<Snipped quote by HaleyTheRandom>

It's a surreal ending, but at least we are done with it.

True.

I just.. ugh.

Because today is one of my few and far between days to speak freely, I will just speak my mind about this entire ordeal and people's reaction to it. Nothing new, just my opportunity to use this topic for something.

Enough with the petty fearmongering and how this is some how another end of the world. We have had far worse and more destructive, ideologically at least, persons in power in places that were far more unrestricted. If anything this turning point should be an indicator of how the pendulum swings; you lean too far to one extreme, it becomes imbalanced, people become reactive and eventually they become active. Your two reason options, for those directly involved in the voting process, could be narrowed down to the classical argument of "Which is the lesser of two evils?" at its worst and at its best evidence of the ability to overcome a system that was being consistently rigged from the start. From a personal standpoint, the fact I saw so much enthusiasm and patriotism for the first time in my life since the acts of terror on the 11th of September; it is proof enough to me that a lot more people felt more strongly than ever; some of us have paid great prices since then and to see people that passionate and devoted reminded me why I even made some sacrifices.

A fair number of people are acting like they need to "band together" against this as some sort of statement. You know a statement I do not like and am really tired of? "Civil unrest" and "civil disobedience". If all the evidence you have seen fronted throughout this past year and beyond have not helped rouse you out of whatever stupor the modern world has put most of us in and constantly lulls us to, there's really nothing that can be said or done to change your mind. I will, for the record, not lie and say either of the two options were perfect, but I personally find direct threats to national security and laughable cybersecurity a larger issue than any number of others, but maybe that is only of my opinion.

If you are serious about the "going to Canada" or "going to wherever" mentality, get out. No, I am entirely serious. If you really do not like your circumstances be them your day to day life or the politics of your nation, go somewhere else. If you can't do that? Work toward it and then act. Make a plan, do something, otherwise you are just being dramatic for the sake of looking for attention. Granted you are getting it, but that's pretty loathsome and low. Do you really want to be viewed in that lens?

To the rest of the world abroad not directly involved in the politics of the United States, while I understand your concerns and your investment in it all, it really is not your battle. Just because "it works this way in my country" does not make it applicable to the United States by direct virtue and vice versa. The feigned and even actual panic, as with the markets, is nothing short of proof of how broken the international community has become; the priorities as a whole are so out of whack that I doubt anyone will ever successfully wrangle them back in. The United States is a strange animal and has almost always been that way since it gained momentum and probably will be until it eventually dies out as all superpowers do.

Here's what I have to say about the election:

I hope that we all can unite soon than later. I don't want the world to see America in this state of mind for a long time. Americans will need to work together and welcome our new president. If Clinton had won, I would of said the same thing. We need to unite as one and not be divided. This hate on here and all over the nation has torn apart friendships and families. My family last night was arguing about it and they usually don't argue about anything. It got bad to the point where my sister and my mom (and her boyfriend) started to curse. On Facebook, I have seen long friendships that went from middle school to high school being torn apart in the matter of seconds.

God, if you are out there, please help us and bring us together once more before it's too late...

Always remember that Hillary won the popular vote. Rub that shit in every alt righter's face every chance you get. Do you think they let Obama ever feel he won? No. So let them see what it feels like.

TRUMP LOST THE POPULAR VOTE.

HILLARY LOST BY NARROW MARGINS IN THE MOST CONSERVATIVE OF STATES.

Their presidential win was slim.

Hillary lost a deep blue state to Trump. How does that make you feel?

Always remember that Hillary won the popular vote. Rub that shit in every alt righter's face every chance you get. Do you think they let Obama ever feel he won? No. So let them see what it feels like.

I'm sure everyone knows what it feels like. The mentality of the losing party after every election is to just trash the victor as much as possible. Doesn't matter which one it is.

Always remember that Hillary won the popular vote. Rub that shit in every alt righter's face every chance you get. Do you think they let Obama ever feel he won? No. So let them see what it feels like.

TRUMP LOST THE POPULAR VOTE.

HILLARY LOST BY NARROW MARGINS IN THE MOST CONSERVATIVE OF STATES.

Their presidential win was slim.

What's interesting about this time around is that Trumps popular vote is actually kind of low. Like, it's about what McCain got, and a decent amount lower than Romney's. But though she won, hers is pretty low too

When it comes down to it, Hillary couldn't bring out the numbers.

I think this time the alarm and sorrow is more than just hyperbole. Don't you think?

Well I mean, it's also misconception and fabrication and violence and more violence with censorship and lies and other lies and probably a bunch of other things, but I'm getting tired of linking.

But what it boils down to is: almost literally the entire media was in Hilary's pocket, and it turns out they were spreading hate too. They're still doing it, too. Don't believe everything you see on TV. The people who did are positively losing their minds.

edit: Last one. This has all happened before and it will all happen again.

<Snipped quote by Tulpa>

Well I mean, it's also misconception and fabrication and violence and more violence with censorship and lies and other lies and probably a bunch of other things, but I'm getting tired of linking.

But what it boils down to is: almost literally the entire media was in Hilary's pocket, and it turns out they were spreading hate too. They're still doing it, too. Don't believe everything you see on TV. The people who did are positively losing their minds.

edit: Last one. This has all happened before and it will all happen again.

2002 to 2006 would be the only time the Reagan era Republicans had the run of it likes this, correct? I mean, Republican President, House, Senate, and court?

Those'd be the years to look at in terms of what to expect for partisan policy making on the right. I suspect there will be far less walking back things then people realize (social security, wade vs roe, whatevs) because really the bird has flown the coop on those policies: they are popular, they are here to stay. Besides, it was a conservative court that enacted Roe vs Wade in the first place (albeit in the pre-Reagan days when there was less partisanship.)

If I had to guess, they will spend a lot of time trying to unravel Obamacare, and Trump will play with his pet initiatives (anti-TPP, Immigration, Border Wall). You can't really just rip up Obamacare without hurting the millions of people who wouldn't have access to healthcare without it. Trump said himself he is about Repeal and Replace. I don't know what he could even replace it with though. Fuckit, the guy's President, we'll see.

The big question I have right now is, you know, who is it exactly we just elected? You can't look back at Trump's policy record like you can another politician, just the shit he has said, and that doesn't... well, he's said a lot of random shit. He also has years of basically being a celebrity, so his public personality is to some extent groomed (hard to tell how much). And there is the question too of how things will go with such a historically inexperienced President.

<Snipped quote by mdk>

2002 to 2006 would be the only time the Reagan era Republicans had the run of it likes this, correct? I mean, Republican President, House, Senate, and court?

Those'd be the years to look at in terms of what to expect for partisan policy making on the right. I suspect there will be far less walking back things then people realize (social security, wade vs roe, whatevs) because really the bird has flown the coop on those policies: they are popular, they are here to stay. Besides, it was a conservative court that enacted Roe vs Wade in the first place (albeit in the pre-Reagan days when there was less partisanship.)

If I had to guess, they will spend a lot of time trying to unravel Obamacare, and Trump will play with his pet initiatives (anti-TPP, Immigration, Border Wall). You can't really just rip up Obamacare without hurting the millions of people who wouldn't have access to healthcare without it. Trump said himself he is about Repeal and Replace. I don't know what he could even replace it with though. Fuckit, the guy's President, we'll see.

The big question I have right now is, you know, who is it exactly we just elected? You can't look back at Trump's policy record like you can another politician, just the shit he has said, and that doesn't... well, he's said a lot of random shit. He also has years of basically being a celebrity, so his public personality is to some extent groomed (hard to tell how much). And there is the question too of how things will go with such a historically inexperienced President.

And particularly with AHCA, certain parts of it are pretty popular even among republicans (notably the pre-existing conditions clause). I would expect that within the first 100 days as promised, he kills the enforcement arm of the bill (the penalty aspect), and puts a moratorium on the rest. Then cherry-picks the popular things, like pre-existing conditions, and puts them to congress piecemeal. Because the democrats can't very well vote that down or filibuster it, and there's no real GOP opposition to those elements -- the cost would be a concern, sure, but you can throw out the bathwater without killing the baby. Once the bill-cutter-upper comes out onto the table, I guarantee you, the Left will magically produce about a hundred better ideas than AHCA, and the Right already has several. This will not be a crisis.

.....anyway if you look at Trump as an experienced business mogul, instead of an inexperienced politician, all sorts of crazy shit starts to make sense. Pretend Mexico is the corporation owning the skyscraper next to Trump Tower. "We're gonna make Mexico pay for the wall" is a negotiation tactic. Mexico comes back with something like "Uh.... look we're not gonna pay for it, but build what you want." "Well can you at least pay for the paint on your side?" "....Do we get to pick the color?" "Sure." "Okay. But the wall can't be _______, we wanna talk about some things...." Now the wall is a reality, and that's all he was ever after -- consent to build a new wall. Politicians in this country haven't done that kind of negotiating in my lifetime anyway..... apparently it's effective so far? I mean we'll see but...... look all of NAFTA is already showing up to the table and it's been two days. Fight Trump on any backwards social shit, I'm there with ya, but... I mean I think he's got some chops. I think we're seeing it already and it has not been long.

<Snipped quote by Vilageidiotx>

And particularly with AHCA, certain parts of it are pretty popular even among republicans (notably the pre-existing conditions clause). I would expect that within the first 100 days as promised, he kills the enforcement arm of the bill (the penalty aspect), and puts a moratorium on the rest. Then cherry-picks the popular things, like pre-existing conditions, and puts them to congress piecemeal. Because the democrats can't very well vote that down or filibuster it, and there's no real GOP opposition to those elements -- the cost would be a concern, sure, but you can throw out the bathwater without killing the baby. Once the bill-cutter-upper comes out onto the table, I guarantee you, the Left will magically produce about a hundred better ideas than AHCA, and the Right already has several. This will not be a crisis.

.....anyway if you look at Trump as an experienced business mogul, instead of an inexperienced politician, all sorts of crazy shit starts to make sense. Pretend Mexico is the corporation owning the skyscraper next to Trump Tower. "We're gonna make Mexico pay for the wall" is a negotiation tactic. Mexico comes back with something like "Uh.... look we're not gonna pay for it, but build what you want." "Well can you at least pay for the paint on your side?" "....Do we get to pick the color?" "Sure." "Okay. But the wall can't be _______, we wanna talk about some things...." Now the wall is a reality, and that's all he was ever after -- consent to build a new wall. Politicians in this country haven't done that kind of negotiating in my lifetime anyway..... apparently it's effective so far? I mean we'll see but...... look all of NAFTA is already showing up to the table and it's been two days. Fight Trump on any backwards social shit, I'm there with ya, but... I mean I think he's got some chops. I think we're seeing it already and it has not been long.

I have serious doubts that business negotiation will translate to political negotiations, but I mean, fuck it, he won his chance to try fair and square, time to see what happens.

I gotta say though, since this is the Bitchfest thread after all, addressing my fellow lefties here: This isn't time to lash out. I've been seeing too much of that the last couple of days, Dems throwing fits or lashing out at third-party voters (fight me) or people who rode out the election, or the midwest, or florida, or the other side for that matter, and really gotta say that strategy is entirely useless. You can't browbeat people into voting, that only makes them disinterested. The Dems lost this election on their own accord. Clinton was a bad candidate, that's the long and short of it. The last few elections are really showing that a popular base is very valuable in modern politics, and the number of left-wingers all over who couldn't (or still can't) talk about Clinton without saying "I don't like her, but..." should have been a massive fucking red flag. What we gotta do isn't to brow beat, or freak out. It's time to look to our own camp and clean house and make it a party that people want to vote for. 2018 is midterms, that's the next chance to say something. Not just in November, but in the primaries too, because it's the primaries when you get to decide what your party represents. This election season has been such a knock-down drag-out that it has taken people I thought to be completely apolitical and swept them right up into it. It's no time to be complacent and lose that energy. One of the take-aways from this election is that the people still ultimately define politics, and if they have a hankerin', they can do some cool shit. So lets do some cool shit.

<Snipped quote by Revolutionary>

Except this time, the victor is a reality TV star rather than someone actually qualified to hold office - among being a climate change denier, rapist and pedophile who filed for bankruptcy six times, advocates for torture and plans to break so many human rights... (And already has.)

I think this time the alarm and sorrow is more than just hyperbole. Don't you think?

>qualified to hold office
This is a fallacious argument. Just because someone isn't already part of the established political sphere doesn't mean they will be inept when it comes to presidency. We could extend this logic by saying that anyone who hasn't been president is unqualified to be president, but where would that lead us? The presidency is very much a position where you learn on the job, so saying that someone is unqualified because they don't meet arbitrary criteria is erroneous.

>climate change denier
Is this a bad thing? Regardless, it is clear that (whether he truly believes it's fake or not) he is using this position to further his other proposals. Proposals like increased coal usage, which he supports primarily to try and spur economic recovery in the Rust Belt. Other than that, I doubt he will dump nuclear goop into the oceans like the bombastic Captain Planet villain everyone makes him out to be. It's also evident that he supports actions to increase water filtration, such as desalination investments and the like, so he can't be all that bad to you greenie goons.

>rapist
Are we talking about Bill Clinton or Donald Trump here? Regardless of the choice words or accusations/perpetration of sexual assault (grabbin 'em), I fail to see how this would have an impact on his policies and ability to be a sound president. LBJ was a rowdy fellow, but he is still in the good graces of many Americans.

>pedophile
Okay, are we talking about Joe Biden now?! I fail to see any accusations of pedophilia against Trump that turned out to be true. Once again, scare tactics. I would be more concerned with the shady messages passed around via the Clinton emails that actually might have revealed a child trafficking ring. (See: Comet Ping Pong)

>filed for bankruptcy six times
He filed for Chapter 11 restructuring of businesses on four, not six, of his many business ventures. This allowed him to reorganize finances in order to stop his ventures from completely going under. Many businesses do this, it's not an anomaly.

>advocates for torture and plans to break so many human rights
My god, how dare he treat criminals and terrorists with the same amount of viciousness they treat our country. You know who else "violated human rights"? Duterte. You know who is winning a drug war via these violations? Duterte.

>I think this time the alarm and sorrow is more than just hyperbole. Don't you think?
Nope. I think we are entering a bold new chapter of America's history. We might finally be able to negotiate alliances with countries such as Russia while also being able to protect the values that made this country great: borders, language, culture.

I don't understand people who still believe that Hillary will still win. She conceded to Trump because she realized that there was no way for her to win this election. And since Trump won, he's getting the help, advice, and tools to run for the President of the United States. The Electoral College won't be voting against Trump at the last minute and shove important information into Clinton's head a month before Obama leaves the office. Also, he has 290 votes and it means that he's willing to recover if somebody plans on siding with Clinton.

Protesting and signing petitions are pointless. We should be working to unite as one nation. The protests and this 'Calexit' is embarrassing us even more.

I don't understand people who still believe that Hillary will still win. She conceded to Trump because she realized that there was no way for her to win this election. And since Trump won, he's getting the help, advice, and tools to run for the President of the United States. The Electoral College won't be voting against Trump at the last minute and shove important information into Clinton's head a month before Obama leaves the office. Also, he has 290 votes and it means that he's willing to recover if somebody plans on siding with Clinton.

Protesting and signing petitions are pointless. We should be working to unite as one nation. The protests and this 'Calexit' is embarrassing us even more.

California does not want to break away from the US at the same time we get a mercantilist President. That'd devastate the Californian economy beyond repair. And if the electoral college decided to act in bad faith... yeh, that's worse than anything Trump would ever do, since that would be nothing less than a move into literal oligarchy.

Dems really need to turn that energy into party reform. The guy who dressed down the DNC chair at their first post-defeat meeting got it right.

Math is pretty straight forward, really. If Trump is good at the job, well, that's good. Improvement is what everyone universally wants. And if does end up being a shit President, the best way to defeat him is with a candidate people can actually get behind.

@Vilageidiotx, as a Californian, I agree with you. Our state isn't able to become a nation at all. Running country requires a shit ton of money and time. And we would need to deal with our issues, but we are just making more of them. Also, it would cause America to lost 55 electoral votes and the state votes blue in most of the elections. That would be a terrible lost for democrats. The party just needs to rebuild and try again in 2020.

Maybe they shouldn't do what they did to Bernie Sanders next time.

Texas made the same kind of threats when Obama won his second term, if memory serves. It'll pass.