[OOC] Bleach: Endless Abyss (Open)

[ProPro]

@yoshua171Where is your character?

There is no reason someone from Squad Eleven has to be a neanderthal.

@KillBox

Right? Yumichika is as sophisticated (and vain) as they come... If a little crude.

[Zobozun]

@yoshua171 GM says we're not supposed to have memories of life before entering Soul Society, remember? On top of that you've got internal inconsistency all over the place, like where you state "His skill with hoho was also essentially nonexistent", but then list him as being an expert in it. You also try to justify it by saying things have taken him "a long time" despite it being only 15 years after he left the academy, which is practically nothing in terms of Bleach timescales. On top of that, all the skills your character is "bad" in more or less explicitly state that he's not actually bad in them and is fully capable of keeping up with masters anyway. Generally, this is considered to be in poor taste.

On top of that, you just arbitrarily state he's Kenpachi-super-prodigy-level despite there already being a generational prodigy (Shota) in the game. Stick with one thing and let other people have their own gimmicks. Scrambling to cover all the bases like this is unfair to your fellow players.

As a side note, you may want to read your fellow character's sheets carefully. Especially Mary's history section. I assumed you had read it, since you tried to start a fight over it, but I guess you didn't. That's pretty poor form as well. You should probably be more considerate to the people you're sharing this game with.

[Oblivion666]

@yoshua171 You get my odd character as a member with just dat line

[Infinite Cosmos]

@ProProI mean. Yeah. Vain only in his perception of his outer appearance. I think he judges himself fairly in terms of abilities.

[yoshua171]

yoshua171, the GM says we're not supposed to have memories of life before entering Soul Society, remember? On top of that you've got internal inconsistency all over the place, like where you state "His skill with hoho was also essentially nonexistent", but then list him as being an expert in it. You also try to justify it by saying things have taken him "a long time" despite it being only 15 years after he left the academy, which is practically nothing in terms of Bleach timescales. On top of that, all the skills your character is "bad" in more or less explicitly state that he's not actually bad in them and is fully capable of keeping up with masters anyway. Generally, this is considered to be in poor taste.

On top of that, you just arbitrarily state he's Kenpachi-super-prodigy-level despite there already being a generational prodigy (Shota) in the game. Stick with one thing and let other people have their own gimmicks. Scrambling to cover all the bases like this is unfair to your fellow players.

As a side note, you may want to read your fellow character's sheets carefully. Especially Mary's history section. I assumed you had read it, since you tried to start a fight over it, but I guess you didn't. That's pretty poor form as well. You should probably be more considerate to the people you're sharing this game with.

@Zobozun

There are exceptions to the memories thing and the GM also implied they'd work on a case by case basis, not to mention that it was alright if most of those memories faded, which I implied they had. Majime is not very old, as far as shinigami go, so he's not completely forgotten his human life. However, he has forgotten most of it. Still, it is a core part of what made him who he is, so I included it in his history. This is not something I intend to do for my captain.

The justification of his rank is his skill in one area in particular, that area being kido. As to his "hoho," saying expert, that's because people forget that hoho isn't just about speed, it's about footwork. Shunpo the most common technique derived from hoho, and falls into that category. Majime can't "keep up," with people faster than him in that he can't follow after them at the same speed, or even something bordering that speed. He can however track their movement, because you don't have to be fast to be observant.

The bit in his zanjutsu states he has observed techniques, so he knows what to look for. Does this mean he can use any of these techniques, no, it does not. In fact, his zanpakuto (when sealed) is virtually useless to him. Every so often we might see him block an attack and be overpowered by someone else's superior strength, getting driven back.

His hakuda is pretty much totally and completely useless aside from any basic knowledge that any schmuck could pick up. Meaning that he knows what a block, a kick and a punch ought to look like and how to preform mundane forms of those. Nothing fancy or even vaguely trained at all. More complicated or skillfully executed hakuda techniques are likely to give him a lot of trouble if he lets you/you manage to get close enough to use them.

Majime has sacrificed skill in essentially every category aside from kido to be as good as he is at it. He has a talent for it and he has also voraciously studied, both on his own and under anyone who was willing to teach him anything, even if it required they teach him in fights where he was sure to lose.

Majime's not so much a prodigy as he is someone who consumed as much as he possibly could in regards to kido as fast as he possibly could, ignoring practically everything else in the process, so he could get where he is.

If you put it in the context of a highschool's test scores.

You have one person who's naturally good at what they do, without studying or reviewing notes. They retain information intuitively and can recall it and apply it with intuitive ease. They are a prodigy or a genius.

Then you have someone, through sheer determination, hard work, and force of will tops the test score list by constantly studying, reviewing, and challenging themselves.

Majime falls into the second category.

I do admit I did not read Mary's history, though I'm...not really sure what that has to do with this. I've been very focused on my own character sheet since my captain has been giving me trouble. Also, I'm not the one who debated Mary's history. That was Riddle.

Also I never stated he was some "Kenpachi level prodigy," or something. That would imply that he was a captain level combatant, which he isn't. Not sure where you got that tbh.

Also not sure what I've really done to provoke this.

I will however go back through his CS and make sure I kept everything consistent even though I'm fairly sure I did.

---

<Snipped quote by KillBox>
Right? Yumichika is as sophisticated (and vain) as they come... If a little crude.

@ProPro

True hehe.

@yoshua171 You get my odd character as a member with just dat line

@Oblivion666

Oh? 0.0

@yoshua171Where is your character?

There is no reason someone from Squad Eleven has to be a neanderthal.

@KillBox

My captain is currently a WIP in a secret location. Majime is a few pages ago. Maybe one? Not sure lol, I'm a bit preoccupied atm. Majime tis here.

[Zobozun]

@yoshua171
Kenpachi-level-prodigy refers to the parts labeled "Legendary Reiryoku" and "Incredible Reiatsu".

As far as the prodigy bit goes, I'm not the one you need to be justifying it to. Brink is the one playing the one-in-a-million unique generational prodigy with incredible reiryoku levels. That's his thing. That is, in fact, his main thing and you are taking that away from him. That's not fair to Brink.

Likewise, your character having his past intact is stepping on Hantu Kongtek's toes and conflicting with the GM's statement that souls lose their memories upon death. You should be taking it up with them. I'm just calling it to people's attention so it doesn't get missed becuase it'll just cause more problems down the line that way.

Also, you shouldn't start fights over something you hear secondhand from another player. Don't just go off what others say. If you want to know what you did to provoke this, maybe you can go back a few pages to the part where you tried to get me kicked from the game and accused me of trolling with no evidence. Amazingly, people don't like that.

As for the learning Kido, to continue your metaphor, I wasn't aware that studying also made you an immensely talented genius who could make up physics equations on the fly and have them work. Becuase that's what your character does. You stated that he can, paraphrased, "Bend Kido to his whims". Last I checked, that wasn't how things worked in Bleach, since even massively-talented big-dick Kido users like Urahara and Tessai needed time to develop new seals. Additionally, it doesn't matter if Hoho isn't about speed. You stated that your character was bad at Hoho, which conflicts with you listing him as an expert in Hoho. If you only want him to be bad at Shunpo, then say he's bad at Shunpo. It's that simple.

[Oblivion666]

@yoshua171Yes. She sounds sarcastic and it will be amazing!

[Oblivion666]

Guys take it to Pms please if you have a dispute.

[Sodium]

Guys take it to Pms please if you have a dispute.

@Oblivion666

What point is there in having a roleplay OOC if every time serious discussion of characters comes up it's considered a "dispute" and someone requests it be moved into private? Especially since the other 19 pages are so filled with roleplay-centric discussion (is my sarcasm thick enough?).

[Ganryu]

<Snipped quote by Oblivion666>

What point is there in having a roleplay OOC if every time serious discussion of characters comes up it's considered a "dispute" and someone requests it be moved into private? Especially since the other 19 pages are so filled with roleplay-centric discussion (is my sarcasm thick enough?).

@Sodium

Cause drama doesn't solve anything, just pisses little ol' people like me off.

The skype chat's reduced the spam, one has to say.

[Celaira]

@Sodium it becomes a dispute when someone is using it as a personal attack. That is what's happening in this case.

Edit: Hi Gan :3

[Axel]

@Zobozun@yoshua171

Also, include me or one of the other gms as well so we can help resolve it.

@Sodium Even though the OOC is filled with classic small talk, allowing a minor dispute to possibly escalate into a heated argument is foolish since it'll disrupt the atmosphere of things. Remember we're here to have fun and to escape our real world struggles, so anything of this nature should be resolved somewhere else rather than having it here in which it could possibly affect someone else's day unnecessarily.

[Zero Hex]

I gotta side with Zobozun here. @yoshua171's character seems to step on people's toes by broadly trying to cover everything. If the GM shuts down a second character who remembers his life because the first one is an exception, the third should also logically be denied. The amazing prodigy thing also does step on the toes of Brink's character, in that he specifically asked to fulfill that role. It's not huge, but you probably don't need to be born ridiculously powerful to justify being a terrific sorcerer.

Your character also directly steps on Zobozun's toes, in that his accepted story defined that the last kido chief died and was replaced 100 years ago. His character, at the time the vice-chief, quit 10 years after that and named a successor. Your story sounds like there was no vice-chief for about 90 years until your character took the spot, which seems silly.

Moving on to your character's abilities and the perception thereof, your own explanation of your character's hoho more or less says he shouldn't be ranked as an expert, since he's not using shunpo to keep up, he's using an unrelated asset of his.

You'd be surprised at how little an average schmuck can pick up about hand to hand fighting without specialized training and guidance over a good period of time. Punches and blocks are seriously not that simple or else boxing wouldn't be called a science, and kicking is such a can of worms that people paid to fight well can still botch them and wind up on their ass, trying to apply them in a fight without serious training is pretty dangerous.

Also, if your sword is essentially useless your character shouldn't probably be listed as a proficient swordfighter. Again, studying and "picking up moves" without even trying just makes your character seem like he could just start training that and suddenly be real good at it. After all, he's proficient without even trying.

Finally, being able to make up new spells on the spot feels like an ability that is essentially godmodding. You can just create a new spell to fit whatever situation you find yourself in, as their application is incredibly wide. This is essentially what Gremmy Thomeaux did, and he had to be topped by a Kenpachi that had achieved shikai. You know, the guy that can fight on par with high level captain bankai without even knowing his sword's name. Hardly a fair standard to hold everyone to.

[Oblivion666]

<Snipped quote by Oblivion666>

What point is there in having a roleplay OOC if every time serious discussion of characters comes up it's considered a "dispute" and someone requests it be moved into private? Especially since the other 19 pages are so filled with roleplay-centric discussion (is my sarcasm thick enough?).

@Sodium

Cause debates are one thing. Calling someone out for something said earlier isn't really a debate in that case. Thanks for the input though.

[yoshua171]

I will address anything that may, or may not, be an issue with the players in question as well as the GMs.

Beyond that I would like to express that my character is good at one thing, and one thing only. I admit that the "bad at hoho," in the description was an oversight I missed while I was modifying the CS for this RP.

I'd also like to note that Majime's skills are practically rendered useless if you close the distance and fight a melee with him. He can only defend and attack with kido. I mean he might try to stab you if there's an opening, but anyone with enough strength to pick up a sword can do that. He might slash, but probably not. His sword is a gateway to his shikai and not much else.

Also I'm talking about rudimentary straightforwards knowledge in regards to hakuda/zanjutsu. Not anything you'd need to train in. The meaning is partially lost because the RP he was in previously had a relatively a stat system of sorts. A 0 in a given state was "baseline soul," more or less. He has a 0 in zanjutsu and hakuda. Meaning he can't do anything your average thug couldn't do. He has seen people who are good at hakuda fight, so he knows how to get out of the way of some simpler shit or use kido shields to block. Same with zanjutsu. Still, if someone is close enough to be stabbing, slashing, punching, kicking, or trying to get him into a hold he is pretty much automatically at a huge disadvantage. I know because I've had him fight several people previous to this, one of Ganryu's characters being included in that list.

If you get close, he is going to be unable to defend after a certain point if he can't make distance between him and his opponent. Him having a lot of reiatsu/reiryoku is literally just so he can actually use kido consistently because it's the only weapon he has that is actually useful to him.

I hadn't read Zobuzun's CS en full, as I stated in my previous post so my apologies for lacking knowledge on that bit. Although, it does strike me as odd that things are set up in such a way that Mother Mary, aka Zobozun basically has to give permission to a player to make the Vice Chief for the kido corps due to his character's history.

I also, by the way, stated in my previous post that almost everything that Majime remembers is faded. Meaning he can't actually remember the majority of it.

The details he remembers are as follows:

He has a vague impression that he didn't have a lot of friends. He vaguely remembers that his body was ill, because he appreciates the body he has now, which is more or less renewed.

Aaaand that's about it. Had to go back and check his history to make sure I had that right.

That's a tiny amount of information and none of it is even clear. If it steps on the toes of Hantu, then so be it. Till they explicitly say as such or the GMs tell me to change it Ima leave it.

As to this:

Finally, being able to make up new spells on the spot feels like an ability that is essentially godmodding. You can just create a new spell to fit whatever situation you find yourself in, as their application is incredibly wide. This is essentially what Gremmy Thomeaux did, and he had to be topped by a Kenpachi that had achieved shikai. You know, the guy that can fight on par with high level captain bankai without even knowing his sword's name. Hardly a fair standard to hold everyone to.

@Zero Hex

I'm aware of the problems and conflicts associated with that. I did say the spells tend to be unstable when created like that. The ability is more for mixing and matching already existing spells as well as any of his custom kido.

As for spells he may create, well I'd run them by the GMs and the people I would be fighting at the time to make sure it would be alright with them first, because I'm a reasonable, fairly rational guy who would much prefer a fair fight/interaction than a wholly one-sided one(provided the one-sided fight had no real purpose).

Anywho. I would rather not contribute to any dispute, so I'm really trying not to respond to any negativity being thrown my way, in favor of resolving any potential issues with the players who possess the characters that have the conflicts in question, and the GMs, as mentioned at the top of this post.

So yeah. Things. Stuff. Woo....

[Sodium]

@Ganryu @Celaira
I don't see a personal attack here. What I see is a serious discussion, and a group of unrelated people blowing it out of proportion in order to save their silly conversation space. I could just as easily ask the silly one-line-that-doesn't-really-contribute-anything-to-the-discussion posters to keep those to PMs and have just as much, if not more, grounds for the request.

@Axel
An intellectual discussion of characters can serve to improve both those involved and those who witness it. This site seems to always expect the worst outcome from a discussion where two parties disagree. I have one question:

Why?

Nothing good can come from shying away from chances for growth. Discussion and the exchange of ideas is the easiest way to grow intellectually. If discourse is discouraged, the only outcome is stagnation. I've seen faaaaaaaaaar too many games die out simply because nobody could bear to say something that another disagreed with, which led to everyone internalizing their disagreements and eventually just leaving because the joy of the game was gone.

Telling people to carry out discussions privately essentially tells them their discussion isn't wanted. It does more damage than you'd expect, as there's an implied "your discussion isn't important enough to hold where everyone can see it" message, and even if those involved don't realize it, the message gets across. In this case it's especially bad, as now a co-GM is telling players that a discussion that SHOULD be important to the GMs should not be handled in a place visible to the GMs.

Anyway, I have my character finished. I'll post it when I decide whether I'm joining or not.

[KabenSaal]

Boobs. That is all.

[Celaira]

@Sodium I will direct you to this specific portion of Zobozun's post. This was a personal attack:

Also, you shouldn't start fights over something you hear secondhand from another player. Don't just go off what others say. If you want to know what you did to provoke this, maybe you can go back a few pages to the part where you tried to get me kicked from the game and accused me of trolling with no evidence. Amazingly, people don't like that.

Zobozun

*quietly leaves the OOC and apologizes to those whom she may have caused distress*

[Sodium]

@Celaira
That does not make it a personal attack. It merely provides a personal reason for the extra scrutiny. In fact, Zobozun is describing a personal attack that Yoshua performed against him.

[yoshua171]

@Celaira
That does not make it a personal attack. It merely provides a personal reason for the extra scrutiny. In fact, Zobozun is describing a personal attack that Yoshua performed against him.

@Sodium

Which I expressed that I was wrong and implied that I didn't mean any offense when I said it. I mean, we can keep thinking that that didn't happen though.