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Hidden 7 yrs ago 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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Everyone at the unite the right rally which is supposed to be about a bunch of different right groups coming together is a full on Jew blasting Nazi :DDD

And a professor/government official being a gommunist is perfectly okey-dokey

Remember we have to focus on the right fringe groups nobody cares about the left ones :)
Hidden 7 yrs ago 7 yrs ago Post by Dolerman
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Everyone at the unite the right rally which is supposed to be about a bunch of different right groups coming together is a full on Jew blasting Nazi :DDD




apparently these were self reported, looks about right, but there was probably some overlap with the groups.

So much for the proud boys not associating with nazis/WNs.

EDIT: and lol oathkeepers rbbing shoulders with alt right


Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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That chart is a load of bullshit. Altright is the stupidest term ever which in the West can describe any right winger different from a neo-con/mitt-romney-bush-etc. Crowd. Monarchists are technically and alternative right, as an example. Yet not that many of them are the frogposters associated with the AR in one's mind.
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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The alt-right, or alternative right, is a loosely defined group of people with far-right ideologies who reject mainstream conservatism in favor of white nationalism.


I think the only other right wing people are

neo-con/mitt-romney-bush-etc. Crowd.


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Just so I have all my flavors of Nazi straight. What are Alt Knights & Proud boys?
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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<Snipped quote>

I think the only other right wing people are

<Snipped quote by Andreyich>


Okay then the only two left groups are SJWs and Communists.
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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Okay then the only two left groups are SJWs and Communists.

Mostly, yes. Though switch communist with socialist.
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Some of these things are kinda the same...
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Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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At that point we disagree on the very nature of morality/politics on an internal base that can't really be overwritten. I think you shouldn't categorize political groups so lightly and I disagree, that's alright and all but when incompatible in such a way views collide I gotta say I cannot really discuss this with ya.
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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Also that chart adds up to 102% as the total amount of people attending. Either the maker of it cannot count, was very lazy or or accounted for the overlap.
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by Penny
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If your group is willing to parade around with a literal mob of torch bearing, card carrying Nazis, my interest in doing nuance goes way down for some reason.
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Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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@Andreyich I don't mean to offend. I just see so many people polarized between left and right, and I'll have to say at least the loud members of each group are pretty similar to one another. The state of affairs between ideologies and parties has gotten so stark and aggressive that I'm even a bit ashamed to call myself an Independent, because the Independent party did nothing good this past election. I have to clarify I am Independent 'Other'.

But that's just a clarification to you for why I speak in such a way. I do know that right wing people have smaller groups that believe differently than other right wing people, as do the left.
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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I know you do not mean to offend, I just meant to say that you and I for our own reasons think of the political scene and affiliations in different ways which are ultimately incompatible and thus cannot lead to fruitful dialogue in the context of this subject.
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Hidden 7 yrs ago 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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As for the people standing alongside the nazis, it's not their fault only the nazis agree on their demands for say, not having jobs outsourced or "insourced." If I have a certain issue I'm trying to get people to solve I'll take help from a man be he D. Duke or Castro.

To expand, unite the right implies that the common ground of various groups is to be supported. Proud boys and more moderates are not going to agree a lot but they will push the issues they agree on i.e. immigration, etc. Francisco Franco was a sort of one man uniter of the right. German nazis, theocrats, Carlists, Radical Capitalists, and others were swept aside all into the Falange Hispaniola, a party moderate on most issues except resistance to communism.

Also, American/Western panty wetting at the nazis in their own state but acceptance of them in Ukraine baffles me.
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by POOHEAD189
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As for the people standing alongside the nazis, it's not their fault only the nazis agree on their demands for say, not having jobs outsourced or "insourced." If I have a certain issue I'm trying to get people to solve I'll take help from a man be he D. Duke or Castro.


Ok, I'll have to completely disagree with that. Hitler was a vegetarian, but that doesn't mean vegetarians would join a Nazi rally led by Hitler because they happened to have one similar goal. In fact it hurts their platform.
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it's not their fault only the nazis agree on their demands


If you find yourself with alot of common ground with Nazis, you seriously need to examine what you are doing with your life.
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by Dolerman
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Just so I have all my flavors of Nazi straight. What are Alt Knights & Proud boys?


I have no idea what an Alt Knight is, they probably play Crusader Kings 2



Proud Boys are a Fraternity/Gang thing created by gavin mcinnes, they claim to be civic nationalists and not care about race, gavin mcginnes is a race mixer and seen as an edgy cuck.

They really do come across as one of the most cringe e-groups to spout from a meme ideology, and this is coming from someone who has to deal with libertarians every week.

Hidden 7 yrs ago 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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<Snipped quote by Andreyich>

If you find yourself with alot of common ground with Nazis, you seriously need to examine what you are doing with your life.


Golly gee then anti-gun environmentalist etc. Etc. Groups should go fug themselves for being too similar to hitler.

And the whole "lol you got this one similarity with Nazis so you are a Nazi thus irrelevant" is a really retarded way to think of the matter and is why normal people become nazis or some other radical.
Hidden 7 yrs ago Post by Andreyich
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Also since it would probably be missed due to being an edit

To expand, unite the right implies that the common ground of various groups is to be supported. Proud boys and more moderates are not going to agree a lot but they will push the issues they agree on i.e. immigration, etc. Francisco Franco was a sort of one man uniter of the right. German nazis, theocrats, Carlists, Radical Capitalists, and others were swept aside all into the Falange Hispaniola, a party moderate on most issues except resistance to communism.

Also, American/Western panty wetting at the nazis in their own state but acceptance of them in Ukraine baffles me.
Hidden 7 yrs ago 7 yrs ago Post by The Harbinger of Ferocity
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There is information circling around as well that suggests a number of these participants on both sides, agitators really, are paid actors otherwise known as shills. Some of the inconsistencies arise from the fact a good amount of the actual Nazi regalia seems to be fresh mint and press - many flags with creases from being boxed and their colors not worn. Other indicators are that the Unite the Right rally itself has ties to the Far Left in its organizers who, until just now, had only just aligned themselves with Trump during his campaign; the same people you might remember him disavowing during his run and was played by the media in much the same way they are now (that Trump and his party are all Nazis or sympathizers).

This becomes more worrisome because the Charlottesville rally was a legal demonstration. It had an actual lawful permit to be held; the counter-protest did not and there was no vetting to keep the two extremely hostile sides divided from one another, first seen with the candle and torch rally on the night of the 11th. This escalated as more outsiders from leftist extremist groups like Antifa and Black Lives Matter came in on the next day. Before the demonstration had even started, the police had still yet to seperate them. We all know what happens next as the mayor overrides the permit to assemble, the police funnel in two violent groups and chaos ensues.

What I take away from this now and where we are at in conversation is that the Alt-Right here, those who received that label, are a myriad of opposing forces. In fact, I spoke to this eons ago in this very topic that the "Right" is at war with itself; you can see this in the Republican party actively fighting Trump to the Trump supporters booing, fighting and apprehending Nazi disruption during old rallies he held prior to election and to now where we are, when an event called "Unite the Right" is held to collaborate.

The "Southern Nationalists" are exactly who you would think they would be. They are the traditional angle that people have stereotyped them into with a fresh coat of Alt-Right paint slathered on them by the leftists and the media. The Nazis, who by being Nazis are not technically "Right Wing" other than their tendency for extreme Authoritarianism (which is independent thereof), are one of the few who fall under that actual label in its first uses. It seems guilty by association is very much alive despite them being outcasts from the "Alt-Right".

The "Alt-Right" presented here is an entire spectrum of ideals. You have everything from your Neo-Cons, Libertarians, Traditionalists, Isolationists, Republicans to your extreme fringes like Ancaps. They are only as "Alt-Right" as each individual might be; they are a mess of competing identities.

The Proud Boys and Alt Knights were organized internally to make a display and show up - most of those flying the white and black flag, wielding shields and batons - and act as regulators. As said by others, they are an internet movement come to life that believes in "pro-Western values". By their own accord, they are "Alt-Lite", which is to say quite accurate; they are a very tame organization and have not yet defined themselves given how recent they are (originating in 2016 officially). As a whole, they just seem to be an organized form of the "Alt-Right" with deep roots in online personality.

Then comes the 3%'ers who are a traditionalist, minimalist, Constitutional organization with extensive paramilitary training and doctrine. Interestingly, they were born out of an abandoning of left-wing politics and socialism. The Oath Keepers are not far removed, the two oft working together, who stand for "the defense of the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic". Both of these groups are unrelated to the rest, appearing in just about every rally where conflict is expected. They are not so much "Alt-Right" as they are a modern militia, but as one can imagine, the Far Left is none too fond of their motives and operations.

What does this all mean?

The label here you are seeing applied maybe makes up half of those who are the actual Alt-Right and not the "Alt-Right". The amount of spin bring shoveled on by the media should be the subject of ridicule, mind you they are the same people who blackmailed someone over a video they didn't like. The short of the story is that the local and state government failed horribly, allowed two extremely dangerous groups of people to mingle, let them fight, and then pushed them into a fatal funnel that then killed someone.

Where is there not condemnation for the counter-protesters turning this into a riot? Why is the President of the United States receiving blame for not explicitly condemning "white nationalists" when he exclusively spoke against all forms of violent extremism? Why is the mayor, who I add has Far Left ties, not being put under a thorough review along with his chief of police for failing to control a riot that led to a death and two policemen dying in an accident? Why is it that all of the Trump base, such as The_Donald or even /pol/, unable to find talk about the organization of this on their own sites despite being extremely active in this sort of protest like they were for Berkerley? Why is there a huge amount of paid shills pushing misinformation on the internet about Charlottesville in just about every comment section?

Call this cat mad, but this is absolutely out of lane.

This is more important to note with where we are in conversation. Calling a person a "Nazi" has lost so much impact that the actual Nazis now blend in. What do I mean by this? When you view everyone who holds the ideals of "Our country we care about first!" as fascism, suddenly everyone who isn't a globalist is a fascist nationalist. Now add in that these people are likely to believe "Illegal immigrants most go." to varying shades and that we need a border wall, now suddenly they too are racists. Racists? Fascists? Sounds like Nazism to me.

This becomes even worse in the "echo chambers", to borrow terminology, of very liberal, left leaning schools up to college. Because now you are subject to indoctrination, where this myth is repeated; that some how socialism and communism are ideal and good for everyone, but politely stripped of those nasty details like Hitler's Germany or the Soviet Union, let alone Communist China and the Great Leap Forward. Everyone who opposes this must be Nazis as we established - who wouldn't want free health care? If you do not, you must support the idea of people dying! Free birth control and abortions? Everyone deserves that because they are so expensive. If you are against that, you must be a misogynist.

Very quickly one can witness how this evolves to where we are now. Everyone must be a Nazi if they are against any of these things. The amount of overlap, despite obvious failings in logic, is startling. I say this because at bare minimum, anyone looking from the outside in can tell you that the Right has no semblance of unity in its message or approach (the failed repeal of healthcare is the best current example I have).

In contrast, the "Social Justice Warrior" department are much easier to peg by their competition, despite this term now too having less an effect because the divide is so massive in the two. Odds would suggest that if you are going to call someone that, they likely do hold a number of those beliefs because of that overlap and immersion they are in. The Left as a whole generally agrees on their tenants as it is right now.

Does this make it right, let alone polite to throw labels around? Absolutely not, but we are at that stage of insanity where this is the norm.
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