Mahz's Dev Journal

[Captain Jordan]

<Stuff about @Mentions>

@Mahz

I like these. I definitely like Quote and Reply as different buttons. In other forums, quote sometimes just injects the quoted post inside quote tags and pops it into the Quick Reply box. Meaning one can quote from multiple sources without doing a bunch of copy/paste jumps and trickery.

Also, I'm moving the userbit for each post from the left side to the top. _{Wasn't the guild like that before guildfall?}

@Mahz

http://nooooooooooooooo.com I prefer the left-aligned postbit. It makes it easy for me to keep track of which post belongs to who, and while it doesn't look as pretty, I think it's easier to read.

And, in other news, I'm playing with some much more readable typography, sizing, and spacing for the guild's posts. Helvetica (default font for the CSS framework I'm using) is just so hard to read. Captain Jordan pointed this out a year ago, but you can barely even see when posts are emboldened. _{← Did u notice?}

@Mahz

Better fonts are always a good thing. :D

[Mahz]

Also, I'm moving the userbit for each post from the left side to the top. _{Wasn't the guild like that before guildfall?}

@Mahz

http://nooooooooooooooo.com I prefer the left-aligned postbit. It makes it easy for me to keep track of which post belongs to who, and while it doesn't look as pretty, I think it's easier to read.

@Captain Jordan

Yeah, I hear you. On a desktop-sized browser, less horizontal width on post content also makes posts more readable. That's where the left-side userbit makes particular sense. Also, with userbits on the top of each post, the avatar introduces a 150+px gutter before you even reach the post's content. I'm just trying to consolidate my effort. Too much view-layer duplication right now. :(

[Shienvien]

Also, I'm moving the userbit for each post from the left side to the top. Wasn't the guild like that before guildfall?

I really do not like this kind of positioning, to be honest (including on cell phones - a lot of space you'd just be scrolling over)... It generates a lot of visual layout-breakup between the posts and makes the forums look far more disorganized. (I sometimes disable signatures just for this reason - fluff between posts is often distracting clutter more than anything. Especially in IC.) And no, the Guild did not have this kind of layout before the "guildfall."

[Mahz]

Also, I'm moving the userbit for each post from the left side to the top. Wasn't the guild like that before guildfall?

I really do not like this kind of positioning, to be honest... It generates a lot of visual layout-breakup between the posts and makes the forums look far more disorganized. (I sometimes disable signatures just for this reason - fluff between posts is distracting clutter more than anything. Especially in IC.) And no, the Guild did not have this kind of layout before the "guildfall."

@Shienvien

Yeah, I like how left-sided userbits make the post content flow together rather than being punctuated over and over again with, say, Mahz's avatar, join date, post count, user title, etc that you see every. single. time. Ah, so I reverted back to userbits-on-the-left at some point on oldguild. Heh, even worse. I suppose I can just hold off on the userbit extensions I have in mind, then. I don't want to downgrade some people's experience for some ancillary features. I may just have to deal with the view layer complexity.

[Shienvien]

Yeah, I like how left-sided userbits make the post content flow together rather than being punctuated over and over again with, say, Mahz's avatar, join date, post count, user title, etc that you see every. single. time. Ah, so I reverted back to userbits-on-the-left at some point on oldguild. Heh, even worse.

@Mahz

If OldGuild ever had this kind of userinfo-above-post layout, then it must have been done away with before late 2010 ... I never got to witness it. But yes, I am glad if this gets forever withheld... It just looks, er, somewhat aesthetically challenged.

[Mahz]

If OldGuild ever had this kind of userinfo-above-post layout, then it must have been done away before late 2010 ... I never got to witness it.

@Shienvien

Ah, just 2007-2009: https://web.archive.org/web/20090330105033/http://roleplayerguild.com/f3/important-please-read-16338/

[LegendBegins]

Also, I'm moving the userbit for each post from the left side to the top. _{Wasn't the guild like that before guildfall?} It makes it easier for me to extend the userbit with information since there's more room. It's actually implemented on the current site if you shrink the width of your window: I bent over backwards to get that working. Making all userbits display on top will simplify the code and reduce potential rendering issues across differently sized devices (once I'm ready to toggle on mobile-view support). If enough people are significantly opinionated about where the userbit should go, I can eventually turn it into a configurable setting. And, in other news, I'm playing with some much more readable typography, sizing, and spacing for the guild's posts. Helvetica (default font for the CSS framework I'm using) is just so hard to read. Captain Jordan pointed this out a year ago, but you can barely even see when posts are emboldened. _{← Did u notice?}

@Mahz

Excellent job, Mahz. The userbit bar at the top will also provide a perfect location for the "current character" information/status consideration. Though the above opinions do have a good point, I believe it should remain when the width is restricted, as to prevent extremely narrow posts. A customizable view would be convenient, though I feel bad that you put so much effort into this.

[Ellri]

Reading flow would be kinda obstructed if moving the user bits to the top means that those 150ish pixels extra are used for the post. Its hard enough already to read the very wide posts. It wouldn't be easier if it were even wider.

[BBeast]

If you do grant GMs the power over posts in their thread (something which could possibly be abused), then a system which puts the post in a large hider would be safest, for it allows the post to be hidden from view but still available to be read if need be. But a Report button to call a mod to a particular post would be a good idea too. How about give the mods the power to put posts in large hiders? Another tool in their toolbox.

@BBeast

Hiders are BBCode. Put the post in a hider, and I can just go in and edit my post to remove it. Take away my edit powers, you say? That also removes the right for someone to have control over their own posts, it's effectively deleted them (as you can find most deleted posts anyways through cached versions at Google or via the Wayback machine).

@Captain Jordan

By large hider, I meant something which functioned in a similar way as a hider, not a BBCode hider (although I wasn't clear). Some option which hides the whole post's contents until you click on it. Whether such an option would be useful or not, though, I'm not sure.

[Hank]

And, in other news, I'm playing with some much more readable typography, sizing, and spacing for the guild's posts. Helvetica (default font for the CSS framework I'm using) is just so hard to read. Captain Jordan pointed this out a year ago, but you can barely even see when posts are emboldened. _{← Did u notice?}

@Mahz

It's actually very noticeable on Windows. I can always identify a Mac user by the way text looks in their screenshots. The fact that, for you, emboldened text is hard to distinguish from regular text has more to do with the subpixel rendering that MacOS uses than the Helvetica font. Windows's ClearType makes text thinner and gives it more anti-aliasing than a Mac does.

It's actually very noticeable on Windows. I can always identify a Mac user by the way text looks in their screenshots. The fact that, for you, emboldened text is hard to distinguish from regular text has more to do with the subpixel rendering that MacOS uses than the Helvetica font. Windows's ClearType makes text thinner and gives it more anti-aliasing than a Mac does.

@Hank

This. Helvetica looks great on Windows, and also Android apparently (I'm on Android right now and they are very visible)

[Ellri]

not particularly hard to see on ubuntu either.

[Mahz]

I implemented Visitor Messages today. Not a high priority feature, but I wanted to see if my notification system was general enough for it, and it forced me to make some improvements to my notification system implementation. I followed the vBulletin/Xenforo visitor-message implementation where visitor messages have one level of nested comments. You always get a notification when someone creates a visitor message on your wall, but any nested comments on a visitor message collapse into a single notification instead of spamming you. It's like the convo/PM system in that way. I also decided to *not* send notifications to you when someone replies to your VMs on other people's walls. Instead, I'd rather lean on the @mention system for that. (Of course, @mentions don't actually create notifications yet) Finally, each notification is cleared when you click its go-to link. With convos/PMs, I can clear the notification any time you view the convo. But I decided not to assume you've noticed new VMs or VM replies just because you've visited that page of your user profile. I'll finish the UI and roll it out when I wake up sometime.

[MissCapnCrunch]

A visitor message system!? Now we can chat with hot babes all day. No, but really that is awesome. I also love the profile bio addition, I took advantage of it promptly!

[Captain Jordan]

I implemented Visitor Messages today. Not a high priority feature, but I wanted to see if my notification system was general enough for it, and it forced me to make some improvements to my notification system implementation. I followed the vBulletin/Xenforo visitor-message implementation where visitor messages have one level of nested comments. You always get a notification when someone creates a visitor message on your wall, but any nested comments on a visitor message collapse into a single notification instead of spamming you. It's like the convo/PM system in that way. I also decided to *not* send notifications to you when someone replies to your VMs on other people's walls. Instead, I'd rather lean on the @mention system for that. (Of course, @mentions don't actually create notifications yet) Finally, each notification is cleared when you click its go-to link. With convos/PMs, I can clear the notification any time you view the convo. But I decided not to assume you've noticed new VMs or VM replies just because you've visited that page of your user profile. I'll finish the UI and roll it out when I wake up sometime.

@Mahz

I think notifications for replies to my VM on other people's wall would be useful. Most of the people replying would be the owner of the wall, and I'd like to know when the owner replies. What about implementing a sub/unsub system for VMs, and auto-sub everyone to their own VMs upon posting? They can then remove the notifications subscription if its bothering them. Also, with a notifications system, is it worth it to have a separate topics subscription feature? It might be more useful for the current topic subscriptions to act the same as other notifiable events in that it generates a new notification. The current subs page might be better served as a bookmarks area for keeping track of important topics, but not necessarily all the topics one is subscribed to. I know the current implementation is how the vBulletin system works, but considering how many topics some people create and/or post in, and want to get notified of replies in, the subs page can quickly expand and fill to its maximum. Splitting subscription topics between notifications and bookmarks might be a better implementation, and because one can actually review their past posts now via their profile, you can theoretically go back to any of your old topics already.

[BBeast]

@Mahz, When you implement the notifications for the Mention system, I have noticed one thing which could possibly cause unwanted behaviour. You will need to make sure that @Mentions in Convos don't send notifications. It would be inconvenient to receive a notification for a thread which you can not access (since aside from notifying people, @Mentions are also good for linking to people). Just something to watch out for when developing. I'm not sure if you had thought of that already, but I thought I'd bring it up.

[Captain Jordan]

@Mahz, When you implement the notifications for the Mention system, I have noticed one thing which could possibly cause unwanted behaviour. You will need to make sure that @Mentions in Convos don't send notifications. It would be inconvenient to receive a notification for a thread which you can not access (since aside from notifying people, @Mentions are also good for linking to people). Just something to watch out for when developing. I'm not sure if you had thought of that already, but I thought I'd bring it up.

@BBeast

Same with boards someone doesn't have permission to view.

[LegendBegins]

In regards to the coming notifications system, if you plan to implement a live update system (which would likely be taxing on your servers), I would recommend an option to toggle live updates off, for those who wish to conserve data on their phone plans.

[Rina]

For the @mention you should check out and fix the bug for names with underscores. Mr_pink didn’t have his username linked in this thread.

[Mahz]

I'll finish the UI and roll it out when I wake up sometime.

@Mahz

Change of plans - I ate a bad hamburger patty at a superbowl party last night and I've been suffering all day. I'll resume working on it this weekend. @Captain Jordan: Good ideas. I'll think about them this weekend. @BBeast: Good call, that's one of the reasons I split up the topic & convo systems for the rewrite. Easier to lock down all convos with one line of code (you must be a participant to read/post in a convo) rather than have this overloaded topics-for-convos system. @LegendBegins: Yeah, I'd like to push updates to the browser. Maybe I can keep it simple. @Kirra: Aw. Poor [@Mr_pink] :( - Thanks, I'll fix.