Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by GreenGrenade
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I'd like to say that I'm still here, but I've got to admit, the Flash as I had him written's lost his allure. I can't see a way to move forward with him, and while I do have a few backup options, it all depends on GM/Co-GM approval.

I'd start with pitching Sonic, what with having a CS primed and ready, but having heard @Gowi's opinion, which I completely understand, I don't think he's a viable option.

My second option would be something I'd been discussing with Wraith prior to the game's decline, that being me taking over Spider-Man duty, playing both an established Peter (which would require either a time skip or a reboot) and a newbie Miles. So, playing the "Spider-Men", in a sort-of not really teacher-student relationship. I have a CS that'll be ready with a few tweaks here and there, but again, it's all up to GM approval (and a time skip in-game).
Although now that I think about it, a retcon could work, if that's an option at all...

In regards to feedback/criticism, all I can say is that after participating in three games of this style, one of them being my own, I think the primary reason for loss of interest is the lack of engagement. By that, I mean that players are given so much freedom, and the overarching plot is pushed so far to the background, that eventually everyone's left thinking, "Now what?" So, long story short, I think a way to guarantee the game lasting longer is to put more emphasis on the main plot. Retain the sandbox element, but with a larger focus on the bigger scope of things. I hope that made sense.

And with that,
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Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Gowi
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So, long story short, I think a way to guarantee the game lasting longer is to put more emphasis on the main plot.


So I should have Sta'rro attack after I wrap up Batman's current arc?
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Morden Man
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With respect, I think if this was going to work it would have worked by now. There's only so many times you can keep rebooting something and expecting it to go differently. Despite the reservations I had last time, I still put a lot of time and effort in to no avail and I don't think I'd be able to do that again.

So I'm out on this one. I wish you the best of luck though.
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Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Gowi
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With respect, I think if this was going to work it would have worked by now. There's only so many times you can keep rebooting something and expecting it to go differently. Despite the reservations I had last time, I still put a lot of time and effort in to no avail and I don't think I'd be able to do that again.

So I'm out on this one. I wish you the best of luck though.


This isn't a reboot; this is a recovery from a month hiatus at a bad point in the Fall Season. I understand your issues and respect your departure, though.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by FacePunch
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I'm technically still here. I've just found myself overwhelmed with activity in my smaller roleplays and school work looming on the horizon. I can find time for Maximum Comics. Just not right at this second.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Gowi
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I'm technically still here. I've just found myself overwhelmed with activity in my smaller roleplays and school work looming on the horizon. I can find time for Maximum Comics. Just not right at this second.


I will keep you posted on any changes hereon. I'm talking with some dedicated players in Skype right now about what the ideal path forward is.

join.skype.com/zllYmcXdeK4a
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Byrd Man
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I didn't get tagged, but I'm afraid I'm not coming back.
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Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Gowi
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Hm, if we have this many non-returns I might have to start shopping for new members (and maybe a new thread?), thanks for letting me know.

What do the folks who are staying think about the prospect of using this thread or carrying over to a new one?
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by FacePunch
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I'd do either, but if we're recruiting new players the post count might seem too high and drive them away.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Gowi
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I'd do either, but if we're recruiting new players the post count might seem too high and drive them away.


That's what I was thinking (as well as how much in-continuity stuff from ex-players we have).

Also do you guys think starting with an in-game world spanning event would be better too? Something bigger than the Red Skull stuff I setup prior.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by FacePunch
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I'd say go big.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Sep
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I'd say go big.


Oh. Hello you.

(as well as how much in-continuity stuff from ex-players we have).


With you knowing who I want to be, I'd like that :P

OH NO, it's @Dedonus! Quick! Someone hide me!

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Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Natty
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I expressed interest months ago but due to time constraints i never managed to post a CS or anything so if you are definitely looking for new players then i'd love to apply. Have a few ideas as well but i'll wait until i see who's definitely here before confirming anything!
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Sep
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I expressed interest months ago but due to time constraints i never managed to post a CS or anything so if you are definitely looking for new players then i'd love to apply. Have a few ideas as well but i'll wait until i see who's definitely here before confirming anything!


Oh Hi Natty.

Yeah we were applying AS THE SAME GROUP.

Now we're not.

-eyes waringly-
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<Snipped quote by Natty>

Oh Hi Natty.

Yeah we were applying AS THE SAME GROUP.

Now we're not.

-eyes waringly-


Well you don't need to worry about me stomping on your ideas this time! :P
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Gowi
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So! Apparently people are now complaining that I set it in 2001 instead of like 2011. Is this a common issue?
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Dedonus
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In regards to feedback/criticism, all I can say is that after participating in three games of this style, one of them being my own, I think the primary reason for loss of interest is the lack of engagement. By that, I mean that players are given so much freedom, and the overarching plot is pushed so far to the background, that eventually everyone's left thinking, "Now what?" So, long story short, I think a way to guarantee the game lasting longer is to put more emphasis on the main plot. Retain the sandbox element, but with a larger focus on the bigger scope of things. I hope that made sense.


I don't necessarily agree with this feedback (or at least it is not true all the time). The Create-A-Hero RPG has been going strong for two entire years so far (and that's not counting how long it was going before the guildfall). My own All-Star Marvel has been chugging along for almost a year now, too (mattering which thread you count as the 'start'). In neither of these two games have we gotten to the "main plot" (although in All-Star Marvel, we are starting to put together the Avengers for the first time). There has been solo and collaborative story arcs, but these (particularly the collaborative arcs) stories have been rather limited to a few characters.

Furthermore, there have been game-wide events in CAH RPG, but these have been rather player driven instead of GM mandated. The closest thing to a "main plot" in the CAH RPG was an event that a new player pushed out (ironically this player also disappeared, leaving us to finish it off). But there was no real planning for this (or at least on my or Nitemare Shape's part). It was spontaneous and, while it did result in a rule being made where you need to consult the GMs to make sure an event does not conflict with anyone, gave certain characters reasons to push their character(s) forward.

So, for my own feedback (although I was not really involved in this roleplay - I will try to give feedback from my experiences in the Create-A-Hero RPG and All-Star Marvel, the first thing to make these games successful is having an active GM. Please don't take this as a personal attack or anything, Gowi. And when I mean "active GM", I don't mean "post in the IC everyday". Instead, just make sure you can consistently make posts. Furthermore, while you don't want the OOC filled with pages and pages of discussion that might be better for a chat room, I also believe that having a somewhat active OOC in general is beneficial. And again, what I mean by this is that, if the last OOC post was from three (or more) days ago, then I think there is a problem.

Next, you also need at least a dedicated core group of players who you can rely on to post and keep the ball rolling. I have found this true for both CAH and All-Star Marvel. Sometimes you just need those two or three players who know what direction they want to take their character(s) and can keep the IC active while other players try to find what direction they want to push their characters. I have done this before in the CAH thread in its infancy after guildfall and I have had other players in All-Star Marvel do this. Basically, if your thought process, as a player, is "I will wait to post until others post", then the roleplay will imminently run out of steam. Any roleplay (whether a roleplay like this one, All-Star, and CAH, or something else on this website) is a two way street. Both the GM and the players must be active and motivated.

Another improvement that might help is enforcing the "one character at first, then two more characters are 'unlocked' after a few posts" rule, even for the "veteran" players. I think that if you allow players to start out with three characters (or even more) at the very beginning, they might be overwhelmed with having too many tools in the tool shed. It is either that or players need to know when they are taking on more than they can handle. I feel that if the game would grow "naturally", then it might help out. What I mean by this is that each player at first take one character and start making posts. After two or three posts, if the player feels that they can take on another character, then allow them to make another character sheet.

Another thing I learned from running All-Star Marvel is, especially in the games infancy, you need to be able to be flexible with players who "disappear" (especially for months at a time or even not showing up again at all). For All-Star Marvel, I allowed potential players to retcon the history of characters who have "disappeared" because usually the type of player who does this disappearing act will only have made a few posts that have not interacted with anyone and it makes it very easy to retcon without messing with the roleplay's lore. Furthermore, I feel that the "first arc should be a solo arc" really facilitates this and weeds out people who would disappear anyways. While this might not be necessary for the first arc for your third player, for new players, this makes sure that if they disappear without any explanation, they are not going to screw over that character.

Unlike Create-A-Hero, where we can just ignore the characters of missing players, since they are original characters and someone making a CS for a specific character does not affect the availability of another character to another player, these games where you base the characters on established comic book characters do not have this liberty. This is why I like the "retcon" option and the "first arc must be a solo arc" because it prevents a situation where someone might make a character CS and screwing over that character (and other characters who would interact with that character) for future, potential players.

Okay, I think I am going to stop here for now. If I think of anything else in the next few days, I'll let you know. I hope some of this will be helpful. I really do enjoy these types of games and really don't want to see them whither away due to inactivity.

@Gowi

P.S. Okay, I lied. One more piece of advice. While this might not apply as much as it did a month or so ago, I think we need to make sure our player base is not split. What I mean is that (I am overusing this phrase ), at one point, we had similar games (Marvel, DC, combined) running both on this site AND SuperHeroHype. While some players do participate on both boards, I feel that having two "All-Star" Marvel, 2 "Ultimate" DC, and 2 "One Universe" games going at the same time just divides the potential players in half. Either that, or the players who are participating in both are too stretched thin.
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Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Gowi
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@Dedonus

Originally, I started Maximum Comics for just the reasons you stated: the concurrent games were spread too thin. Back a few years ago we had an Indie Comics, One Universe, Ultimate DC, and All-Star Marvel game; and my belief was adding a concrete foundation for a true singularization would make them all not needed and thus folks who I value as talented writers could focus their efforts on one game. Unfortunately between my timing, setup, activity, or whatever other effects… it just didn’t work and I began to doubt myself. I take a lot of the blame for this, but I keep thinking in my head that I didn’t build this game for nothing so I really should find a way to make it work; your version of ASM is a good standard to prove that it works. But my activity was jagged for a month and a half…. and folks gave up. I don’t know if ASM has luck or just more determined folks, but it does give me a glimmer of hope for Maximum.

I just need to talk with my players and find out how to do just that.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Dedonus
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@Dedonus

Originally, I started Maximum Comics for just the reasons you stated: the concurrent games were spread too thin. Back a few years ago we had an Indie Comics, One Universe, Ultimate DC, and All-Star Marvel game; and my belief was adding a concrete foundation for a true singularization would make them all not needed and thus folks who I value as talented writers could focus their efforts on one game. Unfortunately between my timing, setup, activity, or whatever other effects… it just didn’t work and I began to doubt myself. I take a lot of the blame for this, but I keep thinking in my head that I didn’t build this game for nothing so I really should find a way to make it work; your version of ASM is a good standard to prove that it works. But my activity was jagged for a month and a half…. and folks gave up. I don’t know if ASM has luck or just more determined folks, but it does give me a glimmer of hope for Maximum.

I just need to talk with my players and find out how to do just that.


I think ASM was a combination of good luck and determined folks. In one of my in-progress player recruit drives, I lucked into attracting players like @Sep and @Natty (and others) who have proven to me to be reliable writers who I can count on even if I am a little behind on my posting schedule. So, I think luck goes hand-in-hand in finding those "determined folks".

You also bring up another good point. Not only are there similar games being run on different sites, but the All-Star, Ultimate DC, One Universe, Indie, Maximum Comics games also compete with themselves for players on the same site. People fall behind on posts if they have to write for 3 characters in multiple games. Unfortunately, I am not quite sure how to "fix" this problem besides properly timing when you put up the game.

Also, I remember three more pieces of advice.

First, although I don't really have any comment on the start date itself, I think it might be beneficial to allow a range of where the players characters can be in the superhero careers. In other words, some players can have a character in their first year of superheroics, while someone else can have his/her character in his 3rd year. As long as you establish guidelines for this, I think I can mix things up (i.e. we don't have to go through everyone's origin story, which we have all heard a gazillion times). For instance, you can say that your character can be anywhere between year 1 and year 3 in their career and certain characters, like mutants, cosmic characters, etc. can have a little bit more leeway. I don't know if you already are doing this. If you are, just ignore me.

Second, for these "one universe" games, the GM needs to take into account the landscape of the roleplay when considering which non-DC and non-Marvel characters should be allowed to be applied for. I honestly think you actually did a fairly good job on this. The Singular Universe game on SuperHeroHype, on the other hand, kind of got out of control in this aspect. It is fine if the characters fit into what has already been established in the game, but when that game started accepting Godzilla, the Power Rangers, James Bond, and other characters, things got, in my opinion, too unfocused. An example of doing this correctly would be accepting the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles when there are a couple other NYC street-level characters so that it does not seem like they are separated in their own little bubble.

Finally, for relaunching Maximum Comics, it might be wise to wait until after the holidays before you start recruiting more players. Even though this holiday season does include winter break for most students, people also get busy around this time of year too. When I first started All-Star Marvel, I had to soft-reboot it once because I tried to launch it right after I finished my exams but we all got busy over Winter break. While it might seem like a good idea to launch a game during a break from school, it might be better to wait until after New Years because people will not have as many responsibilities for their families as over this holiday season.

Also, when determining whether you want to do a hard reboot (clean slate) or a soft reboot (carry over characters, but allows a good jumping on point for new characters), I think you need to consider who in this game currently will be coming along and, as a result, which characters will be doing so as well. How much of the current lore be salvaged when certain key characters might be changing?
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D'awwwww shucks @Dedonus.
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