(Positive) Pagan/Nature Religion/Spirituality discussion

[Rogue Colm]

Having beliefs that fall under the Pagan umbrella and being inspired by the LGBT++ chat thread, I figured a thread for the non-Christian religions would be somewhat appropriate. This is NOT an anti-Christian discussion, just a way for the Pagans, Wiccans, Witches, Druids, Shamans, Buddhists, Taoists, etc. to just talk about religion and spirituality openly. I myself have some personal knowledge of Wicca, Shamanism, and Druidism, so feel free to ask questions (and feel free to answer others' questions if you know the subject better than I).

Purpose of this thread:
- Talk about your own beliefs, if you care to share
- Ask questions about other beliefs or concepts
- Have a good time just talking

PLEASE RESPECT ALL RELIGIONS. Please don't hate, flame, or otherwise bash another religion. This is purely to gather socially and talk about these things, not hurt others' beliefs.

[Cyndyr]

Oooh. This seems like this will certainly be an interesting topic. I'm not sure where I personally align on the religious spectrum, but I've always felt closer to my Wiccan and Spiritualist friends and their beliefs. I'd love to stick around and chat, maybe learn something about these religions if you don't mind. They've always been deeply fascinating to me!

[Dion]

Being Norse I can appreciate this thread. Not sure what to tell you though. There's so much to tell, and every single Norse pagan will tell you a different story because there's no facts when it comes to Norse paganism.

At least not many facts. If there's any questions I'll be glad to answer them however.

Also, if you ever find the time, the Hávamál is a great place to start reading Norse saga's.

[Rogue Colm]

I guess I'll add in my beliefs as well, to clarify.

I identify as Christo-Shamanic, as I have had a calling (and growing interest) towards Shamanism, but still feel comfortable in a Christian church. I practice magick and Tarot, but also pray and take communion. I'd describe it as being more than just Christian, rather than being half-Christian. I believe in God the Father, but also Goddess the Earth Mother and the Divine Source.

I often describe it in shorthand to others that Christianity is more the religion side and Shamanism is more the spirituality side (even though they overlap in certain areas).

[Dion]

@Rogue Colm Wouldn't you be able to say that, in laymans terms, that that mostly just relates to the occult side of Christianity? During medieval times this happened too, with tarot etc. but also in the supernatural that wasn't directly sourced from the Church but more so God/Nature etc.

Obviously there's more to it than that but even in medieval times/church this was basically how people that had a .. more abnormal interest in Christianity were described - occultists. Do you feel you can relate to that?

For me personally I don't have anything with that. Norse paganism is very bare bones when it comes to that. The most I can think of are the seers, gýðja's and goði's that dealt with that kind of stuff, and even then they were mostly just spiritual guidance and not fortunetellers and stuff like that (except maybe the seers). There's no occult side to Norse paganism.

In that way it's very different - it's less about supernatural forces and such and more so about living a life according to the stories of Óðinn, but above all, to live your own life and be strong and brave in that time.

It's for that reason we don't bend the knee to anyone unless they deserve it. Even Óðinn does not receive the privilege of my servitude. I don't beg him for favors but rather I ask him and offer him something in return. He's a god, yes, but he's still a man.

[Cyndyr]

It's for that reason we don't bend the knee to anyone unless they deserve it. Even Óðinn does not receive the privilege of my servitude. I don't beg him for favors but rather I ask him and offer him something in return. He's a god, yes, but he's still a man.

@Buddha

This is probably one of the best religious philosophies I've ever seen.

[Rogue Colm]

@Buddha True. I have heard a few churches that participated in "the occult", but the Shaman side of my beliefs is more so a reference to Native American Spirituality. I don't know my ancestors, so I don't claim to be of NA descent, but I have had a dream a "certified" Shaman claims is a Shaman's Journey. I have no physical proof, which is why I have all the disclaimers and quotes, but it seems to be more than just occult practices in Christianity.

And Norse Paganism does sound more direct in its ways.

[Dion]

<Snipped quote by Buddha>
This is probably one of the best religious philosophies I've ever seen.

@Cynder

It also means that I theoretically have to offer him bloodshed to get what I want. Translating Norse paganism into modern terms is a big pain in the ass.

For instance you are not allowed into Valhalla unless you die in battle. .. for some insight, that meant that old people that were dying of old age were handed a spear and sword, and were then stabbed repeatedly so that they 'died with a sword in their hands' just so they can go to Valhalla.

How does that translate to women? Short story: it doesn't. Long story: it does, but it requires you to die in childbirth (which is sometimes described as a battle even in old saga).

How does that translate to modern times? Short story: it doesn't. Long story: it does, but it requires you to always fight for what you think is right even if nobody else sides with you. So, a verbal battle is seen as a battle too.

But these are modern philosophies, so we are unsure if they are true, and so I am unsure if I will ever really go to Valhalla. I hope so, but only Óðinn decides if he sends the Valkyrja to get me. If so I can become Einherjar - one time warrior and fight in Ragnarök. If not.. then I will likely spend my eternity either 100% dead, or 100% in some other world that isn't as good as Valhalla.

Another thing that is required is 100% pure blood. It's described by 'jarl' being fair, with pale skin, blue eyes and blonde hair. He can go to Valhalla, since he is of the right blood, and from the right earth. (The North.) Jarl literally translates as a rank equal to duke. They were noble men.

Thrall on the other hand can't go to Valhalla - he is described as ugly, dumb and dark (likely meant for skin, but not in the 'white black' terms but in terms of tan. Because southerners were less pale than northerners, this could be anything from Italians, Spanish and Moors to Africans. There are 100% factual accounts of Vikingr in Greece, so who knows). He can't enter Valhalla.

Now my question is: that's nice, I have blue eyes and blonde hair and I am pale. But over the years it's possible my blood became impure. Can I still go to Valhalla?

These questions are deep fought within the Pagan community and I have to admit there's wide varieties of ideas and a lot of the ideas are straight up things I can't agree with. :/

[Cyndyr]

That's fascinating. Out of curiosity, what do you typically offer to Óðinn? In modern times, I mean.

[Rogue Colm]

@Buddha That's the good part about beliefs: you aren't required to believe exactly what those before you did. You make your own beliefs by choice.

[Dion]

@Cynder I've never had to ask Óðinn for help yet. Bravery and strength are things that are, quite literally, #1 on Óðinn's list of values you need to have. I can't be brave if I always ask him for stuff, and I can't show strength if I need his help in every battle.

Typically a variety of things were offered, mostly food. Eh, that means animals blood, animals meat, or live animals being slaughtered and offered to him at a runestone or holy place.

There's some accounts that also detail human sacrifice. .. varying accounts agree or disagree with these accounts. I honestly think it's very realistic that human sacrifices were real. Enemy soldiers were often captured as were slaves. I think the most favorable sacrifices were enemies of the Norse religion - so Christian lords that wanted to kill all the pagans and conquer the lands.

Then again it's important to notice that the Norse people were way ahead of most medieval societies. Slaves had rights (they were pretty much equal to the serfs of medieval European countries) and were allowed to privately own items, own money, and buy their freedom. Most slaves were treated well. Masters weren't allowed to beat their slaves for no reason.

Fun note also was that the Vikings dabbled in hygiene long before the more Southern medieval people did.

[Dion]

@Rogue Colm Indeed, I have adapted the beliefs to what I think Óðinn would want from me now. Óðinn wasn't the vengeful man that the world thinks he is and wasn't only after war. In fact the vikings were more capable explorers and traders than they were warriors. It just happened to be so that they were also magnificent fighters.

Respect was a big thing for Óðinn which is why I find it so sad that a lot of our symbols (no, all of our symbols) were taken by the Nazi's and used for shitty shit.

My necklace has a Sonnenrad/Odal circle rune on it.

Sonnenrad/Odal circle

Center piece.

Compare it with the white power logo:

WP logo

It's embarrassing really. I still wear my necklace and I don't really care, but in America I'd probably get a lot of shifty looks.

[Celaira]

Wow. This seems really interesting. I've always been really into learning about Religion, personally. I don't particularly perscribe to any one belief, however, I have done some research into Wicca, and a little into Druidism. I'd love to hear more about Norse Religion/Culture. I had a friend who worshiped the "old gods" as she called them, but she never really explained what that meant.

I'm gonna go back through the thread and read everything again, now. :)

[Mao Mao]

This seems interesting to talk about my religion and what I believe in. I am believe in multiple Gods and Goddesses (it's called polytheism, but I don't see myself as apart of the Neopagan movement). I can't stand how one God was able to make all of this happen. It's impossible for someone, like God, to make the whole universe on his own. With multiple Gods and Goddesses, the main creator can have some breathing room while his children do many of his works.

I don't know what kind of religion that would classified me as, but I don't care about that. I just believe that there are multiple Gods and Goddesses out there rather than one and powerful God. I guess that names for my religion that I believe in won't affect me at all. Just gives me something to call it.

I need to do more research into it someday, if I grow curious enough.

[Dion]

Just wondering if there's any Romuva believers?

[Dinh AaronMk]

Just wondering if there's any Romuva believers?

@Buddha

Do Lithuanians have internet?

[Dion]

@Dinh AaronMk You don't have to live in Lithuania to be Romuva, but yes, Lithuanians do have internet.

[Wade Wilson]

hm, debating whether or not to participate in this as what i believe in isn't classified to a religion (at least i haven't discovered one yet), and my beliefs sound more like the ramblings of a dc movie villain than spiritual beliefs.

[Dion]

@Wade Wilson if it's alternative it's probably postable here.

[Little Bill]

I was raised with Santeria from my father -- A white guy whose first language is Spanish, brought up in South Miami after Fidel got rid of all those cubans -- and Wicca from my hippie mother. I've since left both, finding Wicca to have changed from a secretive, personal, ritual-based faith to a bunch of edgy teenagers following things that are objectively untrue with the birth of the internet, whereas Santeria is 2spooky to mention in casual conversation and makes people bust out their cultural appropriation pitchforks. If anyone has questions on either, I'd love to answer them. I'm not really spiritual anymore, but for what it's worth, there is still a Chango effigy at the top of my stairs I blow smoke at for good luck every once in a while.

Didn't realize phone pictures were this big.