@avorio

Its cool man I'm just waiting for the other guy to post then I'll post mine!

I get really nitpicky about what probably shouldn't be considered my business, sorry. [+]

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When I first read this it thoroughly confused me, then after looking through the Character Tab it just really bothered me. Honestly I feel like I should just let it go cause this is really just meant to be fun and not taken too seriously. I feel like I might be stepping on other people's ability to enjoy the RP by pointing stuff like this out but I'm a bit OCD which among other things means I'm really bothered when the details are out of sync, I tried to let it go and I just can't, it keeps nagging at me so I'm going to say it here and whatever you want to do with it that's your lookout.

Able to manipulate the earth as well as plants from Demeter
Able to create and manipulate water/ice from Artemis lunar powers
Able to heal herself and others

It seems like Rose has four (possibly five depending on how you divide them up) spheres of influence only one of which actually falls under the realm of her godly parent. Earth is the domain of Gaia, Water belongs to Poseidon, Ice falls under the influence of Boreas: The Cold North Wind, and Healing is one of Apollo's virtues. Only the plant manipulation actually falls under Demeter's abilities.

I can sort of see how you got to each of these,

Earth: Plants grow in the earth so Demeter has some measure of control there
Water: Plants need water to live
Healing: Growth is the process of a plant evolving and repairing itself

The ice abilities become a little more of a stretch. I think the logic goes something like this: Artemis is the goddess of the moon, the moon shines primarily at night, at night the temperature drops, ice forms in cold temperatures thus Artemis controls ice.

The Artemis abilities are the ones that bother me the most. In mythology Artemis is basically only the goddess of the moon to serve as a counterpart of Apollo being the sun god. While a number of his myths involve him driving the sun chariot and so forth Artemis' relationship to the moon is basically limited to her being the sun's twin and no more. She is much more strongly identified as the goddess of the hunt which is what the majority of her stories are about.

Leaving aside however whether Artemis has the kind of domain Rose's character sheet seems to indicate the real problem is her passing those abilities on to her followers. The Hunters of Artemis as we're using them in the RP originate almost entirely from the Percy Jackson book series. They're essentially a merging of the choir of Nymphs and Oceanids that Zeus gifted to Artemis with the idea that any female who joined Artemis on a hunt was required to swear a vow of chastity (the men who joined her on hunt usually ended up dead). In the myths there's no mention of Artemis bestowing special powers on those she hunted with and in the Percy Jackson books the abilities granted to the Hunters was immortality and the training that goes along with joining a group of people who have been hunting divine beasts for thousands of years.

Which kind of brings me to my next issue. Why is Rose severly under trained in the realm of hand to hand combat and archery? She is quite literally a handmaiden to the Goddess of Archery. Why would she be sent off on a solo mission to Olympus Academy if she's such a junior member of the Hunters that she can barely fire a bow?

Okay that went on a bit and I'm really not trying to make you feel bad but I just want to make this point:

The kind of logic that seems to be involved in giving Rose several of her abilities is the same kind of logic that could justify any demigod being able to control the domain of any other demigod no matter how far it is from their godly parent's actual sphere of influence. For instance: Poseidon and Zeus seriously hate each other right? The sea kids shouldn't have any possible way to influence the sky and air kids shouldn't have control over the sea. And yet using this type of logic Poseidon's demigods can control the air because water exists in the air as vapor. Likewise Zeus's demigods can control water because water molecules are one third oxygen.

It creates serious problems over who can do what when a demigod of the harvest is controlling the earth like a primordial and water like a sea god. My best guess is that given the level of some of the other character's powers being able to manipulate plants felt a little bit weak in comparison. That I get but instead of tacking on a bunch of extra things that only sort of fit why not instead focus on the godly parents primary attribute and just run wild with its possibilities.

For example this is a list of some of the abilities of one of the daughters of Demeter from the new Percy Jackson books.

<Snipped quote by Percy Jackson Wiki>

I know this doesn't sound all that impressive but think of it like this. Rose could carry around say a half dozen different seed pouches that spawn a variety of plants. In battle she could thrown down six watermelon seeds which rapidly mature into two pound watermelons that then launch themselves at her enemies like catapults. Smaller fruit would work too, I mean getting pelted with over ripe peaches so they splatter all over you isn't good or under ripe mangos so they're hard as rocks.

In a bind she could cause ordinary things to start growing again. Think of the amount of natural material that goes into basically everything nowadays. She's running from bad guys and as she runs she causes the floorboards beneath her feet to grow into thick clingy branches that block the path of the person or thing chasing her. Get creative with it. You don't need to tack on a hundred different abilities, just one or two really powerful ones.

I know I don't really have the right to ask this but is there any chance you guys could go back through your character sheets and put in more specific details about there powers and abilities? A lot of them are kind of vague and I'm just really worried that when we get to the PvP stage of the RP (as RPs like this will inevitably go) its going to be like when you played make believe as a kid and wanting desperately to not be outdone by your friends when he makes a big weapon you make a bigger one and as you go up the scale the weapons get bigger and make progressively less sense until you and he are wondering how you got where the game ended up.

That could be mitigated somewhat by more specific powers being written down including limits to those abilities, such as instead of putting down just the header "Necromancy" you specify what kind of undead you can summon, if you can do it anytime or require set circumstances, how many you can control at once, if there is a risk of them escaping your control. That sort of thing.

Obviously I have no authority here and you are more than welcome to simply ignore everything I've said. I just think it might be a good idea to keep the RP functioning smoothly down the line.

<Snipped quote by PharaohAtem>

Rose has the power to control earth and plants because her mother is the goddess of agriculture and is responsible for making the earth fertile and the water/ice manipulation from artemis was an idea I got from the one because of her connection to the moon her healing can be explained with ever one of her powers I could go the healing with water route like Persy or with growing healing hurbs and plants or a combination of both as for the fact that I am technically stepping into the domination of other gods demigods don't have to abide by the same rules as the gods they don't have set domains so a child of poseidon had water manipulation by extension they could control ice as is is just frozen water demigod can steal the power of gods so crossing into the domain of other gods if your power allows it is not only possible but not even a big issue compared to stealing a gods power as for her fighting skills the hunters of artemis are gifted with excellent range capabilities and hunting skills no mention of hand to hand or weapon skills her powers give her the ranged skills and she is good at hunting and tracking think about the what you could do with earth/planet manipulation alone creating vines to attack or bind people firing each spikes creating earthquakes to knock people off balance if you heat up the earth you can create molten rock or lava you can tune earth into sand and manipulative that heat up the sand and create glass you can manipulate the earth particles in any impure metal you can create armour out of plants and hardened it so it's as tough as steal ect so she is more then capable of keeping up out Artemis and the hunters on a hunt thee only reason I decided to take the suggestions to take a power from luner manipulation was because of the possible combinations between earth/plant manipulation and water/ice manipulation and I have already demonstrated the power of ice manipulation her weakness is close range compat simply because I thought giving her that weakness give her new mentor something to teach her and become it makes her more fun to play as after looking up the gifts Artemis gives her hunters I can't find anything other then immortality and ranged and hunting skills so if I had known that at the time of making the character I would not of given her anything from luner manipulation

@Weird Tales In the IC you @'d the wrong people for the interactions

I can't resist an argument [+]

<Snipped quote by PharaohAtem>

You don't have to justify how you got to all of the powers. I outlined that fairly well. I am aware of the justification for each of them. My point is that the justification is tenuis at best. The connection between Artemis and water is paper thin. Going from that to ice is even more so.

Yeah that's fair enough with the water and ice as I said I got the suggestion from the one and I can't really edit it out as it's a bit to late

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They do have set rules, it's kind of fairly self evident, the Demigods have powers based on the domains their parents control. If that wasn't the case then Demigod abilities would be completely random. As for your example a child of Poseidon could reduce ice back to base water and manipulate it from there or control ice in a limited fashion (such as causing a glacier to collapse) because of the water content but they couldn't create ice.

Creating ice with water manipulation is easy it's a basic form of the power it's simply cooling down water molecules so as long as they understand how to do it it would be reality easy

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No they can't. In the Percy Jackson books a demigod was capable of stealing the weapon of a god. Nothing more. That weapon is a source of considerable power, so much so that the wielder could easily burn themselves up using it. However holding the weapon of a god does not negate the inherent power that god is born with. Zeus didn't obtain the lightning bolts till after he ousted Chronus from the throne. At which point the Cyclops' who Zeus had freed from Tartarus forged the bolts for him to use as a weapon. Similar thing with Poseidon's trident and Hades' helm. As far as I'm aware not even that happened in the actual myths (though I could be mistaken and if I am point me to the appropriate story).

Ok sorry for this mistake I only watch the film and it from what I remember I thought they could steal their powers

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Artemis got six wishes from her father the lord of the skies and ruler of the gods. One of the things she asked for was a bow. You're telling me that someone who has the opportunity to be given anything in all of creation and asks for a bow isn't going to insist that her followers learn archery?

Then again that could explain why she's at Olympus Academy. If I were a god with a follower who didn't want to learn my sacred art I'd sent them away too.

She is a new recruit and she would be more then capable at range but the fact that she is still lacking in close quarters combat gives her a reason to be at the academy and helps her fit in if she had mastered all her powers and was a skilled warrior why would she need to attend a school that focuses on teaching you how to fight and survive and since has had no formal training and fights like a common street brawler it would take awhile for her to get good at close questions combat

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That's not a weakness, that's a limitation. Limitations can be overcome with work, they're caused by a character not knowing this or being unable to do that or having a personality defect like cowardice. A weakness is generally something that will be with them fro the rest of their life and they can their best to minimize the risk it posses but their is nothing they can do to fix it.

At the point that Rose learns to fight in close combat she ceases to have this limitation and from what I can tell basically becomes invulnerable.

Answered this in the precious question.

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Those are very vague terms, earth manipulation is a header that represents a very wide scale of abilities from being able to control the tectonic plates of the earth to being able to toss rocks around with your mind. Just saying that tells basic abilities but nothing about what she can really do. That's why I wrote down my powers and abilities in very specific manner through six paragraphs.

That would be a no on the tectonic plates while it is possible someone with earth manipulation could do it it would take a huge amount of energy

Dark Magic is no less vague than regular magic. I am sorry about using Mordred as an example of vague abilities after all the other things I said about Rose but at the time I didn't realize he was yours. After the spell slinging incident I looked up his character sheet. The Abilities section is suppose to reflect all of the powers a demigod has. There was nothing in Mordred's abilities that suggested to anyone that he would be capable of animating cartoon characters into powerful if fragile constructs or create golems. That's what I mean by vague. If the section fails to tell the rest of the RPers what your character can do in most circumstances it is vague.

Voodoo magic accounts for all of those spells

The bottom line is that the abilities you've given Rose, the application of them that you've described and your attitude towards abilities in the RP in general makes Rose constitutes the powers and abilities of a second or third generation god rather than a Demigod.

The point I am trying to make is something that is fairly evident to me but has to be something that you understand and agree to and to be honest I'm getting the impression that you're a lot like me in that when challenged you'd argue to doomsday before admitting to being wrong. It's something that I'm trying to work on so instead of continuing this I'm just going to leave it at this: Rose has too many different abilities which are only linked to Demeter in a general sense, if you can't see that I can't do anything to make you see.

Yes and no it may take me some convincing but I will admit when I am wrong

Out of curiosity though, did you actually read the Percy Jackson books? Cause a lot of the arguments you are making make a disturbing amount more sense if you've only seen the movies.

Answered this already but in case you missed it no only saw the 1st movie but I have been meaning to watch the others just haven't got round to it

Everyone else

Is this a problem for anyone else? Cause if I'm the only one that's bothered by it I'll shut up right now.

Also on an unrelated note there seems to be something wrong with the QUOTE function on the guild after the latest update. The quotes are all misaligned and the text doesn't fall under the right name mention if you're quoting a post that has a quote in it. Just thought I'd let you know.

Out of curiosity though, did you actually read the Percy Jackson books? Cause a lot of the arguments you are making make a disturbing amount more sense if you've only seen the movies.

No, only saw the first movie but I have been meaning to watch the others just haven't got round to it.

Yeah that's fair enough with the water and ice as I said I got the suggestion from the one and I can't really edit it out as it's a bit to late.

She is a new recruit and she would be more then capable at range but the fact that she is still lacking in close quarters combat gives her a reason to be at the academy and helps her fit in if she had mastered all her powers and was a skilled warrior why would she need to attend a school that focuses on teaching you how to fight and survive and since has had no formal training and fights like a common street brawler it would take awhile for her to get good at close questions combat.

<Snipped quote by PharaohAtem>

Don't bother, they were a travesty of story telling. The first one sort of functioned as a stand alone film but butchered everything good about the book to high heaven. The second one pulled plot points out of the second novel at random and mashed them together into a sort of coherent story that didn't make all that much sense.

Read the books, the five from the original Percy Jackson series are amazing and the sequel series are adequate.

As a side note, since this seems to be something you picked up from the movie. Percy didn't have healing powers. As a son of the sea god being in water (especially salt water) enhanced Percy's own natural abilities to the point where he was stronger, faster and his wounds healed very quickly but that couldn't be transferred to anyone else.

Ok but in the movie he used that power to heal someone else he moved some water between him and I think it was the daughter of Athena and he injures where completely healed

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Why not? In IC the only indication of these powers is her saying she can control water. No one has reacted to that statement and she hasn't displayed these powers at all. As long as you make sure the two players involved in the conversation know there's no reason why you can't change it. That's what the EDIT button is for.

No in my very fist post with her she was suffering on a ice bridge kinda like ice man from the x men

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I assumed she was at the Academy for the same reason the 576 year old Demi-Titan Huntress was. Because a war is brewing between the gods and the Academy represents the most concentrated source of lesser celestials in the world whom the gods need to serve as canon fodder. The gods need the demigods and titans to fight on either side and the Academy is the perfect place to observe loyalties.

Yes and no she is there to improve her skill and train to master her powers and get better at combat but also to help with the war kinda a 2 birds one stone kinda thing plus it helps her blend in

I can't resist an argument [+]

<Snipped quote by PharaohAtem>

You don't have to justify how you got to all of the powers. I outlined that fairly well. I am aware of the justification for each of them. My point is that the justification is tenuis at best. The connection between Artemis and water is paper thin. Going from that to ice is even more so.

<Snipped quote>

They do have set rules, it's kind of fairly self evident, the Demigods have powers based on the domains their parents control. If that wasn't the case then Demigod abilities would be completely random. As for your example a child of Poseidon could reduce ice back to base water and manipulate it from there or control ice in a limited fashion (such as causing a glacier to collapse) because of the water content but they couldn't create ice.

<Snipped quote>

No they can't. In the Percy Jackson books a demigod was capable of stealing the weapon of a god. Nothing more. That weapon is a source of considerable power, so much so that the wielder could easily burn themselves up using it. However holding the weapon of a god does not negate the inherent power that god is born with. Zeus didn't obtain the lightning bolts till after he ousted Chronus from the throne. At which point the Cyclops' who Zeus had freed from Tartarus forged the bolts for him to use as a weapon. Similar thing with Poseidon's trident and Hades' helm. As far as I'm aware not even that happened in the actual myths (though I could be mistaken and if I am point me to the appropriate story).

<Snipped quote>

Artemis got six wishes from her father the lord of the skies and ruler of the gods. One of the things she asked for was a bow. You're telling me that someone who has the opportunity to be given anything in all of creation and asks for a bow isn't going to insist that her followers learn archery?

Then again that could explain why she's at Olympus Academy. If I were a god with a follower who didn't want to learn my sacred art I'd sent them away too.

<Snipped quote>

That's not a weakness, that's a limitation. Limitations can be overcome with work, they're caused by a character not knowing this or being unable to do that or having a personality defect like cowardice. A weakness is generally something that will be with them fro the rest of their life and they can their best to minimize the risk it posses but their is nothing they can do to fix it.

At the point that Rose learns to fight in close combat she ceases to have this limitation and from what I can tell basically becomes invulnerable.

<Snipped quote>

Those are very vague terms, earth manipulation is a header that represents a very wide scale of abilities from being able to control the tectonic plates of the earth to being able to toss rocks around with your mind. Just saying that tells basic abilities but nothing about what she can really do. That's why I wrote down my powers and abilities in very specific manner through six paragraphs.

Dark Magic is no less vague than regular magic. I am sorry about using Mordred as an example of vague abilities after all the other things I said about Rose but at the time I didn't realize he was yours. After the spell slinging incident I looked up his character sheet. The Abilities section is suppose to reflect all of the powers a demigod has. There was nothing in Mordred's abilities that suggested to anyone that he would be capable of animating cartoon characters into powerful if fragile constructs or create golems. That's what I mean by vague. If the section fails to tell the rest of the RPers what your character can do in most circumstances it is vague.

The bottom line is that the abilities you've given Rose, the application of them that you've described and your attitude towards abilities in the RP in general makes Rose constitutes the powers and abilities of a second or third generation god rather than a Demigod.

The point I am trying to make is something that is fairly evident to me but has to be something that you understand and agree to and to be honest I'm getting the impression that you're a lot like me in that when challenged you'd argue to doomsday before admitting to being wrong. It's something that I'm trying to work on so instead of continuing this I'm just going to leave it at this: Rose has too many different abilities which are only linked to Demeter in a general sense, if you can't see that I can't do anything to make you see.

Out of curiosity though, did you actually read the Percy Jackson books? Cause a lot of the arguments you are making make a disturbing amount more sense if you've only seen the movies.

Everyone else

Is this a problem for anyone else? Cause if I'm the only one that's bothered by it I'll shut up right now.

Also on an unrelated note there seems to be something wrong with the QUOTE function on the guild after the latest update. The quotes are all misaligned and the text doesn't fall under the right name mention if you're quoting a post that has a quote in it. Just thought I'd let you know.

I haven't seen the DM in a while so I'm wondering if they have abandoned the RP