OK, I did miss that to be honest. On the other hand. I really do not think the captain would be that stupid. Not to mention.... they would still have some level of anti-boarding action stuff. Some of the crew and command staff would be armed. I would bet all my money that there are some heavy turret emplacements at key points inside. Like... the bridge, reactor etc. Just because it says it's a weak ass target for boarding doesn't mean the moment a soldier comes on board he wins.

Oh and how many of our characters are familiar with elder engineering? Who knows where the bridge would be located? So again I don't see a win here. Slightly less insane but still.

You don't understand, the hemlock is literally the next best thing to useless. It's a giant gun strapped to an only slightly less giant engine. To fire its weapon, it has to divert power from so many secondary systems that it is skeleton crewed not because it Should be, but because the life support system is drained of power to the point that any more bodies on the ship would turn to corpses by the time they were done firing.
The only reason it will work for Us is because it's 4/9ths engine, thus able to get us away from the battle in record time.

The plan is to hit them while the gun is firing, so the secondary systems will be off. We'll aim for so close to the bridge, they'll see us hit them through the window. After that, it's only a matter of fighting everyone who gets in our way. Plus, unlike orks, space marines, and admech, eldar are one of the few races that suffer quite a lot from poor atmospheric conditions. We'll be at the advantage while the life support comes back on fully, giving us the small window we'll need to kill everyone on the bridge.

Besides, you said it yourself; it's the Less insane plan. Given that we only have the two options, it's only sane to go with the less crazy one.

OK W/e my objections have been voiced.

despite the fact he made up some random, non-cannon ship that can't exist in 40k, yet decided for whatever reason not to make it at least capable of interplanetary travel.

It wouldn't have become stuck in a spacehulk otherwise.

And, no. The machine spirit would not accept us. It's a computer, they don't do that without being hacked.

There is no AI in the Imperium of man. Machine spirits have wills, but humans call the final shots. The crew and the ship would have to communicate with each other. You sound like we would have a chance in hell of boarding without human detection.

Can we drive an Eldar ship? Why is the Eldar ship not stealthed? Where exactly are we going to go with it? Can we communicate with the other ships? The Imperium? Does anyone read Eldar? Can we please stay out of the warp? I really hate Eldar. This is retarded.

Can we drive an Eldar ship? Why is the Eldar ship not stealthed? Where exactly are we going to go with it? Can we communicate with the other ships? The Imperium? Does anyone read Eldar? Can we please stay out of the warp? I really hate Eldar. This is retarded.

In order:
Eldar technology is controlled directly by the will of the psykers that pilots it. As we have a psyker, yes, we can pilot one.
See previous statement about All non-essential systems being turned off when firing its weapon, and us hitting while the weapon fires.
The same place we'd go in a high-jacked imperial vessel. I.e, somewhere not where we are.
We don't need to talk with other ships.
The Imperium wants 90% of us, including the ship we're currently in, destroyed.
No, but the ork knows a 'guy.'
Eldar craft fly through the webway, not the warp, so yes.
I hate eldar, too. That's half the reason I'm in favor of this.
*redacted by H.R. censorship*

Worth noting, but the actual decision of what ship to board is going to be Vedius'; whilst we should pick a ship to board, it ought to be based on Vedius' mindset of "what is a good ship to board and how". That said, a random Eldar ship winds up being a definite "no" in this situation, since there's no real way for Vedius to know that anything along the lines of the plan Necroes has suggested could be done, and I imagine even if he did, he'd rather object to turning hundreds of sentients into Chaos Spawn like that. I figure it's far more likely for them to just go ramming speed into an Imperial ship's bridge, take the bridge hostage, and commandeer the ship via suitable "persuasion" of the captain, whether social and subtle, or "I will mind control your brain directly via technology". 99% of the crew never even has to know they were boarded, on account of 99% of the crew doesn't work on the bridge.

I figure it's far more likely for them to just go ramming speed into an Imperial ship's bridge, take the bridge hostage, and commandeer the ship via suitable "persuasion" of the captain, whether social and subtle, or "I will mind control your brain directly via technology". 99% of the crew never even has to know they were boarded, on account of 99% of the crew doesn't work on the bridge.

Most people do seem to forget this, this being the fact that only the folks on the bridge really know what's going on on the bridge, the vast majority of any Imperial ship never even knowing who the hell is leading them. Then there's Rogue Trader ships which have entire crews made up of servitors...anyway, that's for a different time.

I am surprised that, out of all the plans, no-one has gone for a little bit of mind control, especially our Green resident; it may require that we abduct the Cap'n and implant something in their brain (probably where we bring the Mech in), but either way it may be preferable to warping an entire Xenos vessel.

Worth noting, but the actual decision of what ship to board is going to be Vedius'; whilst we should pick a ship to board, it ought to be based on Vedius' mindset of "what is a good ship to board and how". That said, a random Eldar ship winds up being a definite "no" in this situation, since there's no real way for Vedius to know that anything along the lines of the plan Necroes has suggested could be done, and I imagine even if he did, he'd rather object to turning hundreds of sentients into Chaos Spawn like that.

This is only partially true...mostly the part about my choice etc. The ship is on auto-pilot, the codes have already been figured out, so technically anyone with even rudimentary piloting skills could probably pilot it. Then again, no-ones even asked him, although the ship is damaged and probably needs to be landed/docked somewhere sooner rather than later, which does mean that chasing after an Eldar vessel does seem unlikely.

If I need to GM ex machina this thing then I will, but I reckon we can come up with something that doesn't involve mass spawning and running about after shadows in a slowly decaying ship.

It seems we are once again in a position where lore and rp clashes and people are angry.

Mostly since Necroes has loads of crazy ideas. (Not against crazy ideas, but they are crazy.)

First of all.
Voila.
wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Guncutter
wh40k-de.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/imag…
Not a combat ship, but probably what we're in. Or there will be one around parked somewhere.

About the size of a thunderhawk, void capable, fast.

But that won't do for warp.
So here.
Viper-class scout sloop.
warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Viper-cla…

Doesn't get much smaller than that.

Secondly.
Taking over an eldar vessel.
Eldar tech is strangely attuned to eldar, no, we won't be able to form the wraithbone, not even all eldar can do it. One needs a bonesinger to form wraithbone.
No, none of us is a bonesinger.

So the idea with taking over the eldar ship, eventually turning everyone into spawns/servitors is fun. But not really plausible.
And driving an eldar vessel is gonna be heck of hard, and that's with an eldar pilot.
Wrathbone connects naturally to ELDAR. If the dark eldar whom was in the rp a while would have been here, there would've been a chance.
But without an allied eldar, nope.

Thirdly.
The machine spirits are hard to contact, even harder to control. That's why the adeptus mechanicus specializes in training people who can easily work with the machine spirits and control their functions. These people are called tech priests.
And i happen to be one.
Infused with knowledge from Tzeetzch. Whom can corrupt machines and their spirits with a ritual, i think i can hack it, if that does not work i can probably "hack" it.
So getting past imperial tech obstacles, i can do that. Unless it is hermetically sealed and without access ports and with no UI. But if a device is so protected, what's the point of it?
I will probably be able to get to any imperial tech device and work with it. I'm however not saying they won't be protected.

Fourthly.
The ship problem again. Sure there are loads of crew on imperial vessels.
But we can probably fake it til we make it.
As in, on many imperial vessels, a lot of the crew don't know or don't care who the captain is. They are here to pull this chain. That's why there's so many crew to begin with. Since the imperium has poor automation on most of their ships.

So the number "about half" would be armsmen. Think again. Every 10k, probs only 1k is armsmen. Which is a problem for our group, i admit.
Unless those have already been committed to a boarding action that is.

So i say Cobra or Firestorm. Firestorm is more fun because lance cannon.
wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Cobra_Destroyer
wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Firestorm_Fr…

Also @Sophrus, a bomber?
You know how teeny and shitty those are in 40k? Sure they rip in the tabletop, but that's because they are massive in that scale. Almost like a thunderhawk.
But in space? We might as well try our luck in an arvus.
We're just as warp capable.
But i digress, i have nerded into the lore of things far too much and take for granted things that others don't know.
Smallest

So when we go into the ship, we head directly for the bridge. My character knows the way and can open any doors. There will be some defences but that shouldn't be too much of a problem.
We basically got a whole squad of space marines after all.

Then when we get to the bridge, we kill off the captain, take his hat, put said hat on a charismatic and authoritative person (not me or the ork) and claim that the ship has been forced to field promote a new captain.
We can fake an accident that kills their captain that is roughly believable.

And voila, we have a new escort vessel!
Warranty void if afflicted with chaos.

This plan can have more effect even if we choose a cruiser, since the crew will be more out of touch and care less for their captain.
But a cruiser will have bigger long term problems. Like when they realize that their command section is an ork and a squadron of heretics.
However that will be a problem regardless.

Fifthly.
We should stop arguing over lore when the real problem is how on earth are the dark angels and vedius gonna join the party?
Since i know lore, it's just the new stuff and some of the more obscure i don't know properly.
But i don't know how to get them to fit in.
It would suck if we had to kill them off or have them escape, effectively killing them off in a playability sense.

Sixthly.
What's so unclear about my capabilities?
I am a techpriest. Clearly stated in my sheet.
I am a ritual psyker. Again in the sheet. I can do weird shit like summoning deamons and corrupting shit if given time and resources.
I have been given knowledge by Tzeentch. Which i basically play like if i know it myself from lore, my character usually know it, or have a vague sense about it.
I have a pistol, which has been infused with warp energy. So it basically corrupts and have a chance of ripping through the veil when fired. It basically creates a psychic phenomena on the target every time it is fired.

So i don't get what is so lore-breaking with him?
He's been corrupted by Tzeentch, which can make the person into a psyker.
He knows a lot. And can get visions and memories from the warp. Fully normal for psykers.
He drips oil and shit. Classic corruption signs.

And about the group breaking lore.
The ork is the only one who is bordering lore breaking. But orks can be warp corrupted and the warp can do strange things.
So sure, it's bordering on plausible. But still plausible.
I still have issues with the ork, but that's another point.

All of the others are on point with the lore as far as i am concerned.

And the ork is just as implausible as the emperors children getting hold of a whole shipment of eldar waystones.
Sure, it can happen. There are multiple ways it could have happened.
But just like with the ork one goes "The what now?"
But i say it's still in lore.

This whole rp is actually mostly on point with the lore.
No marauder bombers in space, no random null zones in peoples rooms, no black ship to take us where we are going.
No drop podding everywhere, no finding the emperors hot rod project from the golden age of technology which is a warp capable golden warship with foldout lance arrays controlled by an AI.
All fine.

Yes, those are examples i've encountered in rp-ing. Or just watching people discussing lore.
Some people simply don't know lore.

And it still isn't fine to give the psyker a hexagrammic warded room, just to make him "feel better" for a single transit between worlds.
The psyker won't appreciate it, and it makes no frickin sense.
But i'm not bitter.... not bitter at all....... I'M DAMN BITTER!!!

So again, this rp is perfectly in lore.
This is fine.

It seems we are once again in a position where lore and rp clashes and people are angry.

I don't think anyone's angry, I'm certainly not, but there is a difference between using the actual lore of the universe and pulling things out of your backside to make the lore fit your vision of things. I'm not saying that that's been done here, just that this is probably why people would get angry.

I also never said there was a problem with your Cogboy, just that I've not glanced at the CS in a while and had no idea what his skills were...beside mech-things.

I'd go so far as to say that, in spite of protestations to the contrary, half the problem is having two quite potent psychic characters in a group of rather 'numb' beings. When I say 'problem', I mean others reacting to their frankly awesome (in the original sense of the word) abilities. Then again, that's generally the issue with psykers in general in any 40k setting.

But orks can be warp corrupted

Out of genuine curiosity, can you give me an example of that? Don't say Tuska either, he's not corrupted, he's manipulated by Khorne for entertainment purposes. AFAIK though there's never been a properly corrupted Ork in the lore.

Anyway, I like the idea(s) from Klom, and he's put it forward quite succinctly. I think we'd probably be good to G.O. with one of those ideas.

Lastly...

We should stop arguing over lore when the real problem is how on earth are the dark angels and vedius gonna join the party?

Pretty easily, I'd imagine; Thorn is already a quite netural character, Xeph will probably be fine once he learns he's being hunted by the Dark Angels, and Vedius is part of an entire legion that fell to Chaos - I'd think he'd be smart enough to know he wasn't welcome in the Imperium anymore, and would therefore have to not go back there ever. At least not with his current views in mind.

Our characters aren't made of stone, and they have minds of their own, it won't be as hard as you believe.

Can I also just re-iterate, this entire RP was based around renegades, pirates and mercenaries, I actually specifically stated that it was not a Chaos RP. Not sure why everyone seems to think that just because we have people aligned to Chaos that everyone needs to turn to Chaos (at least that's the vibe I'm getting here.) People seem to forget free will as much as they forget that there's plenty of traitors/enemies of the Imperium who never even spoke a prayer to the Ruinous powers, a good number of the Fallen among them.

@Jbcool His name is Lucius, you know. Thorn is just an alias, yanno? But yeah, well-said.

7000 crew? That's much more manageable.

As for who steals the captain's hat, it would have to be either of the dark angels or a regular human... maybe the tech priest. Otherwise the crew would know chaos is involved and give us hell. Given some time we could probably recruit some of the crew.

And we could probably keep the ship going with 2-4k crew

Well, could somebody post SOMETHING?

Ugh... if you all are so hard-set on making this Boring, then why are we even worried about bothering getting a full-sized ship?

Urgrugg is fully capable of punching a hole into the warp. He's done it once already, and given even a little time, especially with help from another psyker, he could do it again on a bigger scale.

We don't need a warp drive ship. We can just do what the ship Urgrugg flew in on to get to the hulk to begin with did. It's stated in his CS that Urgrugg can navigate through the warp. As it's how he got there to begin with, it's completely within reason he'd think to do it again to leave. Chaos psykers, such as the word bearers and the thousand sons, can use psychic runes and glyphs to protect their ship from the harmful effects of the warp, so we don't need a gellar field.

So, again, if you all want to be Boring, then fine... we can just hijack a thunderhawk, kill some random space marines, then get out of dodge.

@Necroes You once called Urgrugg a glass cannon...I'm beginning to think that that's quite wrong.

As for being 'boring', I'd hardly call hijacking the bridge of a vessel, semi mind-controlling its denizens with oratory and actual mind powers until we bend them to our wills, then escaping 'boring'.

It's times like this that I begin to wonder, as I've said before, why we even need other players. Why do we even need folks with other skills? Urgrugg seems to be anything we need at any one time, capable as a navigator and a combatant, as a ranged psychic attacker or as a close-combat machine (he is an Ork after all), as a summoner of daemonic entities, generally something I'm surprised the entire Ordo Xenos and Malleus aren't after at all times - dissecting him would be a worthy pursuit of their efforts indeed.

I'm fine with hijacking anything, really, so either I can post - which will be later today or tomorrow - or Necores can post. Either way, we'll get underway.

@Necroes@Jbcool I assume they're not after him because they don't know he exists yet. I imagine things will become way more difficult for every other player once they learn about him and his talents. That, and the two Dark Angels apparently working with him, which is just guaranteed bad news bears.

More importantly, I kind of need @agentmanatee to either kill two characters whose players have investments in them not dying, or to not do that so a truce can be formed after they have a viable ship. Otherwise, how will they all arm and otherwise ready themselves in time for a boarding action?

Yeah I really need Tee to post.

@BCTheEntity you've put me in an incredibly difficult situation here man

I've been trying to think how to move forward but... Azaxel likes his students but is completely willing to sacrifice them for his own desires

BUT I don't want to kill two characters or even one due to the investment of their players so... I'm free tomorrow so I guess I'll figure it out then

@agentmanatee I suppose this is the threat of PvP in general: everything gets snarled up in the process. Maybe we should have discussed in detail how things would go before starting that off? We still can, in fact, if you're interested in doing so.

@BCTheEntity I am interested in talking about that.

I'm at work all of today but am free tonight