Sere

Suicide, Tragic or Selfish?

Kadaeux said
Yes there really is a difference.A suicide is a person who terminates their own existence without justifiable reason based on emotional or mental difficulties that they are having at the time.A euthanasia is a person who is conscious that their mental state is either degrading to a point where ANIMALS have more conscious thought and control of their body, or the is so great that it isn't like torture, but is literal torture, to continue living. It's not about how long. It's about reasons.

It is a play with words. If I take a firearm and shot myself in my car in some parking lot (car park) people will say that is suicide and was not rational. When I more to Washington state, one of a few states you can die early: the voters do not like the words assisted suicide. Nope, it polls better if you use a different word to do the same identical policy. It is politics when you just change the words around to change the public poles.

Yes actually it IS criminal neglect that they died. If your nursing home or prison maintained such a of standards that a common illness resulted in the death of someone under your care that is Criminal Neglect and is illegal at least here in Australia.Anyone who doesn't seek medical treatment if the flu becomes that life threatening is going to die and I have no compunction to save them. But then again, I don't live in America and its idiotically draconian system that is on par with most because "Health Care" is "too Communist" to have.A rational reason for your death if an 8yo with the flu gives it to you and you die?

There has been a number of political scientist that have debated for decades about why type of government is more likely to happen in America if and when the government collapse. No, it is not going to be communism, it is going to be fascism. America has been for a long time, been a center right country and were moving more to the right all the time. The more stress America has, it moves more to the right. Hold on when Climate Change is accepted by the right. They will be looking at Canada and say, you have breading room and it is much cooler above 48 degrees north. Think I am joking, just a few years ago a military report came out talking about America with an invasion plan to take Canada in the event that the United Kingdom was invaded by Germany.

In America still supports "Social Darwinism" my friend. The good point is health care in the past. If you are poor, if you are old, if have no needed importance, we find out we do not care if you life or die. Right now in the state of Georgia, the governor wants to get ride of a federal law that says a hospital must provide you will medical care until your well enough to be discharged. Reason being, there have been a number of hospitals that have closed because they are taking care of the poor in their neighborhood. True, they could get healthcare, but, it is a southern state that does not want universal healthcare.

Let us put it this way. If the state of Georgia gets what it wants. And your a person that does not have insurance, they can just tell you after you tell them your going to take your life go away. Then you cross the street and take a firearm and shoot yourself. It would be no crime done by the hospital. But, if you read my last comment above, and you call the police after the hospital talked to you. You go to prison.

Suicide, Tragic or Selfish?

Magic Magnum said First off, most of us are not american.We are not affected by stuff like Obama Care, we have general health care that applies to all citizens.Also, society is not a hive mind. We are not consciously going "We want ______ dead. Let's as a society cut them off from help and kill them".Let's leave government and society conspiracy theories to kill people off separate please? They do not relate to suicide or depression.I'm sorry that whatever you experience has caused you to look at all of society under such a light. But that is not how society functions, and treating society/the people in it as if they do isn't accurate and only slows down the rate we can deal with issues like depression and suicide because we are burning efforts fighting something that does not exist.

Government can push people into suicide or away from suicide. Right now, your talking how to prevent suicide and it only becomes prevented by acts of a government. The reason that America has a higher rated of suicide, is because of the easy access of firearms. My argument is not about the front end of gaining a firearm to end into suicide. My argument is what what we do in America at the back end.

Let us do a role play here. You have a firearm, and you live in an apartment or you wish to die in an area that people have the right to be their. Now let us say you plan to take your life in an apartment. Now let us say you call someone to ask the police to come over to give you help. Now some will say great, the system worked. The person called someone to send the police to help this person from taking their life. The person will get help, and were all happy.

In America, the police see you with a firearm in an apartment. They cannot arrest you because you were thinking of suicide. They will arrest you, because you were thinking of discharging the firearm that could have gone into the wall and hurting someone on the other side of the wall. The person could go to prison, but, more or less they will accept a deal that you become a convicted felon. As a felon, he will lose his right to a firearm. In some states, lose the right to vote. And as a felon, lifetime wages are cut by thousands of dollars. In America, if you ask for help right at the time you are thinking of killing yourself. You find out that help is punishment.

Now, if that person has a mental illness, and suicide was a bye product. It is going to be high that the next time, they will not call for help as they understand help as punishment. Most people that do take their life, they have already in the past asked for help in their attempted suicide. So, do not tell me government is not a player in suicide.

Russia takes back Alaska (FxF, FxM)

Was thinking about what Russia is doing in Europe. I thought how interesting it would be if Russia takes back Alaska. Now, I will play the character Sarah Palin. And her big comment after Russia takes over is "I do see Russia from my home."

Suicide, Tragic or Selfish?

Magic Magnum said
[2]To clarify before I start, I'm one of the people defending suicide as not being a selfish act but rather a potential end result of an illness same as Cancer, heart failure etc.But I do still have to disagree with the logic you are using on the topic of suicide.Suicide = Concious decision to kill yourself because you dislike lifeEuthenasia = Or (while sane & concious) or a Loved one, chooses to end your life after or right before you reach a vegetable state.Criminal Neglect = Finding someone who is mentally ill and leaving them to die.If anything Criminal neglect is to be related to murder, not suicide cause it's not the person whose life is ending having a say in the matter.But even then it wouldn't count as murder if they are being provided for and cared for, it is simply a sad existence.

Logic, with a deep topic like this. It would take thousands of words to take care of all lose ends. Still with logic, the sentence can be wrong but it is still logical. Like for example: "If the sun rise from the south then it will set in the north." We know that sentence is wrong, but written in a logical format.

I do not see the difference between the two. Lets say, we know that person A will die of a natural death on their 100 birthday. Is it just suicide because the person takes their life on their 20 birthday. Or, is in not suicide if they end their life when they are 99 years old? True, we do not know when a natural life comes to an end. With me, you are ending a life early.

You talk about someone that is left to die at a nursing home and see it as a crime. Hate to tell you this, it happens each and every day. The flu is a good example, as thousands of people die because of it. Death because of the flu is a natural death. If you are young, and you do have insurance you can get cured. If you are homeless, and you are young the flu should not kill you. True, it can get worse, and in that case they will pick up your body from under the bridge. And society will say, well you should have know better then being homeless. You should have gotten a job when we took away your housing and food stamps. You are dead, that was God's will so never question him.

See, someone can take away your Obama Cara, your Food Stamps, and if you die. Well it was not really suicide. We as a society just wanted you dead, so you can say for some people it was assisted suicide just to get votes from people that want their taxes cut. Is that criminal, no. Is that wrong, no.

Strange, society only cares about suicide if they feel they could have gained something from the person. What does society say, he was so young. He had his whole life ahead of him. He was so smart he could have done something with his life. He was a great guy. If a drunk that is homeless ends their life in suicide. They will say, oh some homeless guy jumped from a building and caused great damaged to the property below.

Suicide, Tragic or Selfish?

Skittlez said
I have struggled with suicidal thoughts frequently since (I think I wrote my first suicide note at) 9/10. I tried to tell my mother at 12 and she only seemed very annoyed. We never had the discussion again. I still suffer from it. My sister (about to be 14) threatened to kill herself and only then did my parents get her help. My mother often refuses to give her the medicines she's been prescribed and will yell at her for being ridiculous if she cries or feels depressed. My mother doesn't want sick children. She wants perfect children. Not that I've ever been good enough for her, my sister was always the favorite. But let me tell you I have never seen a child fall so far from grace so quickly. I will never tell my mother about how I feel, or what my ex did or things I've done because she would only be annoyed and disappointed.THAT is selfish. I'm not saying suicide isn't selfish (I'll admit that it is), but it may not be the most selfish choice being made.

I am bipolar, and I have received that story countless times. Mother and father do not like it when you talk about suicide because they feel its their bad DNA that made you think that way. My friend, eugenics is alive and well. The more you think about it, we just turn into life stock. Were just animals, nothing more and nothing less. Were just kept alive because someone feels they can make money off from us.

Suicide, Tragic or Selfish?

Kadaeux said
No.Suicide is when a rational thinking being decides that their fear of being alive outweighs their fear of dying and goes for the great escape.Euthenasia is when a rational thinking being knows that the quality of life they have left is going to be so terrible and such a burden on their family that they want a peaceful dignified death. Not to become a meat-shell going through the motions or a pure sac of agony.YOUR utterly terrible mindless example is called "Criminal Neglect" or "Manslaughter"

Is it? Is there really a difference between the two, or, is it just a play with words. How long must someone debate about their rational death that it does not become suicide but is a good death? What you call criminal neglect, is there a difference to watch someone die in a nursing home then same a prison? Both are covered by tax dollars. If I was a nurse and have the flu, one is in the nursing home and the other in a prison. If their life was so run down that my flu kills both, is it criminal neglect that they died. NO, because were do you stop. Reader, you could have had the common flu in your life, gave it to someone else and that person gave it to someone else that ended in death. Or, you could have had the flue, gave it to someone and never seen them again only for them to die some time latter.

The reason I support suicide at any time, as were going to die some time in our life. I can be a 100 year old woman and be killed by a 8 year old girl with a flu. Oh, you can come up with a rational reason for my death in that way. But, if I say I want to die in say my 20's and in good health, then it is not a rational reason to die. So, the rational reason to be alive is to pay taxes?

Suicide, Tragic or Selfish?

Gat said
nothing, is EVER bad enough that taking ones own life is the best or even a viable course of action to take *. Sure it solves their problem, but it also creats more problems for everyone around them.

It is clear you have never worked at a nursing home. Its a dumping ground for family members. Grandma gets old, her mind is now gone. She is now in a wheelchair screaming "Help me Help me Help me" and a staff member ask how can I help you. She just looks at you and is confused. You walk away and she starts screaming again. Or, your in a wheelchair and you go the bathroom and you do not even know it. And if you are a family member, and you know your grandma can be like that for years. Sons and daughters and other family members cannot take it -- and they refuse to come back. And when grandma health gets bad, they could take her to the hospital. But since the family members cannot stand looking at her. She ends up in the day room to hang around the fish tank, and the staff at the nursing station just watch her die. We can keep grandma alive a little bit longer, but we drop her in the day room to watch her die. Is that not suicide?

Suicide, Tragic or Selfish?

Let me be clear about this subject. Not today, on the next day. But, some day I will take my own life. Now, some day my health will start to fail me. It can be that I am in pain all the time. It could be that my mind is starting to go. Or, I am just tired of you and everyone. Now I am an agnostic, so I do not think of a afterlife. Now if there was an afterlife and I did go to heaven -- I would be begging for suicide.

Think about it this way. Say I have cancer or some other illness that is going to kill me in say months. If I decide to end my life, you say it is weakness and you would say you will do whatever you need to do to keep me alive. If I told you the cost is $500,000 dollars or more to keep me alive. Is it not strange, society will spend so much money to keep me and others alive when death is so close to the end. On the other hand, if your going to college and you have over $100,000 in student loans. Society says to bad, just pay it back with interest. And with that student loan, you have a hard time to get a loan for house. Or, a loan to start a business. And if you do have a home, its hard to sell it to someone with a student loan they have to pay back. So, more people with student loans after college, the value of your house stays more flat because they have to pay a home loan and a student loan.

Is it not strange, if you go to college and have a student loan your long term net worth is cut by thousands of dollars over a lifetime. But, if your a old person near the end of your life. and have less then a high school education, society will be so glad to spend whatever it can to keep you alive. Even spend more then a four year college education. Now think of yourself with an identical twin at the age of 17. One twin has cancer and society will spend $500,000 or more knowing society will never get it back after the twin dies of cancer. The other twin, could go to college but if loaded with student loans, and the twins lifetime net worth is cut by thousands of dollars. And over a lifetime, could have paid back society in taxes.

Nope, if I have cancer and I know I am going to die -- I would accept suicide. In my hope, the cost to keep me alive could go to someone else with a grant to go to college. My life is over with, and just pushing on is being selfish. I would wish someone that is planing to go to college, can go to college for free. They life a long life and they produce something that is positive. For me, my suicide, is a good death.

Identical twins (FxF)

New idea! What about Granger has a identical twin sister and both sisters decided to kill Harry Potter?

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