
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Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by ClocktowerEchos
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@Nate1008 Going off of what @Aleranicus has said, here is a list of "have you tried" and similar things that might help you:

What do you plan on doing in the RP that will not only make it fun for everyone else but also for you? As it stands currently, people will not really want to interact with what is obviously a very hostile and treacherous hivemind meaning you will end up posting about yourself for a while as everyone is interacting with each other.


I believe you are trying to take inspiration from the likes of the Flood, the Tyranids and the Zerg but have you considered the option of not requiring to take all of them to create a "super parasite"? I know the word OP has been thrown around a lot, but that is honestly what it seems like you are trying to do, make an unbeatable creation that cannot be stopped and cannot be destroyed. Have you considered that the other players would not consider this nearly as amusing or interesting as you?


Have you considered any deeper history for your species? As it stands right now, it would seem that the government was astronomically inept at preventing what was basically a zombie outbreak to the point it has taken over a colony and a moon. No stable government would ever let this just slide but that also means you could have had a weak or ineffective government ignore or not dedicate enough resources to fixing the issue. In my own sheet, the Haradoni would have had enough resources to put down an outbreak of the Syndorian Virus but because they were terribly loosing a war, they decided to let it loose on themselves.


From personal experience, I would recommend against using precise numbers. As it stands on your NS right now they are only taking up space and not really giving any meaningful information. Same with the lists, they are just taking up space and could at least be put in hiders. On the topic of numbers, 718 people is a pitifully small force to the point that it is likely impossible to do any meaningful actions; I'm fairly certain the high school I went to had around 700 people.


I would suggest removing the infested naval vessels and coming up with some more of your own with pictures. To a lot of poeple just saying you "take over other player's stuff" is both lazy and bad writing. In addition your navy's weapons do not seem to be intimidating or even practical at all. I understand that you're trying to use the Tyranid hiveships as a basis, but your writing does not make it seem impressive. How about firing boney spikes and fleshy mass, you use bioplasma, rapid fire spore cannons that fire a super dense bone-like spike that mimics conventional kinetic munitions or even living creatures who can latch on to ships (if not stopped by shields) and start to dig into them.

Also the fact that you can take over another player's hyperdread is really off putting. Even if you don't plan on doing it, the fact that you list is as part of your active navy and allude to it as a possibility means that there's always a chance. A chance many don't want to take.


For what reason do you have slaves/non infected populations for? I know that you've mentioned somewhere that you turn some of them into sleeper agents with the virus in them, but you are relying on the fact that said agents won't simply say where they are coming from and authorities simply knowing that they're from infected space. You're also overlooking the fact that some people would be more than willing to just shoot down suspected infected craft. Instead, what if your hivemind was smart enough to start basically farming humans/other sentient beings for hosts and biomass. In addition, what was your original host species? There is more than just humans in this galaxy.


There is more but this is what I could quickly think of off the top of my head. Another word of advice, don't be upset if you have to change your NS a lot. Ask any veteran NRPer and they will tell you that they change their NS many times if not dozens of times. Hell, I know a decent number of NSs that their creators never consider "finish" and continuously work on it up until the RP itself ends up dying out.
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Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by Nate1008
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I have read your replies and i have come to the decision of not creating any type of Hive Mind or infestation. Instead, I will be creating a human Nation, like everyone else. Thank you for your help. I think this will be better for me and the other players.
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@Nate1008 best of luck.
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Thanks guys.
Hidden 5 yrs ago Post by Ozerath
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Hm, if you don't use the so far unofficial discord, send me your nation sheet via PM if it's ready for review. Not necessarily completely finished, just ready for review.

This ended up getting a lot more attention than I thought it would, so yeah, if you want your stuff reviewed sooner, PM it, otherwise I'll get to it in the order it appears in the thread, which has gotten rather large.

Sorry for the delays incidentally, things kinda took a sharp 90 degree turn IRL. Mostly on top of things on that front. We're still well within my original timeline for starting this thing.
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Hidden 5 yrs ago 5 yrs ago Post by Liotrent
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I've got progress on le WIP Nation Sheet. Mostly for people to run by and comment on if there are any problems. Other than that, it's mostly just to show I'm actually working on stuff.
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I have read your replies and i have come to the decision of not creating any type of Hive Mind or infestation. Instead, I will be creating a human Nation, like everyone else. Thank you for your help. I think this will be better for me and the other players.
Only a small portion of the playerbase has human factions and by that I include those who were inspired by them but no longer related.
If you want a real easy to make nation I'd suggest starting with an alien faction.

Rookie's toolkit to create alien civs:
- pick a non-human fantasy/sci-fi picture you like, give them a cool name
- make it empire because they get the 4X game feel across the best (if you don't like empires you can pick other governance)
- Choose cool pictures of infantry, vehicles and starships you like (write up some lore to them)
- No fourth step, you are done

The beauty of simplistic alien civs that they are essentially humans but without mankind's history to consider. They are just play-doh for you to mold the way you want. The extra issue with human civs here is that you have to coordinate your lore with multiple other people. I believe an alien species sidesteps all these issues and allow you to start with a clean plate.

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Still reading submitted sheets, so no commentary at this time for you Nate.

Done with Federation of Nations and Valerius Federation (both approved), now on to White Corps, then Ascendancy, then the two in my inbox which I haven't checked yet.
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Hoping a preliminary version with the relevant areas (read: Navy) will be finished by Monday. Earlier doesn't seem too likely. Fully proofed version of everything is at least a week away.
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Only the military section left.

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