@Xavier Bloodbayne I agree with you, but lets not use our 'arena' methods of trying to get a point across. If you start some shit and the thread gets locked it'll just make the Arena community look bad as a whole. Lets make our points like gentlemen.

@Dynamo Frokane You raise some decent points. I guess that the diversity does add something to RPG that you can't find elsewhere (sources? I don't know, I'm a loyal bitch and I only go on RPG, ever) I think. But, on the other hand, having a dead subforum doesn't do us any favours either and if it stagnates too much like it does now/remains unused (you're awfully proud of the arena leaderboard for example, but all/most people on there are retired RPers or don't go in arena RP anymore...) then it'll reflect poorly because it shows there is no activity there. At that point, if there are just 3 hardcore RP'ers in that area, I'd be very inclined to just merge it.

There is a point at which I agree 'the kids should have their sandbox' or 'the arena fighters should have their arena' or whatever you want to call it, right? It seems fair. But, there's also the point where if a sandbox/arena is empty, you kinda need to find a way to deal with it.

So, I'm interested instead of hearing about why it's a bad idea (because my idea is the only idea so far) what you'd have in mind for re-energizing the subforum to maintain it to a degree where we no longer felt like we needed to merge it. The tournament is a good start, but I feel like there might need to be more than a tournament (that given the track record of arena RP will likely end before it even starts) to re-energize it, agreed?

As an arena person...don't want to sound like I'm betraying my own kind, but I don't see a huge problem with merging it with 1x1 other than the fact that I search a forum to see if it has it, so might miss it and not join if I don't think there is an arena. If merged stuff make it clear what's in it there's not a super huge downside from my point of view. In the thread titles could say something like [arena] or whatever specific 1x1 it is.

Agreed, merged things should remain clear and clearly state what is included in them.

Tabletop is extremely unique, I cant speak for that community, but I imagine that having RP rules based on d20 and GURPS systems definately put you outside of the realm of anything you will find in Free, Casual and Advanced, it doesn't seem fair to take away that platform. I get that they are somewhat alienated from the traditional RPers but that comes with the territory of providing a platform for the niche.

Nation I don't know that much about, I assume that having a different mindset to RPing as a faction as apposed to a character is quite significant to how they write and interact with each other. But thats about all I can say, you'd have to speak to an NRPer for more details.

I agree with Dynamo in regards to this point.

Tabletop, Arena, and Nation are sections with different communities who look for different things in roleplaying than the standard sections. If you merge these sections conventionally you will have a flood of several different approaches that just make digging and sorting through threads as more of an incessant chore than a useful utility. When I go in advanced I know what audience I am appealing to, same for these three sections that are just as independent and deserving of their niche.

<Snipped quote by Dynamo Frokane>
I agree with Dynamo in regards to this point.

Tabletop, Arena, and Nation are sections with different communities who look for different things in roleplaying than the standard sections. If you merge these sections conventionally you will have a flood of several different approaches that just make digging and sorting through threads as more of an incessant chore than a useful utility. When I go in advanced I know what audience I am appealing to, same for these three sections that are just as independent and deserving of their niche.

@Kratesis I consider it more of an appeal to 'I go there, so don't decide for me!' when it might not be in the best interest of the rest of RPG to maintain that section.

Admittedly I'd rather see arena as a sub-forum of another forum. Kinda like how we have 'casual roleplay' and 'casual interest checks' are their own tab?

It'd look like this:

O One-for-one and private Roleplay
O 1x1 roleplay
O 1x1 interest checks
O Private (invite only) roleplays
O Arena interest checks
O Arena roleplay

It's just a bit more organized to move it into respective subfolders, especially because nobody uses arena RP. Proof for that above in the screenshot.

This would fix that.

Alternatively, merge tabletop, NRP and arena into 'Niché RP' or a more fitting name that properly describes their 'different nature'. They all seem to fall in that category. Why not put them together like that. Seems more fitting, if you put it that way.

@Kratesis I consider it more of an appeal to 'I go there, so don't decide for me!' when it might not be in the best interest of the rest of RPG to maintain that section.

Admittedly I'd rather see arena as a sub-forum of another forum. Kinda like how we have 'casual roleplay' and 'casual interest checks' are their own tab?

It'd look like this:

O One-for-one and private Roleplay
O 1x1 roleplay
O 1x1 interest checks
O Private (invite only) roleplays
O Arena interest checks
O Arena roleplay

It's just a bit more organized to move it into respective subfolders, especially because nobody uses arena RP. Proof for that above in the screenshot.

I don't see how that would be bad. I also don't see how it would be good. Furthermore I don't see how it would happen as Mahz isn't around to do it, assuming he agreed with you that it would be a positive change.

To return to my earlier statement, it seems like rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic. How would that entice the Guild to post more frequently? How would that draw larger numbers of players or reduce the number of players leaving? It seems to me that changing the organization of the forum won't do anything to address the problems that most people see in the Guild (mod activity and group RPGs dying).

but lets not use our 'arena' methods of trying to get a point across.

Perhaps having a modicum of civility and respect would be better than such approaches. I suppose that is why Arena has the illicit reputation that it does. Something to think on, perhaps.

Alternatively, merge tabletop, NRP and arena into 'Niché RP' or a more fitting name that properly describes their 'different nature'. They all seem to fall in that category. Why not put them together like that. Seems more fitting, if you put it that way.

While I understand your approach, wouldn't that change very little about the website aside from a slight organizational adjustment?

I think to improve activity on RPG, decorum and communication tactics should probably be rethought on if not outright changed. I know it is unlikely as people are not going to adjust the way they talk to others unless there are rules in place, but think how a new user reacts to overtly blunt and crass rhetoric. Common courtesies and basic respect goes a long way.

@Kratesis The catch is that it wouldn't. And I don't have any idea how to entice people into posting in arena RP, nation RP, or tabletop RP. Because I don't RP there and I don't know what is wrong with those sections respectively (they all have their issues, that's for sure). The issue with your argument isn't really that my point was to fix those subforums. I don't RP there, therefore if they are there or not doesn't really affect me (outside of having to look at them, which is an eyesore for me personally but nothing too bad if we can fix the 'guides' being at the bottom of the website).

I set out to clear clutter and remove the arbitrary lines we've drawn between roleplaying sections like free, casual and advanced. Because arena, NRP, and tabletop seem to be near-dead to me (again, screenshot shows that for arena) and are especially niché based and thus much harder to even get people into, it seems redundant to keep them as their own special little snowflake forums. Like I said, there is a point at which the userbase no longer warrants a 'sandbox' to be there for them. That is when it's too small, too toxic or too inactive.

I think it's a good solution for removing first clutter and secondly, merging together some otherwise inactive subforums. So far I have yet to hear ideas about how to fix inactivity and I don't have any ideas personally, so this seems the way forward for a lack of other options available. I'd rather remove the eyesore than fix it if nobody else has any ideas.

So here's my suggested forum layout (that won't happen, because this'd require admin input I think, and would require support from the moderators, which, lol, fat chance).

O Niché Roleplay
O Arena interest checks
O Arena roleplays
O Nation interest checks
O Nation roleplays
O Tabletop interest checks
O Tabletop roleplays

Which in my humble opinion looks more organized than what we have now.

_{I also have thoughts about the mod activity that I would like to share, but I'll wait to do so until it becomes relevant in this thread again.}

Always relevant. Share now. Arena RP has held this thread in it's grip for too long and frankly it's not important enough to keep discussing it. So, by all means.

<Snipped quote by Buddha>
While I understand your approach, wouldn't that change very little about the website aside from a slight organizational adjustment?

it'd get rid of useless clutter (no offense, but they all get very little activity) and help to remove some divides, maybe even reduce the amount of cliques, since they'll all have the same subforum and be united a little more, i guess.

it'd get rid of useless clutter (no offense, but they all get very little activity) and help to remove some divides, maybe even reduce the amount of cliques, since they'll all have the same subforum and be united a little more, i guess.

I do not agree with you that it is useless clutter. RPG already has a simple enough aesthetic structure that works for it, minimizing it more won't really give it any further utility or benefit outside of confusing the users of those sections.

So, I'm interested instead of hearing about why it's a bad idea (because my idea is the only idea so far) what you'd have in mind for re-energizing the subforum to maintain it to a degree where we no longer felt like we needed to merge it.

Absolutely, this is the discussion I'm interested in having.

I'm painfully aware that this draws paralells to that stupid 'woke' SJW bullcrap about white people not being able to identify with minority experiences blah blah....

But I feel somewhat uncomfortable talking about what should be done with Nation and Tabletop forums without people from those forums giving their point of view, I think there are probably a ton of other nuances about what makes their niches special that I could only speculate about.

As far as Arena, I could brainstorm with some of the other frequent posters. Like I said I think advertising more eclectic fights instead of just Dante Vs Sephiroth style match ups could go a long way. Maybe we could have a detailed article in the criminally underused 'News' Sub-forum about what Arena really is and what it entails and how interesting you can make it beyond just a simple fight. We could also start hosting tournaments in our signatures. To be honest I'm just shooting ideas out, but I know that while the Arena lot can be very protective of their space they are ALWAYS looking to improve, so it shouldnt be hard to get some more ideas floating.

But it must be said, while I don't condone the language Xavier used I can understand his frustration. Its quite irksome when an essential 'outsider' to arena starts flippantly disparaging the forum that a lot of us take seriously as 'dead' and 'useless'. I imagine those who only do romance 1x1s on this site would get annoyed if we started claiming they are just a bunch of horny lonely cyber-sex people especially if it was something we knew little about. Again these small measures of respect are important if you really want to have a productive conversation.

I imagine those who only do romance 1x1s on this site would get annoyed if we started claiming they are just a bunch of horny lonely cyber-sex people

isn't that basically what they are, though?
(jk jk)

<Snipped quote by Dynamo Frokane>
Perhaps having a modicum of civility and respect would be better than such approaches. I suppose that is why Arena has the illicit reputation that it does. Something to think on, perhaps.

Well I was absolutely agreeing with you which is why I asked him to watch his language.

But I sure hope you wouldn't judge the Arena community's ability to have rational conversations based on one post by one individual? Because that would be very short sighted.

<Snipped quote by Grimhildr>
I do not agree with you that it is useless clutter. RPG already has a simple enough aesthetic structure that works for it, minimizing it more won't really give it any further utility or benefit outside of confusing the users of those sections.

yeah, i'm shit with words, but i still stand by the point: what's the point in letting them all have separate subforums, if they're rarely ever active?

Damn this forum moves fast.

Alrifht I don't have time to keep up with everything so I'm going to do a mass reply and you just kinda pick and choose which one fits for you.

1. Telling you that you're a POS was probably over the line. I don't apologize but I also won't do it again

2. As someone else and myself said I come from the Arena. Sometimes it's yell first ask later. Obviously that didn't go over well so for THAT I apologize.

3. I haven't read everyone's response but I can assume they are pretty much the same thing lmao.

4. On a serious note; I'm against the merging. I like that the Arena is dead because you know your interest check is going to get seen by everyone. And for the record it isn't dead in my opinion. Slow moving sure but not dead.

But anyway; sorry for being an ass but that's just who I am!

As far as Arena, I could brainstorm with some of the other frequent posters. Like I said I think advertising more eclectic fights instead of just Dante Vs Sephiroth style match ups could go a long way. Maybe we could have a detailed article in the criminally underused 'News' Sub-forum about what Arena really is and what it entails and how interesting you can make it beyond just a simple fight. We could also start hosting tournaments in our signatures. To be honest I'm just shooting ideas out, but I know that while the Arena lot can be very protective of their space they are ALWAYS looking to improve, so it shouldnt be hard to get some more ideas floating.

Perhaps trying to writing interesting collaborative contests and battles would be more beneficial to the section than these “Dante vs Sephiroth”-esque matchups that you mention. Arena-style RPs can be imaginative, fun, and dynamic but it seems from the pages upon pages of them that I have read [I am not an outsider who is presuming nor have inexperience with similar forums on other sites] that it is a forum that prides itself on “winning” in the same way some Nation RPs seek to play a flawed and shallow variation of RISK. As a community and audience you should want to inspire people to write, even in a competitive nature, in a thread that actually energizes and immerses them.

Also, perhaps if your regular users did not run into things with emotional insults and some decorum the illicit reputation would get better.

But anyway; sorry for being an ass but that's just who I am!

Perhaps being a respectful member of the community who has the decorum of an adult would suit you and your section better.

But I sure hope you wouldn't judge the Arena community's ability to have rational conversations based on one post by one individual? Because that would be very short sighted.

In all fairness, this would not be the first time I have observed behavior that validates your sections reputation.

But I feel somewhat uncomfortable talking about what should be done with Nation and Tabletop forums without people from those forums giving their point of view, I think there are probably a ton of other nuances about what makes their niches special that I could only speculate about.

Fair. I wish we could get some people from NRP and tabletop in here but they've never really seemed like people to participate in constructive chatter. NRP people are usually in spam, shitposting about communism ;)

As far as Arena, I could brainstorm with some of the other frequent posters.

Good. I'd be very interested to hear a more representative view from arena. There's generally not many of them around, bar maybe you, that actively participate in the community. And when they do, it seems to be in, what you called 'arena style'.

Like I said I think advertising more eclectic fights instead of just Dante Vs Sephiroth style match ups could go a long way. Maybe we could have a detailed article in the criminally underused 'News' Sub-forum about what Arena really is and what it entails and how interesting you can make it beyond just a simple fight. We could also start hosting tournaments in our signatures. To be honest I'm just shooting ideas out, but I know that while the Arena lot can be very protective of their space they are ALWAYS looking to improve, so it shouldnt be hard to get some more ideas floating.

Perhaps, the one issue I'd have with the news thing is that just like the reason RPGnews always failed is that just nobody reads it. There's nothing moderately interesting in there that I can't read myself. So while that sounds good in theory it might not really have the effect you might be looking for?

Maybe this is a bit of a far reach but I've thought about doing give away's. Although I have no interest personally in RPG arena, it might be an idea to attach more than just 'eternal internet fame' to a tournament. I get that it's not meant to be serious (and arena already has a reputation for being kinda gimmicky powergamers that get mad when you start beating them) but perhaps it's an idea to add a more.. physical prize. Or at least something worth remembering. Gives people a reason to participate. It's far fetched, but it'd be something to think on.

But it must be said, while I don't condone the language Xavier used I can understand his frustration. Its quite irksome when an essential 'outsider' to arena starts flippantly disparaging the forum that a lot of us take seriously as 'dead' and 'useless'. I imagine those who only do romance 1x1s on this site would get annoyed if we started claiming they are just a bunch of horny lonely cyber-sex people especially if it was something we knew little about. Again these small measures of respect are important if you really want to have a productive conversation.

I get that, but you have to understand, while arena is still 'alive' somewhat, it's close to dead. It's like, 2 seconds away from dying if we don't give it heart presses. I'm not saying that to shit all over your parade/arena, I'm saying that to make you/people/the moderators realize that not everything is OK. Arena, as a forum, is more or less dead. We can do something to fix it, or we can pretend it's 'just a phase' and not address it, right? Between those two what would you prefer?

_{As for your last line, I already characterize romance roleplayers like that, so more power to me, right? The point is also that I don't really care what people roleplay on here if it makes them happy, and I obviously support arena roleplaying as a thing, I'm just saying I'm not sure if it warrants its own forum if it continues to decline like it is now. :)}