United States Government can pretend to be you.

[code gary]

Dipper said
Not surprised that you'd say something like that, CG. Don't Ad Hominem. The thread is supposed to be talking about how the US Government is Impersonating people, and yes, while it got derailed, the only person being toxic here is -you-."HUR DURR CODE GURU IS A LIBERAL SHEEP WHO THINKS CONSERVATIVES WHO THINK THE GOVERNMENT DOING ILLEGAL THINGS IS WRONG ARE ALL RACIST, AND SHE THINKS THAT BECAUSE OBAMA IS BLACK ANYONE WHO DISAGREES WITH HIM IS A TOXIC RACIST SCUM DURR HUR" Look, I can do it too. Doesn't improve the thread, doesn't add anything. Don't do it.

you shouldnt be surprised, since if youre going to mark that down so seriously ill be ready to hound down all the other fallacies you knowingly commit. this isnt debate team or some facilitated academic discussion, theres something that doesnt let internet arguements get to that point, but i think you dont want to realize that at the risk of getting your feelings hurt

Vortex said
Wait... What...? How does this... I dont even...You haven't been around in OT for long or at least haven't seen my posts anyway. Mate, Im a Socialist for gods sake, in fact I'm a goddam Marxist and think Conservativism is something we have to get rid off ASAP. I suggest you look at my "Political Ideologies" thread (its in page 7) and better yet stop assuming you know my, or anyone else's Politics after reading a few posts.While I don't take any offence to it, I have to agree that Ad Hominems are pointless and just detracts from the good nitty gritty political arguments that we find ourselves yelling at each other over.

i thought this was someone else because of the unicorn avatar, but you should calm down

[Vortex]

code gary said
you shouldnt be surprised, since if youre going to mark that down so seriously ill be ready to hound down all the other fallacies you knowingly commit. this isnt debate team or some facilitated academic discussion, theres something that doesnt let internet arguements get to that point, but i think you dont want to realize that at the risk of getting your feelings hurt

While this is not the most academic of places to have political discussions, I think you would be suprised

code gary said
i thought this was someone else because of the unicorn avatar, but you should calm down

I am calm. I just don't like it much when people assume things about other people (me)

[mdk]

annnnnd we're arguing about how we're arguing about how we're arguing (it's CG's fault). This is what gets OT threads shut down -- not bringing up politics, but being insensible about it.

[Foster]

The Nexerus said
^ Blackwater and Titan Corporation no longer exist. When they did exist they were private security contractors that operated solely on the license of the United States federal government, primarily in an assistance role in Bush's war in Iraq. Businesses, even security contractors, are more accountable to the public than any government, and hundreds of thousands of times less powerful.

Still exists, just as a different name, like Academi.

[Vortex]

mdk said
annnnnd we're arguing about how we're arguing about how we're arguing (it's CG's fault). is what gets OT threads shut down -- not bringing up politics, but being insensible about it.

Although this has greatly derailed from the original topic, nobody here is flaming and therefore no reason to shut this down.

[mdk]

Vortex said
Although this has greatly derailed from the original topic, nobody here is flaming and therefore no reason to shut this down.

Give it a minute....

[Dipper]

code gary said
you shouldnt be surprised, since if youre going to mark that down so seriously ill be ready to hound down all the other fallacies you knowingly commit. this isnt debate team or some facilitated academic discussion, theres something that doesnt let internet arguements get to that point, but i think you dont want to realize that at the risk of getting your feelings hurt

Why don't you head back over to spam where you can relive the glory days of when you thought you were the coolest person on the guild - If I remember Spam's history of Cool correctly. Acting like you are acting now is what got you Perma'd on the Old Guild.

[Gwazi Magnum]

code gary said you shouldnt be surprised, since if youre going to mark that down so seriously ill be ready to hound down all the other fallacies you knowingly commit. this isnt debate team or some facilitated academic discussion, theres something that doesnt let internet arguements get to that point, but i think you dont want to realize that at the risk of getting your feelings hurt i thought this was someone else because of the unicorn avatar, but you should calm down

Just because you're discounting people's entire arguments simply because of the tool being used to communicate (a tool you willingly agreed to use, and a debate you willingly chose to join) doesn't mean serious and intelligent conversation can't happen in it. It just means that you are not capable of taking part in them when in such a medium.

Dipper said Why don't you head back over to spam where you can relive the glory days of when you thought you were the coolest person on the guild - If I remember Spam's history of Cool correctly. Acting like you are acting now is what got you Perma'd on the Old Guild.

Sadly it's "Fuck you I'm the Alpha Dog" behaviour that has gained some people of spam the popularity it has. :/
It occasionally creates people who think the same kind of behaviour is acceptable in OT.

[Rtron]

Magic said If someone see's issues with the voting system, they would in at least some sense be hypocritical by voting

While true, ASTA has a problem with the government at large. And rather than using the legal tool she(?) has, she instead complains about it. My argument isn't 'fix the voting system by voting!' My argument is 'don't just complain about it and leave it at that. Try and do something about it!' And it may fail, because majority rules, but it's better than going 'this sucks. Something needs to be done.' And then just doing nothing.

mdk said
Currently true. In a primal USA, the early constitution set it up so that you voted for your local reps, and *they* picked your senators. That was changed in the 17th amendment. Which is a mistake

Wait, your going to have to explain this to me. How is choosing one better than being able to choose both?

[mdk]

Rtron said How is choosing one better than being able to choose both?

It's probably not. But federal voting leads the focus away from local politics. I'm thinking that if your federal voice was the same as your local voice, then you'd use your local voice more (which is fitting, because local elections take place much more often than federal ones), leading to a more involved and better-represented populace (and better governance on local levels, too), while generally de-centralizing the power structure.

edit: clarity

[So Boerd]

So Boerd said
All well and good until the men with guns from the IRS show up on my doorstep.

Missed.

[Gwazi Magnum]

Rtron said While true, ASTA has a problem with the government at large. And rather than using the legal tool she(?) has, she instead complains about it. My argument isn't 'fix the voting system by voting!' My argument is 'don't just complain about it and leave it at that. Try and do something about it!' And it may fail, because majority rules, but it's better than going 'this sucks. Something needs to be done.' And then just doing nothing.

Except you're judging the fact on her doing nothing and just complaining strictly on the fact she doesn't vote.
So if you aren't saying "Fix voting by voting" don't assume people are doing nothing simply because they don't vote.
Cause otherwise, that is what you're saying.

[I am the Black Wizards]

I'm going to have to agree with the conservative stance on this one.