ThatOneGuy said
No mods have shown up

Actually, three of us have popped in here to keep an eye on things from time to time. Just because we don't say anything doesn't mean we're not around.

Ah, but ThatOneGuy, the thing is that Drakel, Prince, ravenDivinity, and Aeonumbra are right in this matter.

We're in the dark, sure, but as Prince said the Guild is in a stable condition. Yeah, if there's another Guildfall it'd be even more crushing than the first one, but some of us will never leave. I am one of those individuals. I was with the Guild for most of my 5 years RPing, and unless the site goes down permanently or essentially everyone I RP with (or at least those who make/enjoy the RPs that I enjoy) disappear, I sure as all hell ain't going nowhere.

I mean, when Guildfall happened myself and several others already had a healthy RP and its community going. The Guild was down for a few weeks, and when it came back up, so did our RP. We stayed in contact and the moment the Guild was back and we got our posts back (which we did because we backed it up and everyone was determined to finish it) it came back. We finished that Season/Arc of the RP and guess what. The next season/Arc/RP is up now and it's healthy and it's going to stay that way.

As long as there are several RPs in each section that are healthily running and the site remains up, even if it is finnicky, there will be (as several have said) a dedicated community of RPers who won't be going anywhere.

Oh yeah, and a pretty website does not immediately mean you have a good community. Iwaku is pretty, but it's shallow and you don't pick a shallow woman to be your life partner, you pick the interesting reliable and trustworthy one. The people who leave are those who don't seem to get that.

Oh and people have offered to donate money, Mahz has refused their assistance and stubbornly trudged on. So it's not the memberst hat is the issue. We just all need to be able to have one solid sit down with our amazing admin, (because he is amazing, deal with that) and figure out what we're gonna do. However, there's one thing about this, we can wait. The site will be fine for awhile. Move on.

Hell, I know some who left and came back because they realized that even with its bad formatting and bare bones state, the Guild was still a better community. So yeah. Everything has flaws, learn to deal with them, or leave.

We get it, there are issues and most of us who've been here more than a few days know that. Get over it man.

Your argument, while valid, is a weak one.

Oh, by the way, I tried Iwaku for a few weeks (didn't even have to leave the Guild, I was on both, imagine that) and I discovered something. Starting a new RP over there without first spending dedicated time to the IRC chat, basically means your RP will fail, nine times out of ten. The types of RPs, the variety, and some other core things that Guildgoers love, are simply not there.

Sorry bro, you just got stomped, for the fifth time.

Know when to give up and go home.

Ciao~

EDIT: I decided to move this to the third page :P

TheDoctor said
And how do you know this?No, Iwaku is pretty similar except for a different layout and means of finding RPs, which is the reason many people have migrated.Also, you're saying this when you also moved to another site, there's a strange hint of irony there.

I'll concede that I'm not 100% sure that no staff members have fucked off to Iwaku, but I can say that if any of them have they haven't talked about it openly anywhere. There was a bit of an exodus in October that included a group being made for people who'd migrated, and there are no RPG staff people there, nor have any popped up elsewhere on the site. It's possible that some have made an account there, but if so they're rolling incognito, whereas the OP spoke as if it was something that they had certain knowledge of. Sherlock is still here, HeySeuss is still here, Lillian is still here, Kangaroo is still here, Mahz and Contra are still presumably "here" insofar as they haven't migrated to Iwaku at least. The statement of staff members having migrated is just plain wrong, because they're all still here.

I'm saying that it's a different community because I've moved there. I know what it's like via first-hand experience, and it's not very similar to modern RPG or pre-guildfall RPG. The only place that it bears even a passing resemblance to is pre-guildfall Spam, and Spam was always an outlier section rather than being something emblematic of RPG as a whole.

ThatOneGuy said
Just look at this news section.Four weeks since we've heard anything of significance, and that was the newsletter.

Which has nothing to do with those two things I was countering. Notice how I said nothing against the main premise, just against two minor points.

Aeonumbra said I took about two looks at Iwaku, first of all. I hate the layout. So the guild has a bit of simplicity about it right now, so what. Does it work? Yea, so why are you complaining? "because it's not perfect all the time, and I don't have all the options I want, and, and, and" ... Neither does my local grocery store, do I still shop there? Yea. I agree with divinity, if you find something cool and shiny show people. But don't tell them that their light is dying just because you found a different one. Iwaku, from what I glanced at, has something about trophy points and ratings, and seriously, if that's what it takes for someone's spirit of roleplay to be nurtured, competitive point systems, I find that kind of ridiculous.

Roleplaying is a great hobby of mine, I have the passion for writing but not the attention span to write a novel. Novels are lonely, and self-criticism often bums me out to the point of not writing at all. But coming to the guild, and being a GM myself, as well as a player, is about the only commitment I've had when it comes to writing (Free of will, of course). This place is like a home to me, full of strange and awkward people. So it takes a little longer to start up a new roleplay, so there's not as many new ones floating around anymore.

I myself have been busy, and haven't been very active for a couple of months. Life will do that when you have a death in the family, when you put in time and effort on a new love interest, when you try to get your life back on track. Some leave, but some do not forget, and some come back. I am one of the people that will never leave. I'm sure there are plenty like me. As long as we gather and form the light, more will come. The guild is not "dying" and I feel it will only die if it goes offline, if it goes dark. I honestly hate all other roleplay sites, because I'm so used to the guild.

Mahz has a life too. Personally, I've never even talked to Mahz, but I have seen some things he posts. Everybody has a life, roleplay is our passion, the guild is his. If he doesn't have time for it, if he doesn't have the money for it, even if it has been a year. You never know what it's like in someone else's shoes. The guild functions, it works, and that's good enough. You don't have the right to demand, or expect, anymore than you have. You are not entitled to anything but your opinion, so if you feel the guild is dying then leave. I would much rather have a smaller number of more committed players, than a high number of Houdini's (those who vanish).

Honestly. The guild will never "die" because I will never leave. I can roleplay here, and that's good enough for me.

Masaki Haruna said
We have lives.

Prince said This isn't a problem. It's a topic. I'm on both RPGuild, Iwaku and other sites. A lot of this post has become RPGuild vs Iwaku, someone attacking the validity of stats (stats that I have for the past seven months, thus I know the trends of the site), and an overall emphasis on activity vs. community. I'll address all of it.

First, RPGuild is a living community. It might be hurting, it might be shrinking, but saying that its dying is false. I know firsthand the stubborn roleplayers here that will stay true to the Guild and stay true to Mahz through anything. The Guild will not die until Mahz allows it to and he will have a legion of loyal community members until that day.

Second, one cannot say Iwaku is the new RPGuild. The original and most fundamental aspect of the RPGuild was that it was the reliable rock of a site for all roleplayers. It may have stopped being that since Guildfall, but it hasn't let us down since. It is here for us. So is Iwaku, but Iwaku is not nor will ever be what RPGuild was. RPGuild was alive through so many eras ans convergences of other communities, including the ones I came from, that a site like Iwaku - even if it becomes something great - can never be what the RPGuild was. The thing is, the RPGuild can't ever be that again, either.

Third, I have 7 montths worth of almost-daily stats, but I don't feel the need to tell a single soul here about them or my readings. Just know this: the Guild is stable. It may not be 'healthy', but it's definitely stable.

Lastly, activity is only one aspect of a community. The RPGuild has its own community, but lemme tell you what. There are parts of this community I abso-fucking-lutely hate, but I'm still here. There are vehemently ignorant individuals, there are those only concerned with their own well-being, there are those that refuse to accept responsibility or conditions for their position. This community has a LOT of immature people within it. Those are the faults of this community. There will be faults within ANY community. Despite those faults, I'm still here in three roleplays - two of which are growing larger and have sprouted out of nowhere. Two of which were founded on my prospect of a "Community-created" roleplay. This community is what it is, for better or worse, and those that want to ignore its downsides and dark parts can remain ignorant all they want, but you can't have the solid dedication of the Guild without it. The activity of this site, comparably, is weak. It's a fact. These are things everyone just has to get used to and move on with. If you don't like them, leave. If you can't stand to leave, get over it. If you're brand new here, then I'll tell you firsthand Iwaku has just as many community issues as the Guild. Differences don't determine superiority when such is a matter of opinion.

All in all, I think both sides of this argument are wrong. No one wants to accept the faults that exist universally and apparently no one wants to accept that superiority-of-site is an opinion. You can present whatever criteria you use to make the decision, but to someone else it might be irrelevant. This isn't an objective case.

Yoshua171 said
Ah, but ThatOneGuy, the thing is that Drakel, Prince, ravenDivinity, and Aeonumbra are right in this matter.

We're in the dark, sure, but as Prince said the Guild is in a stable condition. Yeah, if there's another Guildfall it'd be even more crushing than the first one, but some of us will never leave. I am one of those individuals. I was with the Guild for most of my 5 years RPing, and unless the site goes down permanently or essentially everyone I RP with (or at least those who make/enjoy the RPs that I enjoy) disappear, I sure as all hell ain't going nowhere.

I mean, when Guildfall happened myself and several others already had a healthy RP and its community going. The Guild was down for a few weeks, and when it came back up, so did our RP. We stayed in contact and the moment the Guild was back and we got our posts back (which we did because we backed it up and everyone was determined to finish it) it came back. We finished that Season/Arc of the RP and guess what. The next season/Arc/RP is up now and it's healthy and it's going to stay that way.

As long as there are several RPs in each section that are healthily running and the site remains up, even if it is finnicky, there will be (as several have said) a dedicated community of RPers who won't be going anywhere.

Oh yeah, and a pretty website does not immediately mean you have a good community. Iwaku is pretty, but it's shallow and you don't pick a shallow woman to be your life partner, you pick the interesting reliable and trustworthy one. The people who leave are those who don't seem to get that.

Oh and people have offered to donate money, Mahz has refused their assistance and stubbornly trudged on. So it's not the memberst hat is the issue. We just all need to be able to have one solid sit down with our amazing admin, (because he is amazing, deal with that) and figure out what we're gonna do. However, there's one thing about this, we can wait. The site will be fine for awhile. Move on.

Hell, I know some who left and came back because they realized that even with its bad formatting and bare bones state, the Guild was still a better community. So yeah. Everything has flaws, learn to deal with them, or leave.

We get it, there are issues and most of us who've been here more than a few days know that. Get over it man.

Your argument, while valid, is a weak one.

Oh, by the way, I tried Iwaku for a few weeks (didn't even have to leave the Guild, I was on both, imagine that) and I discovered something. Starting a new RP over there without first spending dedicated time to the IRC chat, basically means your RP will fail, nine times out of ten. The types of RPs, the variety, and some other core things that Guildgoers love, are simply not there.

Sorry bro, you just got stomped, for the fifth time.

Know when to give up and go home.

Ciao~

Pretty much everything above. Mahz has a life. He works likely hellish hours trying to scrounge enough money to simply pay the site's bills not to mention his own. Do not blame this on him when he's trying. He can't be everywhere at once, get over it. Or, would you rather he run himself even more into the ground and lose his health to make you happy? God damn.

Site is in pretty major need of a communicative admin and has been so for way too long. The reason why a lot of people have moved (including myself) is precisely because of this. There's not really been that much in the way of any updates or actual communication and activity with any of the admins in the year this new guild has gone up, which doesn't spur encouragement. Does this mean the site's dying? No, of course not, but in comparison to what it could be and what it used to be it's fallen a long way and doesn't seem like it really wants to get back up again. If people are content with an uncommunicative admin that's totally fine, I'm not and that's why I've moved. And yes, whilst people have lives of their own, it's pretty amazing that for the length of time this new guild has been around (10+ months), there's not really been that much in the way of communication or forward progress, so will there really be that much more in the future, especially when Mahz will be constructing this site from scratch without any asssistance at all from others? I wonder. I can only imagine the workload of doing such, to bring about the features he described back when the guild was being brought back up again - it would take an incredible amount of time to code from scratch alone, and considering the amount of work done so far, I can't really see any of it happening anytime soon, if at all.

Regardless of any faults a site may have, as many people have said it's ultimately the community of a site that matters and is important. But again, something that can't be ignored is that a lot of the community has fallen and decided to move to other sites. I think it should be pretty clear and evident to all that a number of the site's regulars have gone. Which, for any forum is a shame, but in this case not wholly surprising. Regardless of whether or not people like or dislike the OP's post and thread or opinion, this discussion is something that this forum sorely needs. As would any other forum or site about issues that people think are severely affecting it. It's better to have an actual dialogue about something rather then to just shoot it down and ignore it, and considering the number of people who have and are dropping from the site, it's something that RPG needs for its own benefit.

yoshua said Oh, by the way, I tried Iwaku for a few weeks (didn't even have to leave the Guild, I was on both, imagine that) and I discovered something. Starting a new RP over there without first spending dedicated time to the IRC chat, basically means your RP will fail, nine times out of ten. The types of RPs, the variety, and some other core things that Guildgoers love, are simply not there.

I would imagine nine times out of ten trying to start an rp on any rping site, including this one, will result in failure. And with a number of Guildgoers having moved to the site, perhaps the types of RP and variety that populate this site will appear on there too. Idk.

I'm not a particularly active RPer. I tend to join RPs, make characters, write my posts, and talk in the OOC with the friends I make. I don't spend a ton of time talking in non-RP sections, and I don't really need much more than a text box to type in and people to write with.

Even before the Guildfall I liked RPGuild because it was fairly simple. There wasn't any crazy amount of tabs or groups. Everything was lined up in an easy to view manner. I haven't found any other place quite like it. I've looked around, and joined a few other sites, but they all seem so incredibly complex and convoluted that I just can't get into them.

Here's an example: http://i.gyazo.com/5fedfaaaa8ba6879f58275d876d5972c.png

If you click on that link,which is a homepage, you can see how much there is to look at, and none of that has to do with actual roleplaying.

I agree that Mahz needs to be around here more. It would be nice to see that he's working on the guild. There's a few things that could be fixed, like the white screen and BBcode, and there are plenty of things that could be added or improved, like extra tabs or self-moderation or what have you.

But I enjoy this site because it doesn't overwhelm me with things to do and sights to see. It's just good, clean, writing fun.

Instead of bitching about slowness and lack of people and leaving. It would be better to keep doing stuff on the board so that it's active both on site and as one of the top results for freeform on the googles.

As for Mahz and the lack of communication and site evolution? That's a fairly important issue that won't be resolved until mahz is forcibly dragged for some sort of discussion. Since it seems he wants to just shoulder the responsibility which while appearing very honorable and noble might be a bit too unpractical.

Yeah. Chicken may be a Jerk, but he is right. What makes a roleplay forum thrive is its community, and if anybody is to blame for RPG 'dying' (though that notion itself really is absurd), then it's first and foremost the roleplayers themselves. Mahz may have not restored the site to its former heights, but does that matter even half as much as the content WE create? Nah, IMHO. As long as we make roleplays which keep both veterans and newcomers hooked, the community will grow, regardless of the site's state.

I'm an RPer.

I need somewhere to type.

The Guild, though limited, does the job fine for me. My Rps don't need any flashing lights or super sized fonts. Nor does the community.

I understand a lot of peoples' aggro towards how things are going, but for myself, what I have here is more than enough for me to thrive. I looked at Iwaku, and I don't know, maybe I'm too old for this gig, but it mind f**ked me the moment I looked at it.

Unless people are telling me the lack of font sizes and styles are killing creativity and their passion to write, I see no problem with the Guild in its current form.

Still, I uphold everyone's right to have their opinion on matters.

Now excuse me whilst I tend to my flock with nowt but bold, italics and underlining.

ravenDivinity said
"Is RPG dying?" Well, I don't know. I don't really care if it is or not. I'm still enjoying it. Yeah, people are busy, but I'm still having fun roleplaying with what we have right now. It could be better, but I'm patient and I can wait for improvement whether it comes or not. Really though, it's a little stupid to have this debate over whether it's dying or not, since it's not something we can easily change on our own, and since opinions over whether it's dying or not are simply mere speculation. Even if numbers and experiences detail RPG's possible oncoming death or continuing growth, we don't actually know if it is dying or not.People have lives. People do things in real life. People have free will. We move, we change forums, we work, we go to school. Things are going on in the real world right now, and some people are busy and have left us permanently or temporarily, and some people have left to other places. This is normal. These things happen often in online communities, and it's expected. We won't know if it's dying until it's dead.Debating this topic so far has proven fruitless to solution, and the original poster is clearly baiting some argument and espousing some philosophy that Iwaku is somehow better than RPG and that RPG is dying. OP doesn't know if it's actually dying or not. People move. So what. Doesn't say anything. A lot of people from well-to-do countries migrate to the US. Their countries don't die. Whatever. Someone's probably gonna scrutinize this for whatever reason, but eh. I don't really care.This discussion was dead to start. Saw this post about a few hours ago, not surprised some sort of debate was incited. This person came here with the intent of sparking some move to Iwaku. It's like leaving your hometown and then returning and saying "wow does anybody give a fuck about this place anymore lol i mean honestly." Don't feed this person or fuel the fire. Carry on with business as usual and care less about this guy and his thread.'TL;DR: I don't care, nobody cares. Ignore this thread and let it die because this whole ordeal is leading nowhere and revealing nothing people aren't already aware of or can't figure out on their own.

This. Also, Guildfall? Is that what we're calling it now? Well alright then. And so we continue on.

TheWindel said
Also, Guildfall? Is that what we're calling it now? Well alright then. And so we continue on.

We've been calling it Guildfall since day one.

My only comment on this whole thing is to give Mahz a kick up the arse and try to finish the site before this slump turns into a user-induced coma.

*sigh* So... The guild is dying now? All communities have both influxes and departures of people or members. There are those who people consider cornerstones of those communities and when they begin to leave, people will freak out.

Do I think the guild is dying? Personally, I can't quite say. I'm a floater; I don't post here often enough or in enough locations on the guild for people to know me. Do I think the guild changed? It most certainly has. Should Mahz put more effort towards the guild? Who knows. Life is a thing that gets in the way of everything. If he can reach out to people and get the website better coded and maintained, it would be fantastic. As it stands, the guild suits me fine whenever I decide to show up.

Short answer? No. Long Answer? Nooooooooooooooo, But seriously, any site like this, wither it is a shinning tower or internet gold, or something passed though the four stomachs of a Web-Cow, rely on the people to keep it active. And as the community is right now, I would say no, it's nowhere near dead.

I would say its in a rutt but not dying,

I'll admit it's getting really annoying to post here anymore what with the whole blank screen, the lag etc..But I am a patient person and hope to see some changes.

I honestly don't see the problem. You think Iwaku is better. That's nice. Some people believe that the site is doing perfectly fine and all, which is also fine. I don't even have stats on it, and I honestly don't care. What if it is? Well, activity is dropping. Okay. That's cool. I really do not see the point of this discussion, except stirring up a fire. I am not going to write a long-ass post for this, since Prince summed up most of my arguments (Luckily I'm part of the community he absolutely hates. I love that guy. I can't decide what to think of him, really.). Anyhow, before I derail this thread or say something stupid;

my post guildfall avatar makes the fall worth it. *runs before the hate hits him*

KabenSaal said
Short answer? No. Long Answer? Nooooooooooooooo, But seriously, any site like this, wither it is a shinning tower or internet gold, or something passed though the four stomachs of a Web-Cow, rely on the people to keep it active. And as the community is right now, I would say no, it's nowhere near dead.

Nice ZP reference,

But in all seriousness, the fact this thread has gathered so much attention in the space of a day is something. And as far as I'm involved, the RP's I'm in take casualties and recruit new guys every couple of days. Yes, there is some decline, but I don't think we are dying out. We go through low points and high points all the time. It means nothing to have slowed down, what we should worry about is when no new members show up and we lose members on a regular basis.

You can RP on multiple sites, remember. I've never even heard of Iwaku until this here thread.

And I think ya'll are being a bit harsh on Mahz and the Guild in general. Yeah, we lost a few fonts and colours, but honestly, what's the problem? People end up making their writing illegible and it's just distracting to have one character speak in red Arial whilst his buddy speaks in blue Times New Roman. You might argue it makes it easier to tell which character is saying what, but a good RPer/writer should be able to make that distinction without the need to resort to cheap measures like adding colour to speech. When was the last time you read a book that used more than what QQcode offers? I haven't read any. And to me, QQ isn't really awkward or clunky or everything everyone else is saying. It doesn't bother me to put [i] or [b] around something - barely takes me any time. I don't mind it.

I understand the deletion issue, but hey, you shouldn't really be making a post you need to delete anyway. When you do need to delete something, replace it with -- or "Deleted" or something. It's not a problem.

Maybe I'm just barebones. But I personally don't see an issue with the guild thus far. Sure, it would benefit greatly from three or four updates, chief of which should be the removal of the WSoD (White Screen of Death/Doom). Everything beyond fixing that is trivial.

If you want to go to something because it let's you change the colour of your words, go right ahead. Personally, I prefer the community and simplistic feel of RP Guild.

I wasn't around for guildfall, but that doesn't matter. What matters most are the experiences i make here on this guild. And as long as i have those i will never leave. You can say this itaku is better, but none of my friends are on it, none of the rps or threads i post in are on it. You can say it's dead but i'm a stubborn bastard and i will stay as long as it takes.

I can say with confidence that RPG isn't going anywhere anytime soon. The community is staying strong, and while the site isn't perfect, what site is? Mahz is working hard to make sure this site doesn't go down, and if that means he can't be here every day to fix every little bug...well, at least we have this site. It's also the end-of-the-year time where there's always people getting ready for this or that holiday, so naturally members won't be online as often. But hey, they still come online, and they still come here. What more can we really ask?

Though I do think it would be beneficial to the activity of the community that mods get a bit more involved and social. Or, at the very least, round up some members that basically act as their PR crew. My other major forum has about a half-dozen mods (that I know of), and I swear I sometimes forget they're even mods to begin with.