@SleepingSilence Bro that's a fuck'n mood. I'mma redownload it tonight. I hope despite deleting my save data I'll still keep my progress cause I 100% the star chart. Which unlocks Steel Path (lvl 100+ missions) I'll PM you my name on WF as I don't have Switch Online.

Holy Fuck! This month looks like a gods damned slam dunk for Nintendo, we got Xenoblade Chronicles 3 in the works, Chrono Cross a 90's PS classic on the fucking Switch, Earthbound & Earthbound: New Beginnings plus a few other fun titles like the Mario Strikers game as well. And I guess a small mention to No Man's Sky which is surprisingly hitting the Switch soon.

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>searches "Lost Ark gameplay" on youtube, and gets a bunch of random paid hacks with carbon copied titles of each other.

Oh. Oh...it's one of these games, isn't it?

>clicks a first impression video

"Wowie, this game looks so good and fun." (It's an empty ass map.) "Wow. There's ver-ti-cal-ity in the maps, that's rarely been done in a top down ARPG before." (Like actually go f*ck yourself. That happens in even mobile ARPGs.)

>Shows several boss fight combats that don't even look flashy. Let alone any better than any other mmorpg that I've played ages ago.

This...this doesn't even look better than Path Of Exile. (Or New World, since it's trying to pass itself off as an MMO worthy of your time.) And it...it honestly doesn't look much better gameplay wise than those Diablo ripoff games on the android.

>The youtuber's hilarious cons are that leveling your character is boring and that it's "probably pay to win".

Are you f**king kidding me?

>And one of his pros, and I quote.

"This games endgame has raid bosses, that are harder than anything else in the game previously. And hard raid boss content isn't something you really ever see in MMORPS." (Hard end game content, and raids are in basically FUCKING EVERYTHING!)

Rant over. I made a mistake being curious.

I think your problem is sourcing opinions from people you deem to be paid hacks and not streamers or people you trust or like trying the game that is free out for yourself since the only thing wasted then is time. But as someone who has played a lot of MMOs, Lost Ark is better than New World because New World is on fire so much you can survive a winter with it as your primary heating source. And saying it doesn't look better than mobile games is a bit disingenuous.

I don't even like the game because its story is super shit and I disagree with gender locked classes but even I can't deny that the actual use of skills and moment to moment fighting of enemies is solid enough to be better than garden variety ARPGs. It doesn't have the polish of a AAA budget or even a AA Diablo knockoff but it's a good enough veg out game that'll absolutely die down in a month as is the way.

I might go down the platinum rabbit hole when Revenant Prime drops in the next 6 months because I hate myself my need for big buff ghostbuster man is insatiable and I will fork over my hard earned mons to attain the pretty-pretty shiny warframe

If Horizon Forbidden West sucks I'm gonna bash my head against a wall and never play video games ever again

And saying it doesn't look better than mobile games is a bit disingenuous.

doesn't look much better gameplay wise than those Diablo ripoff games on the android.

Good thing I didn't say that. :D

But my rant paragraph structuring was bad, so I don't blame you.

I think your problem is sourcing opinions from people you deem to be paid hacks.

Okay, so. If I found a trusted reviewer in my YouTube search, after scrolling through pages of it. I would've.

But to get into part two of that rant. If Lost Ark didn't exist. I wouldn't have seen a random unfollowed user on twitter say, "Guys, some play to win games are good. And some not pay to win games are bad. Guys. Guys."

With the entire comment section grilling him for the fact he used to go after bad monetization practices, and also knew exactly what game he was defending. (And I use paid hacks semi-ironically. Youtubers gotta eat too. But it's only because the game has spent "Raid:Shadow Legends" money on advertising itself/paying people daily to play & stream it.

I think it's just because I heard some fuck with a thick accent, pretend to be excited when he could jump in an MMO. And it made me lose my mind.

I can't deny that the moment to moment fighting of enemies is solid enough to be better than garden variety ARPGs.

I've loved to hear examples of ARPG'S it's better than in comparison.

But I suppose everyone said the same thing about Tera too. About how great the combat system is. And eh? I suppose it's probably more fun to play, then it is to watch.

But the kind of zealous online defense and equal parts hatred that I'm seeing from the community about this dated MMORPG. I think I'll stick with the cash grab I'm already fooling myself into playing. Thanks.

If Lost Ark didn't exist. I wouldn't have seen a random unfollowed user on twitter say, "Guys, some play to win games are good. And some not pay to win games are bad. Guys. Guys."

Lost Ark isn't pay to win. It's 'pay to convenience'. You can't just buy the best gear and pay to beat the raids, but you can buy stuff to remove teleport cost or various other quality of life shit that one could argue shouldn't be behind pay wall. But a free to play game is going to try and make money somehow, that's just the nature of the beast.

Also that twitter person is right.

With the entire comment section grilling him for the fact he used to go after bad monetization practices, and also knew exactly what game he was defending. (And I use paid hacks semi-ironically. Youtubers gotta eat too. But it's only because the game has spent "Raid:Shadow Legends" money on advertising itself/paying people daily to play & stream it.

If someone wants to go after bad monetization practices there are dozens of worse examples than Lost Ark. Also, games having streamers do advertisements is not new nor is it always someone faking it. Sometimes, yeah, it's clear that the person is just throwing away morals to make a buck which hey that's the hustle in this world, but sometimes someone can genuinely enjoy a game and also do an ad for it.

I think it's just because I heard some fuck with a thick accent, pretend to be excited when he could jump in an MMO. And it made me lose my mind.

Maybe it was done for laughs. Or maybe he's not an MMO player. You also can't even jump in Lost Ark outside of scripted 'press G to jump' sections. You can dodge roll though which is something a bit more unique to the MMO space.

I've loved to hear examples of ARPG'S it's better than in comparison.

Victor Vran, Titan Quest, Last Epoch, Wolcen: Lords of Mayhem, I think it's better than Torchlight, MU Legend.

I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility that Lost Ark, when the hype dies, can sit comfortably among the Diablos and PoEs of the world.

Because you can't have sex with characters in those games but you can in Lost Ark.

But I suppose everyone said the same thing about Tera too. About how great the combat system is. And eh? I suppose it's probably more fun to play, then it is to watch.

TERA was a breath of fresh air in the genre at the time because of its combat but because that's where the focus was you then had to contend with a fetch quest boring ass MMO where the fun stuff wasn't killing mobs but killing BAMs and dungeons but then that game had a myriad of other problems least of all doubling down on giving all the cool shit to the little girl loli race.

TERA could've been cool, man. Now I'm sad.

But the kind of zealous online defense and equal parts hatred that I'm seeing from the community about this dated MMORPG. I think I'll stick with the cash grab I'm already fooling myself into playing. Thanks.

Again, not a cash grab but also it's more of an ARPG with a chat room than a full on MMORPG. I'm not defending the game because, again, I don't think it's the kind of game for me (I like my games to at least pretend to have a story) but I can absolutely understand why there are people genuinely having fun with and enjoying it. Hell, I know someone who wasn't gonna play it and now almost has a max level character with plans to make more and they haven't spent a dime other than the head start.

That twitter person is right.

The statement is vague and misses the point at best. But we'll agree to disagree. No game needs to be pay to win. To make money, or to get people to buy things in it.

1. Lost Ark isn't pay to win.

2. There are dozens of worse examples of bad monetization practices than Lost Ark.

Seems a bit contradicting in those statements. In what they're implying. But most bad monetization practices aren't so zealously defended. Like I'm seeing online. Not from you specifically mind.

You can't have sex with characters in those games, but you can in Lost Ark.

It all suddenly adds up.

But yeah, I have a feeling I wouldn't have a better time here than Torchlight. Though, it's nice that you had fun, I guess.

I mean even the people I've seen defending the game, casually talk about how it'll die down in hype and go away in a month. And for a f*cking MMO. That's NOT AT ALL a good thing. This isn't a flavor of the month indie title. A good MMO, will not die in a month.

Seems a bit contradicting in those statements. In what they're implying. But most bad monetization practices aren't so zealously defended. Like I'm seeing online. Not from you specifically mind.

I don't think that's contradicting. Lost Ark not being pay to win doesn't contradict that there are games with worse monetization than it. SWTOR, for example, a game I genuinely enjoy literally locks you out of having multiple action bars and being able to move above a light jog unless you give them money to do so.

I mean even the people I've seen defending the game, casually talk about how it'll die down in hype and go away in a month. And for a f*cking MMO. That's NOT AT ALL a good thing. This isn't a flavor of the month indie title. A good MMO, will not die in a month.

Most MMOs have their most populous period at launch and then again at expansion releases. I don't think it'll die but I also doubt it'll go the way of New World.

Tell me that doesn't look like a mobile game RPG screen [+]

I've looked up and seen one of the "cinematic dungeons" and they look nice enough.

I mean I don't play many mobile games but that looks like a typical MMO character menu to me

[/quote]

I prefer Victor Vran.

Real text on a positive rated Lost Ark Review on reddit. (All about it not being pay to win.)

"To determine if Lost Ark is a Pay to Win game, you first need to know what Pay to Win is.

Pay to Win literally means you have to spend money to win.

If you spend money and lose, it is not Pay to Win."

What a bunch of absolute horseshit.

If I keep looking at people defending this game I might hate this game with a fiery passion. (Note, I didn't even actively look for this. It was just in my feed.)

@Fabricant451 Is this one right too? <.<

Because my real question/point, is you're making two separate arguments. 1. It has no bad practices. 2. Others games with bad practices are worse. (You do understand why one doesn't fit the other, yes?)

Because it truly never ends. Thanks Twitter.

Lost Ark is actively being censored in the US, and they darkened many of the Asian characters skin for the US 'Muh Diversity' crowd. (Look at her fucking eyes.)


Changed Outfits (Many clothing options were simply removed from the game.)

Less content. (Less customizations presets for characters.

Also, addressing this (or any other perceived problem) will get you permabanned from the community hub.

And all of a sudden, now I know why its being defended on social media. And me thinks it has very little to do with the game's combat.

Though hilariously, it became an Amazon product only a few months before its US release. So it's another Disney situation, where a multi-billion dollar company is being blindly defended for actively making a product worse.

Real text on a positive rated Lost Ark Review on reddit. (All about it not being pay to win.)

"To determine if Lost Ark is a Pay to Win game, you first need to know what Pay to Win is.

Pay to Win literally means you have to spend money to win.

If you spend money and lose, it is not Pay to Win."

What a bunch of absolute horseshit.

If I keep looking at people defending this game I might hate this game with a fiery passion. (Note, I didn't even actively look for this. It was just in my feed.)

@Fabricant451 Is this one right too? <.<

Because my real question/point, is you're making two separate arguments. 1. It has no bad practices. 2. Others games with bad practices are worse. (You do understand why one doesn't fit the other, yes?)

Pay to Win literally just means you can pay money to get an unfair advantage over other players, be that in buying better gear, buying 5 star characters in whatever gacha bullshit people play, etc. If you can definitively buy your way to being better than someone on an otherwise level playing field, that's pay to win. World of Warcraft selling exclusive mounts for real money isn't pay to win but if it suddenly sold legendary gear that gave you an advantage in pvp and/or pve content that other players couldn't get, that's pay to win. A game lessening the grind doesn't make it pay to win. If Lost Ark started selling gear that was above BiS that utterly ruined game balance, then yeah it'd be pay to win.

My argument isn't that Lost Ark has no bad practices and you'll not find me making that argument. My argument is that it's not, by definition, pay to win unless you change the definition of 'pay to win' to 'paying real money for anything in the game that is beneficial in any way'. Which is a slippery slope to outright saying 'all microtransactions are pay to win' instead of simply 'microtransactions are fucking bad' which is inarguable.

Lost Ark can have bad monetization and other games can have worse monetization without Lost Ark being pay to win. That's not contradictory. What Lost Ark is doing is what SWTOR does and other free to play MMO games do: incentivize players to essentially pay a monthly sub or equivalent. Is SWTOR pay to win if subscribed or preferred players get a mount at level 10 instead of level 25 or have access to more content or customization options? Is Lost Ark pay to win because you can purchase a recurring fee that makes teleports free and slight boost to exp? Because by that logic, FF14 is pay to win because you can buy a level skip to the current expansion and so is WoW because of character tokens. Even ESO does it and that's a buy to play game.

Lost Ark is actively being censored in the US, and they darkened many of the Asian characters skin for the US 'Muh Diversity' crowd.

Is this really the hill you want to die on, my guy

Is this really the hill you want to die on, my guy

No, I assumed it was your hill.

If a game has numerous bad/mobile-game practices. Why waste so much time defending it?

Also, realize that I've not made any "pay to win" arguments. All of its defenders have. And it screams, lady doth protest too much.

Lost Ark is a great game, I think I'm gonna max my first character today. Super excited for the endgame

Lost Ark is a great game, I think I'm gonna max my first character today. Super excited for the endgame

You forgot to add the 'Beep Boop'.

<Snipped quote by Hey Im Jordan>

You forgot to add the 'Beep Boop'.

not sure what you're on about, i have like almost 30 hours in it

da fuk is Lost Ark?