I admit that BioShock Intimate was a good game, but it wasn't what we were lead to believe it would be from what we were told - Something that lead to the closure of Irrational Games. All we honestly got, in gameplay, was a linear modern shooter. Nothing that will stand the test of time, even if the story was good.
And I fucking hope Schaffer isn't trusted anymore - He's an asshole for one, and... I can't believe I'm saying this, but Bobby Kotick was right about him.
And yes, indie devs DO make awesome games, my steam account is filled with them - However, when gaming journalists literally are the only people that help get indie devs noticed, and they try to force people into making everything a special safe zone hug box where masterpiece games like 1 Finger Death Punch, Dwarf Fortress, Kenshi, Hipster Werewolf, Papers Please, and other such great games might not be even reported on because 'games' like Gone Home and Depression Quest are getting 10/10 scores from friends of the makers because they 'tackle serous issues and are so mature and if you don't like them you are transphobic/misogynistic/homophobic/racist/albeist/whateverthefuckelsethereis,' those games never get noticed, and the makers never get the fame they deserve.
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That is unfortunate, and honestly suits need to be put on a leash, but we still need people like Bobby Kotick, good buisnessmen. Too many suits, we get games approved by comitee, and 'we needs to reach out to the CoD base.
Too little, you get dreamfactories like Shaffer or games like Bioblunder Infinite and Brutal Legend. Take Shaffer for example - Intended to make a game on 50k - Got 3.3 million from the kick starter. Blew all three point three fucking million on the first half on a point and click adventure game because he can't manage money for shit, then complains he has to finish the rest out of his own pocket and goes begging for MORE donations.
Too little, you get dreamfactories like Shaffer or games like Bioblunder Infinite and Brutal Legend. Take Shaffer for example - Intended to make a game on 50k - Got 3.3 million from the kick starter. Blew all three point three fucking million on the first half on a point and click adventure game because he can't manage money for shit, then complains he has to finish the rest out of his own pocket and goes begging for MORE donations.
Chrononaut said
Well, I buy games and enjoy them very much so this is really not a problem for me. I've known games journalism was bullshit for a while and actively ignore it. Since I'm responsible for my own purchasing decisions and tend to make good ones, gaming journalism doesn't factor into how or when I buy things.
Same with me - But when game developers actually take advice to dumb their games down from these people who, by their own admission, hate/suck at all video games, all gamers suffer.
Chrononaut said
Weird how we're focusing on Zoe Quinn now when this kind of corruption has been self evident since Gamespot fired Jeff Gerstmann for his Kane and Lynch review in 2007. Good news I guess, weird that it took a woman cheating on her boyfriend for anyone to pay attention. (and she maybe got decent reviews for her tiny, free, choose your own adventure text game. Oh noooooooooooooooooooooo)Also I think that guy has basically guaranteed he'll never get a date again. (From anyone who knows what he did)
Zoe has been a non-issue for a while now. I named the thread back before #GamerGate had a name, when it was first starting and I wanted to know what was going on.
And oh yeah, oh noooo, her 'game' was free, but she was using it as a way to scam money for her fake GameJam and her patron account. Oh noooooooo, let's be sarcastic and unironically ignore the issues that are plaguing gaming, because 'muh soggy knee'!
Kestrel said
IGN has been ruining game journalism for years. If you are genuine, you should claim you will instead of you would.Also, how can someone ruin your identity? First gamer is not your full-blown identity in and of itself (at least I fucking hope not) but a part of it, and secondly your self-image or the label gamer isn't so weak it can be dismissed by tumblr-level tabloids. If anything the response has shown that they haven't even been close to being a threat to your identity.I think exposing corruption is good, but there is so much drama and bullshit surrounding this I don't want a part of- okwait. No. Stop. I'm bleeding.Fuck, I knew this would happen.
Fine, I fully intend to. Did you even read the part that I wrote about IGN in my big post?
What they have tried to so is split us on gender, race, creed, sexuality and other such things that were not our choice. We (Gamers) are not divided by our differences, we are united by the one common identity we all chose for ourselves. We won't have people we trust to tell us about games tell us we, the core players of video games - Are irrelevant, and that they need to cater to people like Anita, who don't even play games, or Jenn Frank, a female journalist who claims that women were just unable to comprehend anything N64 onwards because '3D is too confusing', and that their minds weren't ready for the switch from 2D.
I quote:
"By 1996, most of my female classmates had stopped playing video games. I think some of this had to do with societal pressures but the rest of it had to do with the Nintendo 64. Even now its controller is nonsense; in 1996 it was outright galling. Where had all these buttons come from? Why was it shaped like that? Why was there an analogue stick stuck in the middle of it?
Meanwhile, beloved franchises such as Mario and Zelda had shifted from two dimensions to three, and not every girl was readily able to adapt to these new spatial challenges."
Sauce: https://archive.today/bOP8Y#selection-1255.3-13884.0
We are gamers - Why should people like Anita, -who there is footage of her saying how she hates video games- Get to go to the makers of Mirrors Edge and say "Dumb it down, controls are too hard for women" when she doesn't even play?
Just because THEY had trouble switching to the N64 doesn't mean that women's brains aren't capable of playing 3D games.
Devi Evers did a few funny pictures about that article, I'll see if I can't find them so we can have a good laugh.
Sorry for double post, but...
I'm sorry, but #GamerGate won't end any time soon. What we want is so this never happens again. I'd gladly, GLADLY go up against IGN if it comes to it as well as any other corrupt people ruining my hobby, my identity.
Kestrel said
Likely because IGN doesn't write articles with the purpose of insulting it's following. They totally should target them, though, but it's the same as everything else. Ego>all.Regardless, despite the collateral damage being potentially massive, you can't grow healthy crops on a poison ground. I think it is for the best in the long term if lessons are learned (pleasepleaseplease,) but the wake this whole ordeal left is a special kind of toxic now. I really don't want to get into the debate any further because I feel debating this extensively is the literal equivalent of slitting one's own wrists and I like myself too much to hurt me. I'll take my stupid soapbox and leave now. Please don't make me hurt myself.
I'm sorry, but #GamerGate won't end any time soon. What we want is so this never happens again. I'd gladly, GLADLY go up against IGN if it comes to it as well as any other corrupt people ruining my hobby, my identity.
I used the Ghandi picture because it is highly apperpo to what is happening. First thwy iored us, then they laughed at us calling us misogonerds, and telling us that our identity is dead. And yes, normally while I would mourn the loss of a website like Gamasutra, when they allow a writer to act like this, [spoiler] 
[/spoiler] it is not bullying to write to their advertisers and complain. There are a great many other websites that would gladly fill the void and replace them. That is why it is a good reason to not actively inaukt your readers and shove unwanted pseudo-political bullshit down their throat, you might very well be replaced. That is a consumer revolt, and that is what GamerGate essentially is. Why should we patronize a website that allows one of their lead writers to threaten and insult hopeful game developers and hopeful game journalists? Why should we tolerate a website that refuses to deal with a woman who refers to less fortunate, impoverished black men as 'Hood men' as a strange euphemism for Nigger, and wants to have a VIOLENT cultural backlash against such 'hood men'? Here is a screen cap of her racist tweet: [spoiler]
[/spoiler]
Here are three articles of people being fired for making racist tweets - All three of them deserved to be fired - And had their companies not fired them, there would have been a very large and deserved backlash against the businesses they worked for. Is Leigh Alexander and Gamasutra somehow immune to the Internet's reaction to racism because they cover video games? Without me shoving words into your mouth it seems that you think so.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/22/pr-exec-fired-racist-tweet-aids-africa-apology
http://www.laughspin.com/2014/07/04/anthony-cumia-fired-why-racist-twitter-rant-led-to-firing-from-opie-and-anthony-siriusxm-show/
http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2013/09/10/pax_dickinson_business_insider_cto_forced_out_for_sexist_racist_tweets.html
You and I both known that we should not, and no one should tolerate racism. Why should we tolerate her racist views? Why should we tolerate the website that allows her to write attack piece after attack piece, as well as click bait articles, not to mention her racist views? Does her 'malice' scare you as well, Hellis? Ruining the dreams of people because they disagree with her, and bragging about it? Saying she wishes she could start a racist cultural backlash against 'hood men' from the ghetto? Or does the fact you said that 'Alex not withstanding' somehow absolve Gamasutra of condoning her actions by not taking action against them?
As for game devs and game dev groups being worried of angering their player base, have you heard of Mighty No.9? Was supposed to be an amazing game, a true, spiritual sucessor to Megaman. It looked amazing - I donated to the Kickstarter. But guess what? Dina, the community manager, (who got herbjob through nepotism...) decided that the backer rewards shouldn't belong to people who helped fund their game if they disagreed with her. And when the backlash got bad enough, and Dina's actions got more and more outrageous, such as demanding that the genderless main character (its a fuckng robot, it doesn't have X or Y chromosones) be turned female because she wanted it to be, and getting her boyfriend to try to make them change it because someone who wasn't honestly involved in the project wanted it changed (Something that would set them back quite a while...), and people began saying they wanted to refund the money they gave to help make the game, she told them 'tough shit". That isn't how a successful company works - alienating their backers/investors because "whelp, my girlfriend who has no experience in community managing needs a job, so we best keep her on despite that our backers are backing out because of her inappropriate actions."
Unlike RPS, Kotaku, Gamasutra and Polygon, IGN writers did not get game developers to sleep with them in return for good reviews. Do you remember 'Doritogate', a few years back, the rather large gaming backlash against IGN's obvious corruption and selling out to MTN. Dew? Or the backlash against them(And EA and Bioware) when EA put one of their reporters into Mass Effect 3 (And spent more time and effort sculpting her high polygon-count ass instead of Her character's face, personality, or more importantly - Tali'zorah vas Normandy (An incredibly popular character/love interest)'s face?) Pepperidge Farm Remembers I remember. Do you? Maybe the reason we aren't going after them, at this time, is because IGN didn't take part in the attempted censorship?
Nah, has to be that we're just going after dissenters, because we gamers are megaphones, we're much less kind than casual players and we won't mind making an example out of dissenters. Its also funny how these 'gaming journalists' act like they can tweet bullshit at us gamers, as if we can not kill their careers and companies. They need to learn to say 'we've messed up and have a lot to learn, we apologize".
Hmm. Is it me, or does that sound strangely... Why does that remind me of... its like I've seen those three sentences before... Oh, now I remember.
Such progressive thinking. Let's start a race war, guys. Let's crush people's dreams for shits and giggles. Let's accuse all people who disagree with us of being white, cis het basement dwelling men. Let's call the minorities who disagree us 'weaponized minorities'. Let's write clickbait articles that alienate our customers. Nothing will happen to us, we're 'progressive feminist', not abusive assholes.
[/spoiler] it is not bullying to write to their advertisers and complain. There are a great many other websites that would gladly fill the void and replace them. That is why it is a good reason to not actively inaukt your readers and shove unwanted pseudo-political bullshit down their throat, you might very well be replaced. That is a consumer revolt, and that is what GamerGate essentially is. Why should we patronize a website that allows one of their lead writers to threaten and insult hopeful game developers and hopeful game journalists? Why should we tolerate a website that refuses to deal with a woman who refers to less fortunate, impoverished black men as 'Hood men' as a strange euphemism for Nigger, and wants to have a VIOLENT cultural backlash against such 'hood men'? Here is a screen cap of her racist tweet: [spoiler][/spoiler]Here are three articles of people being fired for making racist tweets - All three of them deserved to be fired - And had their companies not fired them, there would have been a very large and deserved backlash against the businesses they worked for. Is Leigh Alexander and Gamasutra somehow immune to the Internet's reaction to racism because they cover video games? Without me shoving words into your mouth it seems that you think so.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/22/pr-exec-fired-racist-tweet-aids-africa-apology
http://www.laughspin.com/2014/07/04/anthony-cumia-fired-why-racist-twitter-rant-led-to-firing-from-opie-and-anthony-siriusxm-show/
http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2013/09/10/pax_dickinson_business_insider_cto_forced_out_for_sexist_racist_tweets.html
You and I both known that we should not, and no one should tolerate racism. Why should we tolerate her racist views? Why should we tolerate the website that allows her to write attack piece after attack piece, as well as click bait articles, not to mention her racist views? Does her 'malice' scare you as well, Hellis? Ruining the dreams of people because they disagree with her, and bragging about it? Saying she wishes she could start a racist cultural backlash against 'hood men' from the ghetto? Or does the fact you said that 'Alex not withstanding' somehow absolve Gamasutra of condoning her actions by not taking action against them?
As for game devs and game dev groups being worried of angering their player base, have you heard of Mighty No.9? Was supposed to be an amazing game, a true, spiritual sucessor to Megaman. It looked amazing - I donated to the Kickstarter. But guess what? Dina, the community manager, (who got herbjob through nepotism...) decided that the backer rewards shouldn't belong to people who helped fund their game if they disagreed with her. And when the backlash got bad enough, and Dina's actions got more and more outrageous, such as demanding that the genderless main character (its a fuckng robot, it doesn't have X or Y chromosones) be turned female because she wanted it to be, and getting her boyfriend to try to make them change it because someone who wasn't honestly involved in the project wanted it changed (Something that would set them back quite a while...), and people began saying they wanted to refund the money they gave to help make the game, she told them 'tough shit". That isn't how a successful company works - alienating their backers/investors because "whelp, my girlfriend who has no experience in community managing needs a job, so we best keep her on despite that our backers are backing out because of her inappropriate actions."
Unlike RPS, Kotaku, Gamasutra and Polygon, IGN writers did not get game developers to sleep with them in return for good reviews. Do you remember 'Doritogate', a few years back, the rather large gaming backlash against IGN's obvious corruption and selling out to MTN. Dew? Or the backlash against them(And EA and Bioware) when EA put one of their reporters into Mass Effect 3 (And spent more time and effort sculpting her high polygon-count ass instead of Her character's face, personality, or more importantly - Tali'zorah vas Normandy (An incredibly popular character/love interest)'s face?) Pepperidge Farm Remembers I remember. Do you? Maybe the reason we aren't going after them, at this time, is because IGN didn't take part in the attempted censorship?
Nah, has to be that we're just going after dissenters, because we gamers are megaphones, we're much less kind than casual players and we won't mind making an example out of dissenters. Its also funny how these 'gaming journalists' act like they can tweet bullshit at us gamers, as if we can not kill their careers and companies. They need to learn to say 'we've messed up and have a lot to learn, we apologize".
Hmm. Is it me, or does that sound strangely... Why does that remind me of... its like I've seen those three sentences before... Oh, now I remember.
Such progressive thinking. Let's start a race war, guys. Let's crush people's dreams for shits and giggles. Let's accuse all people who disagree with us of being white, cis het basement dwelling men. Let's call the minorities who disagree us 'weaponized minorities'. Let's write clickbait articles that alienate our customers. Nothing will happen to us, we're 'progressive feminist', not abusive assholes.
Okay! Great news, everyone - Intel pulled their adds from Gamasutra after they learned about how Leigh Alexander, one of their lead reporters have been treating Gamers, as well as making racist remarks.
Even better news - CNN reported it neutrally.
Even better great news? Anti-Gamergate people got caught trying to flag the article as 'inappropriate'
Even better great amazing news? They failed.
http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-1175414
That is Gamasutra, and Rock Paper Shotgun we've damaged badly - RPS is literally begging for donations because all but 1 of their sponsors have left them.
Even better news - CNN reported it neutrally.
Even better great news? Anti-Gamergate people got caught trying to flag the article as 'inappropriate'
Even better great amazing news? They failed.
http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-1175414
That is Gamasutra, and Rock Paper Shotgun we've damaged badly - RPS is literally begging for donations because all but 1 of their sponsors have left them.
Sorry for last post, guys. Like I said I'm stressed/exausted beyond belief right now - I was out of line.
I'm going to be stepping back from this conversation and GamerGate as a whole dkr a few days - It Isn't helping my mental health, and you have my apologies for snapping like that.
Peace.
Also, Brovo - A cuckhold is just someone being cheated on who doesn't know when others do. It comes fro, the term 'wearing the cuckhold's horns.'
I'm going to be stepping back from this conversation and GamerGate as a whole dkr a few days - It Isn't helping my mental health, and you have my apologies for snapping like that.
Peace.
Also, Brovo - A cuckhold is just someone being cheated on who doesn't know when others do. It comes fro, the term 'wearing the cuckhold's horns.'
Hellis said
-edit- Fuck it. When people throw the word Beta, traitor and cuckold around and expect to be taken seriusly, while calling another group for cultists. That's when irony is so thick in the air that you choke on it.
Yeah, okay, you kow what, Hellis? m00t obviously isn't a traitor, I mean, going on about free speech soukd be protected and how you wont censor legal things and then suddenly going back against that because you make new friends and start dating someone so you can impress them isn't a betrayal of what you used to stand for, what was I thinking, silly me.
And having said girlfriend cheat on you will another guy without you knowing TOTALLY doesn't have anything to do with cuckoldery, while she has you carry her luggage for you whike you think you will maybe get laid becaue she's playing you like a fiddle doesn,t make you a beta! Shit, its almost like these definitions are reversed now!
In all seriousness, Hellis, each time you come back here, pretending that you are a moderate and trying to say "look at this gamers are dead article, obviously you guys are loosing, explained why you think you are winning" , and when we use sources to -show- you that we are winning, you dismiss them out of hand, and then show up a few days later, using the same disproven arguments again and again.
Its real pathetic that you obviously don't want to have discourse with us over this - you just want to prove that all gamers are misogenerds. "OH LOOK SOMEONE LIED UNDER #NOTYOURAHIELD, TIME TO PACK UO GUYS, ABANDON THAT HASHTAG." "OH, WELL MAYBE ANITA DID LIE ABOUT BEING HARASSED BY FAKING HER THREATS BUT WE ALL STILL NEED TO LISTEN AND BELIEVE EVERYRHING SHE SAYS WITHOUT ANY DOUBTS"
And yet you act like us saying these people are acting like cultist is ironic? Give me a fucking break.
Magic Magnum said
It's probably part of why people like Thunderf00t and TheAmazingAtheists are fighting against it.They're seeing almost the exact same mentality and tactics they're used to seeing from extreme religious folk.
More like they're seeing Atheism+ 2.0, only in the gaming community.
At he same time, fuck Chira ( AA). Told a woman who was raped that she deserved it and it was a pity that she survived it, and then threatened to rape her himself over reddit. When the backlash happened, he tried to say sorry other in private because he's too proud to admit he's an asshole.
Hell, he got kicked from Team TGWTG for being a dick to everyone.
Also if he's in on it, its because he despises feminists and actually is a misogynistic asshole.
Izaka Sazaka said
What are people's thoughts?
I think that it is crazy, and I'm seriously going insane with all this, that it is just a strange fever dream.
I'm also getting burnt out, fighting SJWs on tumblr and twitter as well as here is starting to cause me to loose my patience and cool more often than before. Need an example, see above rant at Hellis.
I've had several friends get doxxed because of this, and I myself have been partially doxxed - My cell is getting called/texted to by people telling me to stop talking about GamerGate, as well as my email/Facebook being spammed by angry cultists, within people sending messages on tumblr telling me I need to look after my little siblings,or something might happen to them, with links to their Facebook pages.
Brovo said
Not a cult. A misdirected venue for perceived injustices by brainwashed people who then use extreme methods to--... Okay, yeah, holy shit a cult.
See what I'm saying? ;)
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