<Snipped quote by Scarifar>

Wall is currently limited due to some issues with the ability to pay a decent chunk of life points for certain card requirements to be effective.

@Xeiyenreisha

I assume you mean level B. I was insulted because I assumed you knew how Limiter Remover is used in the damage step, and thus offering cards which cannot be activated during damage step to stop it (while knowing they actually cannot) is akin to calling me stupid.

And yes while I have stated card such as Magic Jammer will work, the issue is Magic Jammer negates the entire effect, meaning they will not be destroyed at EP, hence leaving you with a big beatstick still.

No, I was thinking of Wall of Revealing Light which is a Continuous Trap Card which tends to be a thorn in my side at times. Still any Machine monster affected by Limiter Removal is destroyed at the End Phase. I do not see how that is much of a problem. It's just an aggressive card which has a major weakness to it since it leaves you wide open if someone is able to prevent you from attacking.

I will say for the record I never was under the notion you were stupid or the impression. I have no idea where you even assessed that from nor do I care because I am not here to argue. I will say I do not like people thinking they can anticipate what I am thinking since you assumed incorrectly hence you should never jump to conclusions. All I can say is you should never base anything off assumptions or put words in my mouth, but let's just bury the hatchet. First assess the situation then ask if there was a misinterpretation. That way you could avoid situations like this as I want everything to end peacefully with no grudges held on either parties. The misunderstanding is cleared up now and I am done debating on it.

I will say that Negate Attack which is a Counter Trap card Seto Kaiba uses can wreck an over aggressive player who relies too much on powering up their Machine-Type monsters. I have fallen victim to this card time and time again.

<Snipped quote by The Grey Dust>

No, I was thinking of Wall of Revealing Light which is a Continuous Trap Card which tends to be a thorn in my side at times. Still any Machine monster affected by Limiter Removal is destroyed at the End Phase. I do not see how that is much of a problem. It's just an aggressive card which has a major weakness to it since it leaves you wide open if someone is able to prevent you from attacking.

I will say for the record I never was under the notion you were stupid or the impression. I have no idea where you even assessed that from nor do I care because I am not here to argue. I will say I do not like people thinking they can anticipate what I am thinking since you assumed incorrectly hence you should never jump to conclusions. All I can say is you should never base anything off assumptions or put words in my mouth, but let's just bury the hatchet. First assess the situation then ask if there was a misinterpretation. That way you could avoid situations like this as I want everything to end peacefully with no grudges held on either parties. The misunderstanding is cleared up now and I am done debating on it.

If I negate the effect of Limiter Removal with Magic Jammer, will all machines still be destroyed at EP?

Also the statement about Level B was in your reference to:

<Snipped quote by The Grey Dust>

My bad, I thought Level Limit Area A was a Trap Card.

Level Limit Area A is a continuous trap card. Level limit Area B is a continuous spell card. A switches 3 and lower to attack, B switches 4 and greater to defense.

I will say that Negate Attack which is a Counter Trap card Seto Kaiba uses can wreck an over aggressive player who relies too much on powering up their Machine-Type monsters. I have fallen victim to this card time and time again.

Negate attack cannot be used effectively against Limiter Remover, as it can only negate at the attack declaration, not at the damage step where one usually plays Limiter Remover. The only options are using cards like Lance, or cards which negate Limiter Remover, but by negating it, stop the destruction effect at EP.

First person posting is weird :<

<Snipped quote by Xeiyenreisha>

If I negate the effect of Limiter Removal with Magic Jammer, will all machines still be destroyed at EP?

Also the statement about Level B was in your reference to:

<Snipped quote by Xeiyenreisha>

Level Limit Area A is a continuous trap card. Level limit Area B is a continuous spell card. A switches 3 and lower to attack, B switches 4 and greater to defense.

<Snipped quote by Xeiyenreisha>

Negate attack cannot be used effectively against Limiter Remover, as it can only negate at the attack declaration, not at the damage step where one usually plays Limiter Remover. The only options are using cards like Lance, or cards which negate Limiter Remover, but by negating it, stop the destruction effect at EP.

Are you sure about that? Negate Attack is a Counter Trap which would give it a Speed of 3.

<Snipped quote by The Grey Dust>

No, I was thinking of Wall of Revealing Light which is a Continuous Trap Card which tends to be a thorn in my side at times. Still any Machine monster affected by Limiter Removal is destroyed at the End Phase. I do not see how that is much of a problem. It's just an aggressive card which has a major weakness to it since it leaves you wide open if someone is able to prevent you from attacking.

It's a huge problem because it can be an impossible to counter win at turn 2 that can be run off 3 cards.

Turn 1, they normal summon a monster with 1800 attack and end their turn.

Turn 2, you Special Summon Cyber Dragon, summon any card with at least 900 ATK, then you win after summoning Machine Limiter.

Normally, this wouldn't be a problem, but we are playing at 4000 LP.

I would actually vote for an errata of Machine Limiter. Something like "your opponent takes half damage from machine type monsters". Would let you clear big monsters with little ones but prevent stupid early OTKs.

<Snipped quote by Xeiyenreisha>

It's a huge problem because it can be an impossible to counter win at turn 2 that can be run off 3 cards.

Turn 1, they normal summon a monster with 1800 attack and end their turn.

Turn 2, you Special Summon Cyber Dragon, summon any card with at least 900 ATK, then you win after summoning Machine Limiter.

Normally, this wouldn't be a problem, but we are playing at 4000 LP.

I would actually vote for an errata of Machine Limiter. Something like "your opponent takes half damage from machine type monsters". Would let you clear big monsters with little ones but prevent stupid early OTKs.

Yeah but it leaves the other player screwed as they do not have any monsters to defend with if they only have Machine-Type monsters. Because at the End Phase all cards affected are destroyed.

If I recall correctly, GX started off with 8k LPs.

<Snipped quote by SilverDawn>

Yeah but it leaves the other player screwed as they do not have any monsters to defend with if they only have Machine-Type monsters. Because at the End Phase all cards affected are destroyed.

That's the point of Limiter Removal. You trade all of your defense for offensive power. Just having that much damage is crazy in 4000 LP.

If I recall correctly, GX started off with 8k LPs.

We use 4000 LP here, at least, right now.

<Snipped quote by The Grey Dust>

Are you sure about that? Negate Attack is a Counter Trap which would give it a Speed of 3.

Negate attack cannot be activated at damage step, even as a counter trap due to its timing. Let's break it down and get to the nitty-gritty to explain.

Negate Attack, Counter trap, effect:
When an opponent's monster declares an attack: Target the attacking monster; negate the attack, then end the Battle Phase

Assume we are currently in Opponent's Battle Phase. Battle Phase consists of 4 Steps, Start Step, Battle Step, Damage Step, End Step.

During Start step, certain effects can activate here, such as #107, which occur immediately at the beginning of the Battle Phase.

The attack declaration response window occurs at Battle Step, after the opponent declares their intent to attack at target with a selected monster they control.

Damage Step is the next step after Battle Step, where the attack declaration window closes, and the targets will proceed with battle. Only certain cards/effects can be used here, chiefly being spells/traps which directly modify ATK/DEF values and some monster effects which trigger during this step due to flipping or destruction, etc, and the counter trap cards. The Damage Step actually has substeps which break it down even more and for the sake of brevity, let's not get into the details of these steps because it gets tricky and is probably the hardest thing to understand in YGO after chains and effect timing.

End Step follows after, similar to Start Step, certain effects can activate here, and ends the BP.

So, Negate attack can only be triggered properly at Battle Step. However, Limiter Remover can be used during Damage Step. Hence, if you do not know your opponent has Limiter Remover, and will take a 2k hit for the sake of saving Negate attack for the next turn when they summon something bigger, it will be game since they will drop limiter remover during the damage step, after the attack declaration response window is closed and the battle/direct attack is committed.

<Snipped quote by Xeiyenreisha>

That's the point of Limiter Removal. You trade all of your defense for offensive power. Just having that much damage is crazy in 4000 LP.

<Snipped quote by Xeiyenreisha>

We use 4000 LP here, at least, right now.

There has to be a more logical way that satisfies both sides, because I won't use trump cards that lose their edge.

<Snipped quote by SilverDawn>

Yeah but it leaves the other player screwed as they do not have any monsters to defend with if they only have Machine-Type monsters. Because at the End Phase all cards affected are destroyed.

Okay, your monsters are destroyed at EP.
Your attack lowers your opponent's life points to Zero.
The Game is over.
There is no EP due to game over.

If your opponent Negates the Limiter Remover effect during the Damage Step, assuming the monster still has quite enough attack power to barrel through the target, or in the case of direct attack, opponent's life points, your Machines stay around at EP due to LR being negated.

I guess you could always use Book of Moon to get around your monster being destroyed but that is always a waste of Quickplay Spell. Not to mention I hate that Quickplay Spell when it is used on me.

You can also XYZ or fusion summon a new monster using the to be destroyed monster. Perhaps even Synchro.

The reason I hate Book of Moon so much is people use Nobleman of Crossout after they use it which is a major problem because it's an easy way to get rid of a powerful monster.

i want to know if mintywater was accepted or not... his CS just came out of nowhere and consider he has been on the RPG for exactly 0 days

second his IC post is incorrect as the placement duels were NOT over (and just a single line)

and his IC post shouldnt be there the first place

is he accepted...? im so confused?

The reason I hate Book of Moon so much is people use Nobleman of Crossout after they use it which is a major problem because it's an easy way to get rid of a powerful monster.

Crossout is hardly used in current Meta. Book of Moon is really useful to stop non-quick-effects during summons, stop synchros, and xyzs, also stops some contact fusions, along side its attack stopping abilities. It also can reset flip effects which is a bonus as it was originally intended to I believe.

The reason I hate Book of Moon so much is people use Nobleman of Crossout after they use it which is a major problem because it's an easy way to get rid of a powerful monster.

That's a 2 card combo getting rid of 1 monster. You only need one counter card to stop it. Unless it's a deck that can draw back cards to hand, they'll have 2 less cards in their hand, leading to less options.

<Snipped quote by Xeiyenreisha>

Crossout is hardly used in current Meta. Book of Moon is really useful to stop non-quick-effects during summons, stop synchros, and xyzs, also stops some contact fusions, along side its attack stopping abilities. It also can reset flip effects which is a bonus as it was originally intended to I believe.

I remember when people used that to recycle Morphing Jar's effect with. They also used it to recycle Magician of Faith which can be used to retrieve it or Limiter Removal. There is also a Spell Card that can be used to retrieve those cards with which I forgot the name of.

<Snipped quote by The Grey Dust>

I remember when people used that to recycle Morphing Jar's effect with. They also used it to recycle Magician of Faith which can be used to retrieve it or Limiter Removal. There is also a Spell Card that can be used to retrieve those cards with which I forgot the name of.

Morphing Jar is currently banned, Faith is back in use, however I'm not sure how much play she sees.

Most of the "Jar" cards are actually banned due to their OP abilities. Cyber Jar (my DN username, and also my favourite card ever.) because of the "free" +5 and nuke it gives. Morphing Jar due to Empty Jar OTK as well as a "free" +5 it can give. Morphing Jar#2 because of extra deck stuff and Morphing Jar#2 Burn OTK. Fiber Jar because of Recycling and again a "Free" +5