@Dynamo Frokane I seriously cannot tell, things you say are jokes/to what you actually want taken seriously...

Edit: Only trolls themselves use that word, when its not used by anyone else. Its the 'lady doth protest too much' thing. So, if your trolling congratz. I'm not fooled. And if your not. Good for you, I never said otherwise.

I just can't fathom, someone making an argument for socialism in medicine. And use an example of the post office...How does it even relate? Let alone in a positive way?

I didn't call you troll or misrepresent a single thing in that post...Citation needed? Quote what is being misrepresented here? What exactly WAS the point of that post?

Well, a smartass comment isn't equivalent to actual debate, but that doesn't even have anything to do with anything. I have yet to care about that person, nor did I make any reference to him, and mentioning this and the way your speaking is highly indicative of someone grasping at straws. You didn't actually rebutt anything. NO. I don't, even expect you to even if you had a legitimate case. (and you probably don't.) Because trying to find proof of the post office being useful would take you a century.

EDIT 2: Okay I'll beat you to something.

Me: "I literally don't think that post could get any more troll bait to someone with the littlest of knowledge..."

Is not calling you a troll. Not even trying to say it indirectly. (No all the rubbing in my face about a person I don't care about, honestly does that for me.) My main point of contention is how people were essentially 'the friends on facebook' that thumb up incorrect pictures/information on facebook. And I'm slightly scared that people actually believe such an outlandish statement. You can say, "oh i fully admit all of those places have problems", but that's not fucking at all what that post indicates.

Here's a good test, to show the extremism of a post. TRY TO EDIT IT TO MAKE IT TROLLING. What do I mean? Remake that exact post, with the same overall message, but find a way to make it worse...Make it more extremist.

My point is you couldn't...because it literally had no grey area, whatsoever and comes off as a propaganda piece. It was like a fucking token checklist of biases. Government programs great/perfect. Check. Say screw fox news. Check. Say somethings about the wonder of socialized healthcare, even if not one sentence relates to it. Check.

Did I hear talk of nukes? As a nuclear engineer, I'm hard.

Bae, I'm as reactive as Cesium-137 right now.

@Vilageidiotx Well I couldn't even pretend to be busy, my whole weekend was screwed up. So I literally had nothing better to do. #NoLife (I mean I was listening to music, so at least I was multitasking. <.<)

<Snipped quote by Vilageidiotx>

In case you were being serious. [+]

I'll throw ya bone, if you want to rebutt what I wrote. Fuck going through all of it, You only need to do two things. Explain, why the Post Office is the perfect example of government efficiency. (and is not a completely bankrupt, 100 billion in debt and nearly obsolete program, and how government taxing emails to fund the post office is a good idea.) And how that in anyway helps/or even correlates to the argument of socialism in medicine...

I implore you, please don't try...

Well, I'm on the way out so I'll just say what first comes to mind. With the postal service, we aren't talking about a new-fangled liberal invention, we're talking about one of the first government organizations founded in American history. I mean, Benjamin Franklin was the first Post Master General. Not only that, government funded postal systems date back to the Achaemenid Empire in the 500's BC. In all that time, now is when it becomes inefficient and impracticable? Something needing reform doesn't mean it needs to die and never be born again. I won't argue there isn't corruption here, but that doesn't mean we need to hand the entire system over to aristocratic control.

As for socialized medicine, the big issue in the United States and the reason support for it is picking up steam is because there is a multi-billion dollar middle man in the insurance industry that would be eliminated by a real socialized system. That's why Obamacare doesn't really work for anybody but the people who couldn't get healthcare at all before; it doesn't address the insurance industry, it basically just subsidizes them. I said before, after all, that I like Obamacare in a morbid way because it has made it difficult to maintain private healthcare insurance without being unpopular (since you either have to rip access to healthcare from thousands of people to repeal it, or you have to socialize it) but I do not live under any illusions that it is a good thing on its own. After all, I'm paying 120 a month for that bullshit along with the rest country. And I'm paying it, of course, to a private insurance company. In a public system, people making multi-billion dollars off the system would be seen and correctly assuaged as corruption. In a private system, the guy becoming a billionaire is the purpose of the system and medical care is an afterthought put in place to maintain his revenue, and only as much as it maintains his revenue.

@Vilageidiotx First paragraph isn't needed because I didn't argue that. Though we don't really need reform for the post office, we already have something better. Emails are a much better/simple/faster way for sending information now. Things CAN become obsolete, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Second one, doesn't have much to do with my statement either. Because it literally can't. (Which is my point.) But I'll just say the idea in my opinion, it has plenty of problems on its own. But I won't get into it too deeply, because honestly I don't personally have a better/detailed alternative. And I agree that there is a problem in the first place. But I'm almost certain this has come up before...

But whether or not you agree with the general concept (socialized medicine = beneficial), is beside the point. The thing I argued against, was using some of the worst and least useful, most over budgeted government programs implying all of them were good. (and congress...which apparently is the same thing.) to somehow very weakly connected all of time, to 'why the government should socialize medicine.'

FCC censors good + Bankrupt/In Debt Programs unrelated to medicine + You didn't build that = Get more government in medicine?!?

That just baffles the shit out of me.

Imma say two things that are only vaguely related because, I dunno, the subject came up at it doesn't look like it's going to go anywhere else productive so fuckit.

1: I was thinking about the Post Office thing, and you know, I don't know if you can really pry it from the government. I know that's not what @SleepingSilence is driving at, but the thought just seems worth saying anyway I guess. One of the big reasons the government is so deeply concerned with the Post Office is because it is still a useful government program for the government. Like, all the buying stamps to mail letters that used to go on, that was paying to keep the service in place and all of that, and now personal mail like you said is being taken up by the internet. But the other purpose of the post office is to have an organization in place that the government can use as an inter-office courier service. I know the post office and the IRS work in tandem from my time being employed by the latter, and you can see how that would be extended. So even in the odd event the Post Office was privatized, it's replacement would probably end up in a comparably sembiatic relationship with the government for that reason. That might also explain (aside from employement stats) why the government is so worried about losing it.

2: Also, regarding the FCC because it keeps coming up, their main job isn't censorship. That's just something they are known for. Their main job is to maintain and police laws regarding the use of communication networks. The original purpose comes from back in the old days when analog broadcast signals were king. Broadcast signals aren't solid things, and there are ways to overpower them, hence the use of policing. I suppose the most famous example of overpowering a broadcast signal is the Max Headroom incident.

But even that particular incident isn't their main goal, since an individual managing to overpower WGN's broadcast is altogether odd. The main sort of thing they would be focused on is, say, keeping NBC from putting up a few towers and overriding all of their competition's channels in a specific area so that theirs is the only signal coming in. They presumably deal with equivalent shit regarding satellite, cell-phone tower usage, and cable. So there is a reason for that particularly organization to exist, even if, you know, they make you take a tinkle when you want to take a piss.

@SleepingSilence You accused me of trolling in our first discussion about stefan, I wasnt even referring to the troll bait thing you said. That'll be another strawman.

For someone who says that only trolls use the word troll you sure do say troll a lot you troll.

AGAIN I have to explain to you what trolling is, its trying to do nothing but piss someone off. My post you are referring to about the government was highlighting the hypocrisy of some absolute anti-state types, anarchists and Molynuex followers who say the government is absolutely worthless (the other extreme of saying they are perfect). But still enjoy a high standard of living due to programs they rely on.

I wasn't trying to soley piss anyone off (although I'm sure it did piss someone off), and I wasn't calling the government perfect, you can misrepresent me all you want. My views are as clear as day. If you feel trolled by a post that mentions fox news then once again I DONT KNOW WHAT TO TELL YA. Drink some green tea or something. You are too easily offended.



Oh and to answer your question, If I was to make the post more trolling, I easily could, there would be no point to it, it would just be "Sleeping Silence you suck, Sleeping Silence you smell like dogshit, Sleeping Silence blah blah blah" that's trolling. Anyone can do that. I'm also not going to defend the goddamn post office because I don't hold it in any particular high regard, its another non perfect government program that could use improvement. Now try and spin that into a troll statement.

@Dynamo Frokane (you are a very special person...) THEN THAT IS NOT RELEVANT!!! YOU CANNOT FUCKING CONTINUE TO BRING UP THAT RANDOM PERSON AND TROLLING WHEN IT WAS BROUGHT UP FUCKING ONCE! (and not even recently.) AND EVEN THEN! I DIDN'T CALL YOU A TROLL, YOU CALLED YOURSELF ONE...DON'T FUCKING CLAIM I CALLED YOU A TROLL AGAIN...THEN SAY'WELL YOU DID IT WEEKS AGO'...CHRIST...

So citation fucking needed. You can keep up your continued bullshit, (like a goddamn broken record) if you can answer ONE fucking question. QUOTE ME. And tell me, when have I ever flat out said you were a troll...I'M waiting.

@SleepingSilence That'll be another strawman.

It's trying to do nothing but piss someone off.

I wasn't trying to soley piss anyone off

(Also pointing out both those statements are contradicting ones, one implies you aren't trying to anger anyone, the 2nd is basically a smartass way of saying, that was only your secondary goal.)

But, aren't you at this point? Or are you saying words to make yourself sound smart because you don't know what strawmanning is...

I'm convinced I'm the only right leaning individual on this site. And I don't care about that person. So no, you are not a martyr and you didn't bother anyone. I called you out on bullshit. Which was 'calling someone a nazi' (or cult leader) is essentially a legit debate. And its not...Had literally nothing to do, with the man, call a liberal a nazi, and I will say the same fucking thing...

For proof, I defended you, when you were getting personally attacked, don't make me regret it more please...-.-

If you feel trolled by a post that mentions fox news then once again I DONT KNOW WHAT TO TELL YA

Fox news...Granted, their fucking stupid.

You are straight up not reading my posts, or you are, and then saying the stupidest things you can think to spew out of your mouth...

Drink some green tea or something. You are too easily offended.

I'm sorry, I cannot help it. I have to be brought to your level at this point. But if your not a troll, than you're a fucking idiot. -.-

I refuse to keep it professional for someone who keeps (purposely) egging me on in the stupidiest ways possible.

And here I'll throw ya a bone, I know you can't be a troll, Trolls are funny.

@Dynamo Frokane (you are a very special person...) THEN THAT IS NOT RELEVANT!!! YOU CANNOT FUCKING CONTINUE TO BRING UP THAT RANDOM PERSON AND TROLLING WHEN IT WAS BROUGHT UP FUCKING ONCE! (and not even recently.) AND EVEN THEN! I DIDN'T CALL YOU A TROLL, YOU CALLED YOURSELF ONE...DON'T FUCKING CLAIM I CALLED YOU A TROLL AGAIN...THEN SAY'WELL YOU DID IT WEEKS AGO'...CHRIST...

So citation fucking needed. You can keep up your continued bullshit, (like a goddamn broken record) if you can answer ONE fucking question. QUOTE ME. And tell me, when have I ever flat out said you were a troll...I'M waiting.

<Snipped quote by Dynamo Frokane>

<Snipped quote by Dynamo Frokane>

(Also pointing out both those statements are contradicting ones, one implies you aren't trying to anger anyone, the 2nd is basically a smartass way of saying, that was only your secondary goal.)

But, aren't you at this point? Or are you saying words to make yourself sound smart because you don't know what strawmanning is...

I'm convinced I'm the only right leaning individual on this site. And I don't care about that person. So no, you are not a martyr and you didn't bother anyone. I called you out on bullshit. Which was 'calling someone a nazi' (or cult leader) is essentially a legit debate. And its not...Had literally nothing to do, with the man, call a liberal a nazi, and I will say the same fucking thing...

For proof, I defended you, when you were getting personally attacked, don't make me regret it more please...-.-

<Snipped quote by Dynamo Frokane>

<Snipped quote by SleepingSilence>

You are straight up not reading my posts, or you are, and then saying the stupidest things you can think to spew out of your mouth...

<Snipped quote by Dynamo Frokane>

I'm sorry, I cannot help it. I have to be brought to your level at this point. But if your not a troll, than you're a fucking idiot. -.-

I refuse to keep it professional for someone who keeps (purposely) egging me on in the stupidiest ways possible.

And here I'll throw ya a bone, I know you can't be a troll, Trolls are funny.

Nazi=/=Cult Leaders Btw.

I'm convinced I'm the only right leaning individual on this site.

This is a little self absorbed do you not think? Have you spoken to everyone on this site?

Right, so, I'm not a mod in any way, shape, or form, but uh...@SleepingSilence and @Dynamo Frokane, don'tcha think that it's maybe time to either agree to disagree or just move this dispute to like...a PM, or something? Because it kind of looks like things are just going to keep getting personal.

@Ogobrogo I haven't attacked him in anyway personally, I'm not even swearing. But if he @'s me then I will respond with a cute meme. Beyond that I'm already back to my own business.

@Dynamo Frokane
I mean, quite frankly, it's none of my business. Just a thought, really.

By all means, y'all do you.

Edit: Only trolls themselves use that word, when its not used by anyone else. Its the 'lady doth protest too much' thing. So, if your trolling congratz. I'm not fooled. And if your not. Good for you, I never said otherwise.

I refer you to this...<.<

You aren't even the fucking first person on this thread, to continue to attack people and say fucking stupid things, only to "say oh hahaha" i was a troll all along...It, has never been funny, or clever...and you aren't even the first idiot to do it...

Just because I say what's true, doesn't make me angry, more resigned...I've become numb to stupid people on the internet. If anything I'm sad that so many people took your comment at face value. You're just the thing I laugh at while I do something else.

I already got warned by others on this forum about how you are, But, I don't stop, and I don't mind feeding the stupidity, because at this point it's just more fuel. (like if I ever feel low, just look at THIS guy and every thing will be okay.) I want to see what stupid thing they say next.

I've always enjoyed arguing, used to do it with my roommate over the phone, but it was usually involving smarter individuals...You are not very intelligent, if you think you got a rise out of me (or are original in anyway.)

Because I can tell there's one common thread with people like you, how highly they think of themselves. Yet they can never seem to say anything positive to get that attention. Like a child throwing a tantrum to get attention. <.<

No one over the age of 18, and who isn't a progressive. Won't get offended by words, ever. I just find it cute how desperate trolls are to get attention...So yep, pulled the wool over of my eyes. *gives you the reassuring back pat your parents clearly didn't*

This is a little self absorbed do you not think? Have you spoken to everyone on this site?

@Dynamo Frokane Sarcasm. A super smart "troll" should know that. <.<

@Ogobrogo Well, he's made it personal in practically every page, 5 pages ago. But I already made it aware to the mod, this place is where like a dozen people have personally attacked someone one else. After 5 pages of it, I just felt like there was no point...

Last time I PM'd someone to stop being an asshat towards me, I got banned for harassment. Now this forum is far smarter than that, granted. But call it, personal experience. Also he wouldn't pm it because trolls don't get enjoyment from doing things one on one, they thrive on attention, so the more eyes that see it, the better.

Just explaining what this is. It's been personal a long time ago, I only started. <.<

Since this is apprently a spam thread now.

Why is this thread now the home to every US-centered political debate in the Guild? This is supposed to be a place where everyone can bitch their heart out without being judged or being insulted by anyone else! This is a place where we can be as ugly as we want to be and not feel like shit! I propose we take all the saltiness and we move it over to the ocean where it belongs. Make the Guild great gain.

@Frettzo Well when people give likes and laughs to pandering political bullshit, why ever stop?

Why is this thread now the home to every US-centered political debate in the Guild? This is supposed to be a place where everyone can bitch their heart out without being judged or being insulted by anyone else! This is a place where we can be as ugly as we want to be and not feel like shit! I propose we take all the saltiness and we move it over to the ocean where it belongs. Make the Guild great gain.

There's a world that exists outside of the US?