[OOC] Arena Chat Thread

[GreivousKhan]

Rilla is missing his waifu.

[Rilla]

Disappointing me by not killing Khan on a regular basis. Haha.

[ImportantNobody]

Most of the skill in war would come from using terrain to your advantage. It's only unfair if they spawn you closer to vital landmarks, but good maps can have plenty of hills and trees scattered around as long as one group isn't better and starting closer.

"Omg! Hax! No placing archers on hills! Arrrggghhhh!"

[MelonHead]

Most of the skill in war would come from using terrain to your advantage. It's only unfair if they spawn you closer to vital landmarks, but good maps can have plenty of hills and trees scattered around as long as one group isn't better and starting closer.

"Omg! Hax! No placing archers on hills! Arrrggghhhh!"

@ImportantNobody

That would only work if you had miles upon miles of terrain in which to maneuver around to get the best advantage. When given a standardized map nature is never symmetrical, therefore never fair.

[LeeRoy]

Yeah, one little Goat Pass and your 300 soldiers fending off 10,000 troops are suddenly swamped.

[ImportantNobody]

<Snipped quote by ImportantNobody>

That would only work if you had miles upon miles of terrain in which to maneuver around to get the best advantage. When given a standardized map nature is never symmetrical, therefore never fair.

@MelonHead

It could be completely symmetrical, although that would be boring (no more boring than flat land all the way through, though). Skill would be able to offset any minor terrain variations on a map. I could position myself and a hill and get devestated by a skilled opponent.

Personally, the best option for me would do multiple different matches with slight terrain variations each time and the more skilled player would still reveal themselves over time as they win more.

[Rilla]

The thing is, those are perfectly fine maps. They aren't said issue.

The issue comes when you actively have to fight with the Arena, instead of just the opponent. Like the Tilting Building, where you are less fighting the opponent and more dealing with the arena.

The boring ones are perfect for ranked fights, as they focus on skill. The things in them are fine, like kicking dirt or tossing sand. Not trees that randomly swing out and try hit you for coming to close, or a building that forces you run down its side.

[GreivousKhan]

The thing is, those are perfectly fine maps. They aren't said issue.

The issue comes when you actively have to fight with the Arena, instead of just the opponent. Like the Tilting Building, where you are less fighting the opponent and more dealing with the arena.

The boring ones are perfect for ranked fights, as they focus on skill. The things in them are fine, like kicking dirt or tossing sand. Not trees that randomly swing out and try hit you for coming to close, or a building that forces you run down its side.

@Rilla

Hmm, I had no idea Terminal was making those kinds of arenas.

[Rilla]

<Snipped quote by Rilla>

Hmm, I had no idea Terminal was making those kinds of arenas.

@GreivousKhan

I don't either. Honestly have no idea what type hes making, as I said before. I just brought it up because there were talks of new battlegrounds and stuff, and at varying points people have suggested more... 'special' arenas, and well.. battle types as well.

[ImportantNobody]

Trees slapping you is fair if your character has warning going into it, such as the trees taunting and leering at you. In that case it's up to skill to avoid them.them throwing apples at you would be a slightly different story because you'd have to constantly pay attention to them all, but melee attacks see fine to me.

[Skallagrim]

The Arena is a contest between two writers engaging in a form of mental chess. Inserting an X-factor, such as a dynamic battlefield that requires the fighters to fight that as well and which ultimately can result in a loss because of those dynamics, becomes a hindrance. The field should never be such a dominate factor in an arena fight that it can cause a loss.

[ImportantNobody]

The Arena is a contest between two writers engaging in a form of mental chess. Inserting an X-factor, such as a dynamic battlefield that requires the fighters to fight that as well and which ultimately can result in a loss because of those dynamics, becomes a hindrance. The field should never be such a dominate factor in an arena fight that it can cause a loss.

@Skallagrim

I severely disagree, but we can just fight in the battles we feel comfortable with. No point in forcing you to fight in dynamic locations.

[GreivousKhan]

The Arena is a contest between two writers engaging in a form of mental chess. Inserting an X-factor, such as a dynamic battlefield that requires the fighters to fight that as well and which ultimately can result in a loss because of those dynamics, becomes a hindrance. The field should never be such a dominate factor in an arena fight that it can cause a loss.

@Skallagrim

I don't think fighting atop a train would be that intense....

As you guys are making it out to be...

[Skallagrim]

<Snipped quote by Skallagrim>

I severely disagree, but we can just fight in the battles we feel comfortable with. No point in forcing you to fight in dynamic locations.

@ImportantNobody

Clearly you don't disagree since you stated that apples being thrown by trees is different that an occasional haphazard melee attack. We are not talking about being slapped by a tree or something along those lines, we are talking about the disruptive influences having an impact on the fight.

[ImportantNobody]

<Snipped quote by ImportantNobody>

Clearly you don't disagree since you stated that apples being thrown by trees is different that an occasional haphazard melee attack. We are not talking about being slapped by a tree or something along those lines, we are talking about the disruptive influences having an impact on the fight.

@Skallagrim

I guess Rilla is the one taking it further. It seemed like you'd also be against environments being much of a factor at all, which would include things like trees that attack. Stuff like that would be based on player skill and strategy to manipulating your opponent into getting attacked by the environment. This is entirely different than an environment that spawns meteors to target people's faces or something, which doesn't involve player skill to get their opponent hit and truly would be the environment attacking you like an npc. I'd be fine with an occasional battle in such an environment but certainly not tournaments.

[Terminal]

Well, since there's a certain amount of (not unwarranted) pushback to the usage of certain kinds of arenas - and admitting that, as @Melonhead said, I do not have any prior experience with Arena practices - it may be best if I postpone releasing my set and getting somebody to look over them and help me make revisions where necessary.

I might have posted them anyway, even if they weren't necessarily suited to tournament use and would have not been used often - but the fact of the matter is I actually want people to use these arenas. I'm not making them for the sake of filling space. I also don't want them seen as too gimmicky or encroaching to the point that people don't want to use them for tournament matches.

Everyone's commentary on the matter over the past few days has been very helpful. If anybody would be willing to review these arenas in advance and make suggestions and provide their thoughts on the matter, shoot me a PM.

[Dymion]

I for one enjoy the thought of an arena that provides a constructive area for characters to utilize, as I feel it it more realistic to the circumstances of combat, tests the ingenuity of role players, and provides for more interesting battles

[Skallagrim]

Constructive is not the issue, having to fight the arena as well as an opponent is. It is hard enough to fight a skilled duelist, add an arena that acts as another combatant and things become extremely difficult. Arenas should never become more active than the fighters, and fighters should never worry that they will lose because an arena's action supercedes their opponents.

[ManiacMaestro]

Hey,what would you think of a battle between airships with a group of five members on each.

[Impaqt]

Hey,what would you think of a battle between airships with a group of five members on each.

@ManiacMaestro

Long.