[OOC] Precipice of War - The Big Leagues of NRP (Only generous tippers need apply)

[Letter Bee]

@Dinh AaronMk

Big thanks. I'll try and work up a sheet on my phone while I wait for Amazon to send me a new charger for my laptop.

So far I'm thinking that the Netherlands managed to do fairly well after the great war given it had been spared the wars ravages on manpower and personnel. While still suffering from the depression in Europe the Dutch managed to make a pretty penny off oil, rubber, and other cash crops or resources from the east indies and managed to get through the worst of it.

With that I'd say the depression in Europe promoted significant Dutch immigration to the colonies for work, something which helped to solidify the Netherlands rule. Moreover the depression saw the ethical policy weakened, something that likely damaged the formation of Indonesian national consciousness as was the case in reality.

I'm thinking the current situation in the Europe would be a fairly rich but militarily lacking Netherlands while the state of affairs in the colonies would be one of increasing dissent. I imagine the bulk of the Dutch military would be in the colonies at rp start as a result of this.

@Quetzalcoatl

It seems we will be in conflict then; I am Philippines.

[Dinh AaronMk]

@Dinh AaronMk

Big thanks. I'll try and work up a sheet on my phone while I wait for Amazon to send me a new charger for my laptop.

So far I'm thinking that the Netherlands managed to do fairly well after the great war given it had been spared the wars ravages on manpower and personnel. While still suffering from the depression in Europe the Dutch managed to make a pretty penny off oil, rubber, and other cash crops or resources from the east indies and managed to get through the worst of it.

With that I'd say the depression in Europe promoted significant Dutch immigration to the colonies for work, something which helped to solidify the Netherlands rule. Moreover the depression saw the ethical policy weakened, something that likely damaged the formation of Indonesian national consciousness as was the case in reality.

I'm thinking the current situation in the Europe would be a fairly rich but militarily lacking Netherlands while the state of affairs in the colonies would be one of increasing dissent. I imagine the bulk of the Dutch military would be in the colonies at rp start as a result of this.

@Quetzalcoatl

I wouldn't say they got off as Scott free as you seem to be implying. The IRL great war greatly threatened Dutch imports and food shortages were, according to my research fairly common. You're also combining this with an influx of refugees and the Netherlands being pretty much forced by then international law to hold any soldier who escaped, wandered, or was captured in Dutch territory for the duration of the war. So on top of German U-boat campaigns threatening imports and hampering Dutch food shipments you have a rising or otherwise large population of nationals to look after; and both they and the local population often rioted.

A depression may not leave the colonies free either, since they'd be as dependent on Dutch banks. The Germans waged unrestricted submarine warfare too, knowingly attacking neutral vessels at sea in order to disrupt the economies of its enemies. If the Dutch were at all involved in selling rubber or oil or any food stuff to the British they would be as much a target of the Germans as the British. This is not just a war-time explanation for Dutch food shortages during the war, but may also trickle into the post-war period with a severely damaged merchant marine. Moving goods from the colonies to home and abroad would be severely limited for a time without the ships to move it and incurring only further expenses.

And when everyone's suffering from a shortage of cash, I'm sure the least they want is to go into another setting as dependent on that same economy to take the risk to lose more, if they can afford to move at all. The Netherlands aren't the same as the north coast of South America or the Pacific, and growing tea isn't nearly the same as harvesting wheat or tulips.

[Quetzalcoatl]

@Dinh AaronMkYou probably know more than I do, I'll take a few days and read up on the Netherlands before/during WW1 before settling on anything specific then.

From what you described I might think about there having been a coup or revolution during or shortly after the great war. Food shortages, refugees, rioting, seems possible something happened there. Especially if the war lasted so long.

As for the merchant fleet, that would be a significant issue. I'll have to rethink the situation in the colonies.

Hm.

[Shyri]

Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Can't write an app yet but I'll probably do something centered around one of those two areas. I was just asking in case there was something established in canon. When I joined PoW back in the day Russia already had some established states so I was wondering if any remnant of that lore is being kept.

@Pepperm1nts

Also, if you go for a government in St. Petersburg, we can roll with saying it's funded/supported by the Germans as the "true" Russian government. Don't really have the reach if you go for a Moscow-based one though.

@The Spectre
I think that, by the fifties, the British would be well off enough to retaliate in force to any attempt at their Caribbean territories.

[Dinh AaronMk]

<Snipped quote by Pepperm1nts>

Also, if you go for a government in St. Petersburg, we can roll with saying it's funded/supported by the Germans as the "true" Russian government. Don't really have the reach if you go for a Moscow-based one though.

@Shyri

To make things funner we can toss a third city into the mix, if my knowledge of the source of the Russian nation banter is correct; though this is in a post-Soviet world.

Folk say it's Saint Petersburg, because that's what Czar Peter built and he's the one that officially founded the Russian state. Muscovites claim it's Moscow because Moscow was at the center of the state Peter was born into and ruled from to found Russia, never mind he moved the capital of the Empire to Sankt Petersburg.

Then there's the people of Novgorod, who have the claim to the Rurik dynasty who came on invitation to impose order and whose dynasty moved out from to seize the lands that made the Rus kingdoms. Though this claim may be nationally small, but that's also because the Soviets repressed Rurik's legacy because it was too foreign, Danish/Swedish in fact.

But in any case since the royal family had ties to the Germans and also invited many Germans to live in the Empire itself the precedent for German involvement in the area is already pretty strong either way.

[Vilageidiotx]

While Europe was still fighting each other, Central America was planning reunification of El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras and Costa Rica. Nicaragua eventually joined the Federation of Central America when it was formed in 1922. Panama and British Belize refused to joined the Federation; however, the Federation looked towards Mexico for land. The country had been struggling for awhile and it was caught off by the Central American army. Once it became clear that Mexico lost, they signed a peace treaty that made them give up all lands east of Veracruz and Oaxaca. It was the Federation's first major victory against a foreign power.

Then, the government decided that it was time to focus on expanding southwards. The nations in South America had been dealing with the economic depression The weak army wasn't ready for the decent Central American military as they invaded in July, 16th 1940. And within a month and a half, Colombia surrounded and signed a treaty that forced them to be landlocked. They also lost almost all of their oil fields, making their economic depression much worse. Their next target was Venezuela, which had been struggling under a dictator, to obtain their oil fields also. A year after the attack on Colombia, the Federation went to war on August 3rd, 1941.

Central America became the second oil producer next to the United States during the forties, making them rich. And during the Second Civil War, many Americans sought refugee in Central America and some even stayed once the Civil War ended. And the Federation began a new campaign that detailed several invasions of the Caribbean islands in the fifties by invading Jamaica, Cayman Island, and Trinidad & Tobago. The election of 1960 looked like that the conservative Rhett Herring was going to win. If he were to win, he would be the first American elected president in the country's history. However, the other candidates are using his American identity against him.

@The Spectre

wtf, are you writing an app or playing Risk? thats way too much conquering. stick with the central american countries dude

[Pepperm1nts]

Disregard

[Lone Wanderer]

I might be interested in taking over the UK if they have not already been claimed.

Generally what kind of situation would the UK be facing as of the RP's start? From what I've read it seems they've lost most of their colonial territories and dominions, and with Germany maintaining it's unrestricted submarine warfare I imagine they faced a lack of resources throughout the war which might still be affecting their economy today.

[Mao Mao]

<Snipped quote by The Spectre>

wtf, are you writing an app or playing Risk? thats way too much conquering. stick with the central american countries dude

@Vilageidiotx

lol, alright I can move away from the Caribbean. However, I am not going to revoke my claims in Mexico and South America. I can change the history to make taking those areas more realistic but I am not just going to stick with the Central American countries.

[Meiyuuhi]

<Snipped quote by Pepperm1nts>

Also, if you go for a government in St. Petersburg, we can roll with saying it's funded/supported by the Germans as the "true" Russian government. Don't really have the reach if you go for a Moscow-based one though.

@The Spectre
I think that, by the fifties, the British would be well off enough to retaliate in force to any attempt at their Caribbean territories.

@Shyri

Oy, oy, get out of my region comrade. You've already got Poland and Lithuania, but you can't stick your fingers in every pie you find~

<Snipped quote by Shyri>

To make things funner we can toss a third city into the mix, if my knowledge of the source of the Russian nation banter is correct; though this is in a post-Soviet world.

Folk say it's Saint Petersburg, because that's what Czar Peter built and he's the one that officially founded the Russian state. Muscovites claim it's Moscow because Moscow was at the center of the state Peter was born into and ruled from to found Russia, never mind he moved the capital of the Empire to Sankt Petersburg.

Then there's the people of Novgorod, who have the claim to the Rurik dynasty who came on invitation to impose order and whose dynasty moved out from to seize the lands that made the Rus kingdoms. Though this claim may be nationally small, but that's also because the Soviets repressed Rurik's legacy because it was too foreign, Danish/Swedish in fact.

But in any case since the royal family had ties to the Germans and also invited many Germans to live in the Empire itself the precedent for German involvement in the area is already pretty strong either way.

@Dinh AaronMk

Also that Moscow was the capital and namesake of the Grand Duchy of Muscovy, which was the predecessor of the Russian state. So it has greater historical roots and legitimacy.

I was thinking about using the Kievan Rus as the basis of a new claim to East Slavic hegemony myself.

Also, welcome back Hugs, good to see you again.

[Brithwyr]

This is just the map claim for now. Will finish later

Claim

The Great Eastern Commonwealth

Location (on map):

History:

Other: (Throw misc stuff here, Vilage can pretend this doesn't exist.)

[Meiyuuhi]

Ah, and here's what I think my map claim entails on this map as well. I included Bolshevik Ukraine simply because that's a vital part of my canon and I'll be controlling it as the main antagonistic group for my country for at least the first several months. (Also, it's impossible to clearly delineate with this level of province detail) Crimea is still perfectly open for someone else to control since it's not critically relevant, but if no one does I'll end up RPing using them as well.

New Map

[Pepperm1nts]

<Snipped quote by Vilageidiotx>

lol, alright I can move away from the Caribbean. However, I am not going to revoke my claims in Mexico and South America. I can change the history to make taking those areas more realistic but I am not just going to stick with the Central American countries.

@The Spectre

One problem I have is believing that a Central American league can somehow defeat Mexico and Colombia. Both of those countries would fuck up Central America, IMO. Then there's the fact that I find it iffy when players hoard territories for no real reason. Remember there are other players interested in the RP and we need to be generous with our claims. You're already taking all of Central America. That should be enough.

On a related note, I think Poland and the Baltic State should be greyed out on the map because they are technically open. It gives the wrong impression when they are shown as if they are fully integrated parts of Germany.

And hi minhdar.

[Mao Mao]

<Snipped quote by The Spectre>

One problem I have is believing that a Central American league can somehow defeat Mexico and Colombia. Both of those countries would fuck up Central America, IMO. Then there's the fact that I find it iffy when players hoard territories for no real reason. Remember there are other players interested in the RP and we need to be generous with our claims. You're already taking all of Central America. That should be enough.

On a related note, I think Poland and the Baltic State should be greyed out on the map because they are technically open. It gives the wrong impression when they are shown as if they are fully integrated parts of Germany.

And hi minhdar.

@Pepperm1nts

And if I just have the Central America territories, then I would get fucked by Mexico and Colombia. My claims are designed to give them pause before they decide to attack since I would be fairly powerful. Central America isn't like the United States or Europe. It doesn't have a strong economy since they have to be centered around agricultural products. Unlike the northern part of South America, they have a ton of oil. And oil produces way more money than food. That is the reason why I have taken lands from Colombia and Venezuela since it's where most of the oil is located.

If I have decided to stay in Central America, then I would be in a weak state. And that would give Mexico and/or Colombia reason to attack and take land.

[Pepperm1nts]

No one is playing those countries yet though, so you have nothing to worry about. And if you're agreeing they would likely win a conventional war, then you agree it doesn't quite make sense for them to have lost like it says in your app.

Now, all this isn't to say some nations are doomed to be steamrolled by others. In PoW history, two Finns took down Russia, and that happened in IC way back in the day. And it was awesome. What's not as awesome is when crazy stuff like that happens in an app for no real reason besides "i want clay". You can go to war with those countries and maybe win, but do it in IC with a good reason and with cool posts.

[Meiyuuhi]

If I have decided to stay in Central America, then I would be in a weak state. And that would give Mexico and/or Colombia reason to attack and take land.

@The Spectre

This isn't EU4 or Civilization or something. Mexico and Colombia aren't just going to randomly attack you and take land for no logical reason other than simple expansion, for the same reason that Mexico and Colombia don't do that in real life. Mexico hasn't fought a war with an external power since 1867, and Colombia since 1933 (and that war ended with no transfer of territory).

Even if a player does take over, I consider the likelihood of them actually consistently IC posting fairly low. There's a reason South America was considered the Bermuda Triangle of players last RP.

[Shyri]

<Snipped quote by Pepperm1nts>
And if I just have the Central America territories, then I would get fucked by Mexico and Colombia. My claims are designed to give them pause before they decide to attack since I would be fairly powerful. Central America isn't like the United States or Europe. It doesn't have a strong economy since they have to be centered around agricultural products. Unlike the northern part of South America, they have a ton of oil. And oil produces way more money than food. That is the reason why I have taken lands from Colombia and Venezuela since it's where most of the oil is located.

If I have decided to stay in Central America, then I would be in a weak state. And that would give Mexico and/or Colombia reason to attack and take land.

@The Spectre

And now that you've taken land, it gives Mexico, Columbia, Britain, and whoever else wants a slice of that Central American pie a reason to work together to bring you down. Not to mention rebels occupy more than half your claims, most of the infrastructure for getting that oil would've been damaged in your initial invasions, aaaand there's no way rebels would let you peacefully collect it. Central America has occupied the territories for less than ten years. Their control of the state is going to be weak, at best.

Basically, taking all that land fucks you over more than just taking Central America proper ever would.

<Snipped quote by Shyri>
Oy, oy, get out of my region comrade. You've already got Poland and Lithuania, but you can't stick your fingers in every pie you find~

@Mihndar

I mean, hey. The Kaiser has a claim on the Russian crown. I could just assert German power in Russia via that. But supporting a government run by one of his cousins seems like a better way to go about it. Hell, even his wife has a claim on the throne.

Edit: And, you know. Sticking fingers in other people's pie is kind of what the Germans have a history of doing.

[Brithwyr]

I would suggest playing an ideological standpoint. IRL the big source of tension in this era was Communist vs Capitalist. A little earlier you even had Fascism in the mix. South America could put a lot of pressure on the US by being communist or fascist.

[Apple]

Nation: Republic of Ireland

Location (on map):below

History: Recently passing the `Republic of Ireland Act`, Ireland breaks away from the commonwealth into full independence. Parts of the island still don't have electricity, the nation is half-developed. The new government attempts to prepare itself for the uncertain future. All the while the situation in Northern Ireland, a part of the United Kingdom, looks doubtful.

Other

My Hider

Amhrán na bhFiann/A Soldier's Song
youtube.com/watch?v=tuCOcLrW9Mo

[Vilageidiotx]

Nation: Republic of Ireland

Location (on map):below

History: Recently passing the `Republic of Ireland Act`, Ireland breaks away from the commonwealth into full independence. Parts of the island still don't have electricity, the nation is half-developed. The new government attempts to prepare itself for the uncertain future. All the while the situation in Northern Ireland, a part of the United Kingdom, looks doubtful.

Other

My Hider

Amhrán na bhFiann/A Soldier's Song
youtube.com/watch?v=tuCOcLrW9Mo

@Apple

gonna need more words. this is a readin' mans rp