[OOC] The king is dead, long live the king! [Reboot] [5/7]

[Dion]

@Cyclone Perhaps you could've raided Dieuporteille once, and met their match against some of the finest knights? Especially given the religious ferocity of the Dieuporteillean knights, it's likely they would've done their best to drive back these heathens.

Could be even that they were the ones that pushed them away from the southern provinces -- explaining why they didn't venture too far down.

Of course it'd be weird if I only said how I beat you, so if you have suggestions for things your people could've done to mine, I'm open to that.

[frapet]

@frapetYou have something good going on there. I wonder though the reason for sending Grenn as the advisor. I mean, he doesn't seem like the best guy to send if the survival of your province is dependent on the impression one man has on an 11-year-old King xD

Although since he's a mercenary, I can't really say bad things about him as I might need his services ;P

@Vec

So, apart from being the brother of the Markholder, he is mainly there for politics other than impressing the 11-year-old King. but your point is surely granted. ill work on that.

@Buddha Though he can fight we are in a situation where that actually might account for little. Especially the kind of fighter Grenn is. :p

[Dion]

@frapet Grenn is the same fighter as Bastien, so actually, it might be less useless than it seems.

[frapet]

@frapet Grenn is the same fighter as Bastien, so actually, it might be less useless than it seems.

@Buddha

I don't get it :s

[Dion]

@frapet Grenn is favorable in 'real' combat so a duel, or something that isn't dagger-and-cloak. Neither is Bastien, my character, who is also better in a duel than in a intrigue/dagger-and-cloak style fight. They both have the same fighting style.

So if stuff happens, we can duel.

[frapet]

@frapet Grenn is favorable in 'real' combat so a duel, or something that isn't dagger-and-cloak. Neither is Bastien, my character, who is also better in a duel than in a intrigue/dagger-and-cloak style fight. They both have the same fighting style.

So if stuff happens, we can duel.

@Buddha

ah in that sense, I was thinking along the line of: teaching the king how to fight and stuff ^^

[The Narrator]

@Buddha@frapet Only one here is basically a professional duelist just saying...

[Dion]

@The Narrator I'm not saying I want my character to win, I am saying I want it to be interesting.

I'm fine with my character dying if plot/context dictates it.

[Flynn]

@frapet I like the idea of a Province that is just a straight mess and isn't 100% trustworthy.

@Cyclone Really like it thus far! That's gonna be a really interesting something when Chugo Bey arrives at court. Haha

As for the kind of people that are being send... I'd actually really like to see an Inquisitor type of guy, but I leave that up to you guys.

[Dion]

@Flynn I guess since there's a few more fighting type guys, and my guy is already religious to all heck, mine could fulfill that role.

[The Narrator]

@FlynnI played an Inquisitor/Monk the first two times you made this Rp :D

[Cyclone]

@Cyclone Perhaps you could've raided Dieuporteille once, and met their match against some of the finest knights? Especially given the religious ferocity of the Dieuporteillean knights, it's likely they would've done their best to drive back these heathens.

Could be even that they were the ones that pushed them away from the southern provinces -- explaining why they didn't venture too far down.

Of course it'd be weird if I only said how I beat you, so if you have suggestions for things your people could've done to mine, I'm open to that.

@Buddha

When I see your country, I basically read *insert medieval France here*

I imagine that Dieuporteille is forested and swampy in many parts like France was. It makes sense for them to have historically inflicted a crushing defeat upon the Khargats, who would be used to battle on the open plains or foothills and wholly unprepared for fighting in the forests and swamps. Perhaps after the failed invasion of their lands, Dieuporteille was somehow involved in the eventual subjugation of the Khanate?

But anyways, I had in mind an intense rivalry as the knights of Dieuporteille compete with the Khargat warbands for the honor of fighting as the Empire's cavalry. The disciplined and pious knights with their heavy cavalry would stand in pretty stark contrast to the lighter horse archers and the Khargit's hit and run tactics.

Seeing as Dieuporteille is on the frontier of the other nations ripe for conquering, that opens up more room for interesting interaction. Because the Khargit's are slavers and have a warlike culture that would profit form pillaging and conquering, they'll push for the empire to expand. This obviously has some implications for your province since it's on the border and their knights would fight alongside the hordes and see firsthand how savage they still are.

[Dion]

@Cyclone Yeah, it's some form of medieval France, with a heavy focus on religiousness and noble values. Guess it's sorta similar to England too. I just chose France as a motto language because.. well, it just sounds better. Forested sounds about right, and given it's south of Driftmark, it makes sense for there to be some swamps. These swamps would naturally be the very first barrier against the Khargits (Khergits from WB?)

Perhaps it even became the site of the crushing defeat -- knights aren't very strong opponents against light archers with horse archers mixed. They're just too slow. So naturally the Khargits would drive back the small amount of forces Dieuporteille sent, before the Dieuporteillean forces retreated to their keeps. I assume Khargits weren't interested in actually sieging out castles, and just satisfied themselves with the villages. But I guess since this is sorta French, villagers would mostly be inside the castle keeps as was custom back then, so slavery was mostly prevented.

When the Khargits were going back home to celebrate, the Dieuporteillean forces might've given chase and hounded them into the swamps, which would be where they struck, since in the swamps it doesn't matter whether you're on a horse with light armor, or on one with fast armor. Plus, Dieuporteille would also field dismounted knights, like Bastien is. So they had an edge in these swamps.

Since then Dieuporteille has indeed been in a rivalry with the Khargits, and was involved in their subjugation.

However now I guess since we've been in 1 empire for some time, the Dieuporteillean guys just have a problem with these Khargits due to their religion. They've been allies for so long in any conflict that really there's no worry about ransacking and pillaging anymore.

Regarding the expansion -- yes, true, this would implicate things for Dieuporteille, but then again I'm not sure if they care. They're pious knights, not farmers, for the most part. Their wealth comes from self sustenance and pilgrims that visit them. Warfare isn't really a destabilizing factor. So that can go either two ways and it'd really depend on the IC I feel like,

which would be either;

a) The Dieuporteilleans make an agreement with the Khargits, and support them in their conquests. Dieuporteille gains claims to the lands that are conquered that border Dieuporteille, where as the Khargits gain the right to 70% of the loot of any city that is conquered together with the Dieuporteilleans (because the Dieuporteilleans would likely supply siege equipment). Slaves will be split to the same ratio (Dieuporteille would likely call them serfs and not slaves, but you get the point). Possibly an inclusive thing would be the request for the Cossacks to leave any churches intact, and similarily, for the Cossacks to possibly convert.

b) They absolutely still resent each other, probably depending on how the two ambassadors interact. In which case, Dieuporteille would only fight if the king orders it, and they would do so begrudgingly. They'd probably argue with the Khargits over literally everything (you can't have the loot, you can't take slaves, leave this church intact or we'll execute you for heresy, etc) and they'd probably end up dealing blows to eachother.

I can't say which way it'll go but both will be interesting.

[Cyclone]

@Buddha

I'm caught red-handed, Khargit is indeed just a bastardized derivation of Khergit. My creativity has its limits. It would seem that my consistency does too, as there I spelled it Khargit but in my actual sheet it was Khargat. I guess I'll say that Khargat is the way I'll roll with now on.

I like your little story on the history and will see about implementing it into my sheet.

Do keep in mind that the Khargats are not the best of vassals by any measure. No largescale sacking of Dieuporteille would be going on in peacetime, but small bands might still roam about unwanted and the occasional skirmish or looting of a hamlet might happen. The Khan can't control all his fractious people even if he deigned to, and like the real Cossacks some of them are little more than glorified bandits or vagabonds that roam the realm. And I'm thinking that the Khargats would have been subjugated by Dieuporteille and the empire at most a hundred years ago, so I imagine that resentment might very well live on between the two peoples.

So all that being said, option B is far more likely. I'd imagine that Dieuporteille might really hate the pagan Khargats yet still tolerate them for the wealth that their traders bring across the Empire* and for the military support and profits that they can offer in war. I'd imagine that our two dignitaries would have that bitter rivalry, mistrust, and general loathing of one another that one would expect, though perhaps they'd keep reasonably good relations with one another out of mutual interests.

*It hasn't really been alluded to in my sheet yet, but Khargat merchant caravans travel throughout the empire and even beyond and have essentially monopolized the spice and slave trades. They also probably have a big stake in the salt and silk trades, so staying on their good side does bring some profit. But then again, profit would also come from being a jerk and just taxing the hell out of any Khargat trade routes that go through your province...

[@Everyone else]

I finished Chugo Bey's sheet, by the way. Now I just have the more daunting task of finishing the Khanate's sheet.

[Dion]

@Cyclone The mutual benefits was something I considered to be more of a factor than the history, but frankly that relies entirely on how your ambassador and mine see each other and this history..

As they say; 'we'll see.'

[Vec]

@Cyclone

Just so I am clear on this one thing. The Khargats came down from the mountains, right? So that means that my Belintashians were the first "southerners" they came across and fought with, I would assume.

[Cyclone]

@Cyclone

Just so I am clear on this one thing. The Khargats came down from the mountains, right? So that means that my Belintashians were the first "southerners" they came across and fought with, I would assume.

@Vec

I take it that Belintash doesn't extend across the entire northern side of the empire and the entire mountain range (because that'd make your province pretty huge) so I didn't specifically state that they came into contact with Belintash first. The first people that they came into contact with were conquered rapidly and essentially wiped off the map. Whether that would be some other state(s) further along the mountains or a former part of Belintash can be decided by you, but note that many of the Khargats remain in that hilly territory that they first conquered. While various groups move around because those foothills can't sustain all the nomads and their herds indefinitely, that land is sort of their stronghold and where they'd fall back to if they were pushed out of other regions.

So ultimately it makes sense to say that the Khargats came down and sacked a bunch of your cities and stole your land (and furthermore, that many of them remain on that conquered land in the modern day!) but I left it intentionally vague so as to not force that history upon you. But if you're fine with it, then that's cool and I can edit my sheet to be more specific regarding that initial invasion of the south.

[Flynn]

@The Narrator That's why I asked for one. ^^ I like Inquisitors. The bastards, haha.

Know that you can put -anything- in your character tab post. Go nuts on the history of your realms, great people, landmarks, etc etc. This isn't needed, but it adds some flavor and possible rivalries or mutual histories (more then there already are)

Cheers btw to the people who are really looking to intertwine the history and relations of their nations. Really makes the Empire come alive!

[Vec]

@Cyclone I'm fine with all that since it would make for some interesting developments when Chugo meets Layna. What I can't understand is how exactly the Khargats ended up in the Emperiat. I mean, they were supposed to be invaders, right? Earlier you said that they were subjugated by the Emperiat. How can they still live to modern day in their conquered lands if they were already subjugated :/

[Cyclone]

@Cyclone I'm fine with all that since it would make for some interesting developments when Chugo meets Layna. What I can't understand is how exactly the Khargats ended up in the Emperiat. I mean, they were supposed to be invaders, right? Earlier you said that they were subjugated by the Emperiat. How can they still live to modern day in their conquered lands if they were already subjugated :/

@Vec

When I get the history of them written I'll explain this, but to make a long story short I'm intending for it to go something like this:
1) They cross the mountains for reasons and obtain a stronghold in the foothills
2) Nobody nearby can stop them; they sweep across Emperiat on increasingly bold raids, going further and further south
3) They move to invade Dieuporteille to some success at first, but then are dealt a crushing defeat.
4) Following this opportunity, the Emperiat and their vassals (Dieuporteille being one of them) start pushing back at the various hordes of Khargats and try to brutally force them back across the mountains.
5) It's really taxing on both sides. Not all the nomads are warriors and so a lot of the children/women/elders in their camps are slaughtered, while the Empire is losing tons of soldiers and more and more settlements are being attacked as retaliation by the Khargats.
6) Finally, a peace is drafted and the Khargats get to keep the territories that they weren't pushed out of. They officially swear allegiance to the empire, but that's really more like a peace treaty and they are more or less completely autonomous. This was more or less a temporary solution for both sides.
7) Time passes. They start to become renowned traders throughout the land and support Emperiat on some military campaigns, so the uneasy status quo is maintained.
8) They are still pretty bad vassals and Khargat warbands continue to do small skirmishes and raids within the empire and outside, causing all sorts of diplomatic crises.
9) In response to this, the dead king (or perhaps his predecessor) curbs some of the Khanate's rights and tries to start centralizing them under his authority and bringing them in line. There are also moves to settle them so that they'll be more manageable as "cultured" agrarian people as compared to roving bands of nomadic pastoralists. This all faces fierce resistance and ultimately leads to the Khargats having a hand involved in the assassination of the last king.
10) Their current goal is to get the boy king to restore the Khanate to its prior state of near full autonomy, as well as maybe give them even more privileges such as grazing rights throughout the other provinces.

@Flynn

I was going to ask you about that business in #9 involving Andèris and whether you're okay with it. It makes for interesting backstory and some intrigue if anybody ever discovers the Khargat's involvement in his death. It also helps to explain who some of King Andèris' enemies were and what they hoping to achieve by killing him.