[OOC] Multiverse Rising (Always in need of New Friends)

[thewizardguy]

Sorry for my nerdiness, BTW.

[Dreaming]

Actually I have to interject. On the cosmic, and even local scale, sound is almost insipidly slow. Plasma is electrical in nature, and while denser, still travels far, far faster than sound. Lightning is a form of plasma and moves at lightspeed. Video game logic is not an ideal system to use for combat RP. Especially in the tier you're in.

Here is further proof of my claims:redorbit.com/news/space/1112660343/pla..

[thewizardguy]

@Dreaming
Plasma consists of an ionised gas. In this particular case, a superheated ionised gas. As it is a form of matter, it's speed is dependent upon the forward force applied to it. There is no 'speed of plasma', as it can hypothetically move at any speed. Plasma could be launched at the speed of sound, or at the speed of a turtle.

Furthermore, your link refers to waves occurring within plasma, not to the movement of actual plasma.

As plasma can move at any speed, and the only reference for it's speed is the game, the only logical assumption is that it moves at a speed approximate to what is seen in the game.

[Savato]

@thewizardguy I'm sorry but since when were animations in Xcom actually relevant? Normal bullets from the standard weapons weren't displayed nearly as fast as they normally would. And this is coming from a game where you freeze time to make the best approach. I don't think movement and speed are the forte of the series.

Plus plasma weapons are not only more accurate but have higher precision too. Now I do agree that many plasma weapons in the game are slow enough to even be dodged by normal people, but that's just game animation. It's from the same game where people with basic armor withstand multiple plasma shots in the body.

Finally, this is 'mysterious, super advances alien technology'. With open ended descriptions like that I don't think it's an issue to give super reflexes and normal Muzzle velocity to MASSIVELY superior weaponry.

Now if you want to argue that they didn't have time to react to it despite the speed of sound being pretty typical as Dreaming said, I can work with that. I don't mind.

[thewizardguy]

@Savato
I never intended to start an argument, and hope I haven't done anything as such.

As this is a grey area with limited information, I think the only logical decision is to allow the controlling player (you) to decide the exact statistics of these weaponry. I would ask that you decide what the projectile speed of plasma weaponry is, at which point we would have a consistent basis for situations like this.

Plasma weapons, at least in the game, have no increase to accuracy. The only things I can think of are that laser and plasma weapons are longer range in the rifle weapon type (but nowhere else) and that plasma snipers have a higher crit chance.

Personally, it seems unlikely to me that the Mutons would have been able to pull off the shot. Average human reaction time is 270 milliseconds. That's for a simply click on the screen, ignoring aim. Mutons most likely have massively superior reflexes and perception, but hitting Doomsday at sonic speeds is like trying to shoot a bullet out of the air. They would need to compensate for speed and drop on the aim in 5/100ths of a second.

If you want, I can edit my post. I'll leave the decision up to you.

[thewizardguy]

Found this, for reference as to the length of a millisecond, to give perspective on just how fast Apocalypse is moving:
humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime

[Savato]

@thewizardguy You're right on it not upping aim. I must have gotten confused with all the various weapons gained in the Long war. Though the point still stands it has the same base aim with higher precision than basic weapons which are supposedly faster a harder to avoid.

I simply consider them as fast as modern rifle speeds. So a few times higher than the speed of sound, but I did mention they would be relatively easy to dodge given the general power tier.

If thinking in-game, which we've agreed isn't super reliable, they seem pretty well versed in countering people as they're attacking. But sure, if it doesn't hit that isn't an issue. No need to actually edit.

I'll be posting soon, going to eat dinner first! Also no no I didn't mean you were arguing I just have a poor choice of words.

Edit: To me the length of time a millisecond is a bit null. We're in a world where Naruto people are common and dodging bullets is common practice to these people.

[Dreaming]

Is this fight happening under the rules/laws present in the video game you're referencing? If so, then a lot of this would make more sense. If not, then I still need to say that yes, plasma is an ionized gas, but it is also electrically charged, and highly electrical in nature. I'd imagine a gun able to generate the energy required to ionize the gas within it without the need of some monstrous portable battery, would also have the tech to get the most out of each shot from the plasma rifle. Speaking technologically anyways
id say its safe to assume a plasma rifle is moving faster than sound, which run of the mill guns are capable of doing now.

[thewizardguy]

@Savato
Not sure where you're getting 'higher precision'?

Secondly, I'm thinking of how you'd define the destructive capacity of these weapons. Judging from the game it's about twice that of the assault weapons being used, but that's gameplay, and as established not very reliable. So I'd like to check with you once more on that point, to ensure that I have an idea of how much it's actually going to do when it hits.

Yes, but to those people a millisecond is far longer. Those are superhuman beings with reflexes so massively superhuman they'd have to have a fully electrical brain. Nothing in the Xcom game or lore indicates that the Mutons have reflexes or movements even close to that. It would take longer than 50 milliseconds to pull the trigger for most people, which is why sonic movement is so incredibly powerful.

@Dreaming
"id say its safe to assume a plasma rifle is moving faster than sound"
I found that way too amusing.

Plasma is a form of matter. It isn't any more electrical in nature than any other form of matter. It is subject to the normal laws of physics, and it's movement speed is entirely dependent on the force applied to it.

You do realize that we have the technology to ionize gas relatively easily, right? Like, you can get a little lamp-like thing that does just that. Commercially. It just isn't superheated. But I agree that plasma weapons could easily be used to fire at the speed of sound or beyond, because alien tech can do whatever it wants.

[Savato]

@thewizardguyCrit chance. I believe some have it higher in that weapon tier? Or was it laser tier. I ca't navigate too much right now because of broadband so feel free to correct me on that.

It's plasma. So I suppose it'll fry mostly anything and rather quickly too. Corpses of civilians hit by those were entirely burned. So I'm going to say severe burns unless one has a really strong defense against that type of damage. I'm not very savvy on this btw.

They could technically use covering fire to shoot down someone who'd be about to shoot an ally before the target could actually shoot. But I know that the lore dictates that they have upgrades and are specifically made of combat environment. I'd assume they'd have adequate reflexes. That and I've actually made Mind Merge a reflex upper in my CS.

[Dreaming]

Well actually plasma is more electrical than other matter. The process of ionizing anything means to give it a positive charge. Plasma is literally formed by ionizing gas, thus making it electrical in nature. Something any noteworthy science site/journal will inform you.

and I'm aware we commercially use plasma in pig tail bulbs. But we currently do not have the tech required to make beam weaponry out of it of any reliable sort(giant portable batteries). Not to mention plasma can move as fast as the gun dictates since plasma can be rapidly generated by superheating vectors of oxygen, and can extend after the initial ignition source for miles in literally no time.

but if you two have reached an agreement then consider my 2 cents null in void.

[Punished Homura]

Ima stay out of the science talk I'm a doctor not an engineer

Alright. Thanks for the info. Is the sheet locked, or can one add to it as needed?

@Gun

You can add on to the sheet if you wish it, just make sure you have the things on the sheet at a minimum.

I need to know name and appearance and abilities and stuff like that before I can approve something. As long as I have that I don't overtly mind a different format or extra information.

[thewizardguy]

@Savato
It only ups crit chance for snipers. But in snipers every tech tier ups the crit chance.

Well, they were able to destroy brick walls. So they're fairly powerful. So I'm going to assume they're around 1000 degrees Celcius, with the power to melt through a steel wall.

@Dreaming
It has a positive charge because of the lack of electrons. Electrons carry a negative charge, protons carry a positive charge. It's quite literally LESS electrical than almost any other form of matter, because all the electricity has left. This is also what makes it superconductive and susceptible to electromagnetism.

As I said, plasma can move as fast as the force affecting it propels it. And while we can relatively easily create plasma, launching it at an appreciable speed is a problem. We could build plasma weaponry, the plasma would simply dissipate rapidly after leaving the barrel, move slowly, and have less destructive force than modern ballistic weaponry.

Also, don't say 'literally' when describing something physically impossible.

[Dreaming]

"Also, don't say 'literally' when describing something physically impossible."

Lol what? Because ionizing gases is 'Physically impossible'. Right. I'm unaware where you were taught how superheated gases work, but they are in fact ionized. Literally. This isn't even a debate, it is outright stated in virtually every reputable science news site and/or book.

a gas with even 1% of its particles ionized will gain plasma-like characteristics.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_(physics)

For another clearcut example.

again, countless examples of plasma give immediate rise to the evidence of its potential speed from lightning to run of the mill variations without the need of 'forward' force propelling it. Lightning is the speed of light and is simply caused by friction, unless your argument would then be that the friction is the force itself, which in turn is say what is stopping the opposing characters rifle from having access to that as well?

Not entirely sure what the passive aggressiveness is about either. Something I find incredibly typical amongst other combat rp'ers. :/

[Punished Homura]

I think we ought to take this debate to the private message system, since I feel its starting to get a bit too serious for my liking.

[thewizardguy]

@Dreaming@Punished Homura
I never intended for this to become an argument, although it seems to have reached that point on it's own.

I'll end this with the statement that I never intended to give a passive aggressive message. I can't transmit tone of voice through comments, and I'm sorry if you felt that I was being passive-aggressive.

My comment didn't refer to ionised gas as being literally impossible, but the fact that you said 'literally in no time at all'. It was simply that instantaneous transmission is impossible. Again sorry if I annoyed you ^_^

[Dreaming]

Lol oh! Well that makes far more sense! I apologize as well. After all, it wasn't my fight. I just thought my input might help you guys make a decision(as I'm used to being the judge/referee in fights.)

[Punished Homura]

I'm fine with debates personally just when they get to be pretty long it's best to have them settled over private messages. People tend to get antsy when the OOC has a lot of messages relative to debates in RPs like that, which is understandable.

[Lmpkio]

Now that @Kael Taiyou has posted... I shall reveal the 4 antagonists (with Homura approving of the characters shown to her via PM)

[Dreaming]

Anyone care to give me a synopsis of what has happened in this RP. I swear I'm not lazy, but that's quite a bit of reading and id rather hop in sooner than later.