[OOC] CLOSED - Ultimate One Universe: Season One

[Sep]

I hope as time passes we embrace the "One Universe"-ness of it more and more, too.

I think it's tempting to kind of hedge your bets and focus on the ultimised aspects of your character but essentially keep their supporting cast and villains the same – or to do the opposite and keep the characters roughly the same and integrate a slightly more mixed cast.

With the F4 I've kind of done the latter but I'm hoping to do both more the further I get into things – and from talking to a few of you away from the OOC thread, some of you have similar plans. Which is exciting.

@Morden Man

I know I'm actively looking for C-Listers I can poach and incorporate, as well as making future plans (still waiting for that PM about Grodd and Wakanda). I think, as someone who's still largely an outsider to this group, it can be hard to know who you can approach and talk to about incorporating different ideas and characters from different origins.

I'm most interested to see what @Master Bruce and the other GMs come up with for the Multiplayer event, as I feel like other games flames burnt out by not running these before people lost interest as some sought some form of interaction.

Also, @Master Bruce, @Byrd Man, and @Morden Man. I've mentioned this to others in PM, but I wanted to bring this topic up to you three. I'm personally of the mindset that games like these are better off when players are kept to a single character. If they want to swap in the future, sure, but having multiple, simultaneous characters I feel has historically always caused issues for these particular games. Just as villain NPCs tend to do, though to a more extreme degree.

I know a couple others feel the same way. I can guess that Gowi will be opposed to this idea. But I'm curious where you all stand.

@Retired

As much as in the past I've enjoyed secondaries and playing the Villain I'd have to agree, to an extent. I feel like players have enough character they can play with when they have their supporting cast, as most players move them around, sometimes quite like PCs. Which I feel should give a player enough to work with in order to keep everything interesting.

In terms of Villains, I don't think someone should get to play a Villain unless the hero character is active and the two players have an agreement and some form of plan. Say if someone joined as RF, they'd obviously have to go with my plan to an extent but they'd have their own twist on it and we'd work heavily together.

[Master Bruce]

Also, @Master Bruce, @Byrd Man, and @Morden Man. I've mentioned this to others in PM, but I wanted to bring this topic up to you three. I'm personally of the mindset that games like these are better off when players are kept to a single character. If they want to swap in the future, sure, but having multiple, simultaneous characters I feel has historically always caused issues for these particular games. Just as villain NPCs tend to do, though to a more extreme degree.

I know a couple others feel the same way. I can guess that Gowi will be opposed to this idea. But I'm curious where you all stand.

@Retired

I hesitate to say it's always caused issues, just because I've played simultaneous characters many times in the past myself and am biased on the subject, but there was definitely a reason I wanted to hold off of allowing that for this season. While I'd love to throw up an application for Daredevil or some other character, I personally just don't trust myself to stay active if I divide my attention away from one character. It's more of a case-by-case basis, to me. Some people can handle it, some people can't, and some people think they can handle it but are woefully mistaken. I'll see where this season goes before making a decision on whether to expand the rule, but for now, the limit is one per player.

As far as Villain NPCs go, I'm not sure what you mean. That tends to have a negative effect on a game? Because when we ran our games over on the other site, one of the biggest problems we had was getting people to sign up as villains. I had planned on perhaps opening the villain side of things up for play in Year Two, but I felt that it was imperative that people get a sense of control over their own space in establishing these new versions of characters before popping that cork.

[Sep]

<Snipped quote by Sep>

Your chief exports are malnutrition, whiskey and sadness.

@ErsatzEmperor

Educate yourself, scrub

[ErsatzEmperor]

<Snipped quote by ErsatzEmperor>

Educate yourself, scrub

@Sep

Sadness was No. 6, they didn't have enough room.

[Sep]

<Snipped quote by Sep>

Sadness was No. 6, they didn't have enough room.

@ErsatzEmperor

We make the world better, with our presence, science and wisdom.

[ErsatzEmperor]

<Snipped quote by ErsatzEmperor>

We make the world better, with our presence, science and wisdom.

@Sep

You can't deep fry wisdom.

[Master Bruce]

I hope as time passes we embrace the "One Universe"-ness of it more and more, too.

I think it's tempting to kind of hedge your bets and focus on the ultimised aspects of your character but essentially keep their supporting cast and villains the same – or to do the opposite and keep the characters roughly the same and integrate a slightly more mixed cast.

With the F4 I've kind of done the latter but I'm hoping to do both more the further I get into things – and from talking to a few of you away from the OOC thread, some of you have similar plans. Which is exciting.

@Morden Man

I'm actually just about to introduce a Marvel character into the fold in Gotham, as a replacement for the ashes that were once my big grand Black Widow romance (), but I'm definitely trying to be careful of doing anything too gimmicky with Bats. It would've been easy for me to say that Bruce trained in Wakanda or, as I've seen with other Batman players in these One Universe type of scenarios, train with Stick along with Matt Murdock, but I wanted that to just be stuff that Bruce kind of happened upon instead of having direct personal ties with at the beginning. Though to again talk about the Black Widow arc that'll never happen ( ), Bruce was going to have done a brief stint in Siberia under an undercover Natalia Romanova as established through flashbacks.

But I'm very keen to have more Marvel stuff interweave with Gotham. Especially the street level people like DD, Iron Fist, ect. and some of the villains from that side of things. I can't imagine how Batman and The Kingpin would fare in a rivalry, but I might get the chance to explore that in future seasons once HenryJonesJr has tired of Wilson.

[Sep]

<Snipped quote by Sep>

You can't deep fry wisdom.

@ErsatzEmperor

It's true, our greatest defeat.

Many lives were lost attempting such a feat.

[stark]

<Snipped quote by Sep>

You can't deep fry wisdom.

@ErsatzEmperor

Are you sure America hasn’t already tried?

[Morden Man]

Byrd and EE know this from our private talks in regards to Hell, but I fully am intending to blend Marvel and DC demonology, etc, and later on delve into how they all co-exist. The three of us have laid out some basics just so there's a rough understanding to avoid contradicting one another in posts, but I plan to do more than that. Gradually, though.

@Retired

This is sweet, sweet music to my ears.

I know I'm actively looking for C-Listers I can poach and incorporate, as well as making future plans (still waiting for that PM about Grodd and Wakanda). I think, as someone who's still largely an outsider to this group, it can be hard to know who you can approach and talk to about incorporating different ideas and characters from different origins.

@Sep

I'm not entirely sure that F4 villains quite lend themselves to the Flash as naturally as some other rogues galleries might, but you're always welcome to ask me if you have an idea. That goes for anyone else that wants a piece of F4-shaped action.

Wait, you know what could work very well? How about we incorporate Red Ghost and his Super-Apes into Grodd's backstory somehow? That could be one possible explanation. (I feel like the could is doing a lot of heavy-lifting there)

See? It's not too difficult.

[Retired]

<Snipped quote by Retired>

I hesitate to say it's always caused issues, just because I've played simultaneous characters many times in the past myself and am biased on the subject, but there was definitely a reason I wanted to hold off of allowing that for this season. While I'd love to throw up an application for Daredevil or some other character, I personally just don't trust myself to stay active if I divide my attention away from one character. It's more of a case-by-case basis, to me. Some people can handle it, some people can't, and some people think they can handle it but are woefully mistaken. I'll see where this season goes before making a decision on whether to expand the rule, but for now, the limit is one per player.

As far as Villain NPCs go, I'm not sure what you mean. That tends to have a negative effect on a game? Because when we ran our games over on the other site, one of the biggest problems we had was getting people to sign up as villains. I had planned on perhaps opening the villain side of things up for play in Year Two, but I felt that it was imperative that people get a sense of control over their own space in establishing these new versions of characters before popping that cork.

@Master Bruce

As for a case-by-case basis, I definitely understand where you're coming from with that. And my comment of it always causing issues wasn't to infer that everyone who multis causes a problem, but that in each game there are enough that do for it to matter.

In regards to villain PCs, every single comic game that I've joined since 2012 - using that date as that's when I first applied to ASM and began RPing with this loosely-defined group - there has been one or two people who apply as a villain, and then either immediately or after a handful of posts flounder on what to do. They have their original concept, but as soon as it comes down to hammering out posts, there's either one issue or another. Whether that be losing direction, having no one to interact with, trying to start inter-player events that no one responds to, trying to just jump into someone else's arc to try and get that interaction, etc. In that first ASM I joined I did the same; as Tombstone, I had a clear plan I wanted to do that would take him on his journey of running for mayor of NYC to use his political power to supplant Fisk as Kingpin. Instead, after a couple posts, I floundered.

Of course, there are going to be exceptions. But, generally and largely, I find this to be the case in each and every one of these games.

[Retired]

That goes for anyone else that wants a piece of F4-shaped action.

@Morden Man

There's potential there for something since they have a tendency to come across extra-dimensional entities that either are or could be described as demonic.

[ErsatzEmperor]

<Snipped quote by Master Bruce>

As for a case-by-case basis, I definitely understand where you're coming from with that. And my comment of it always causing issues wasn't to infer that everyone who multis causes a problem, but that in each game there are enough that do for it to matter.

In regards to villain PCs, every single comic game that I've joined since 2012 - using that date as that's when I first applied to ASM and began RPing with this loosely-defined group - there has been one or two people who apply as a villain, and then either immediately or after a handful of posts flounder on what to do. They have their original concept, but as soon as it comes down to hammering out posts, there's either one issue or another. Whether that be losing direction, having no one to interact with, trying to start inter-player events that no one responds to, trying to just jump into someone else's arc to try and get that interaction, etc. In that first ASM I joined I did the same; as Tombstone, I had a clear plan I wanted to do that would take him on his journey of running for mayor of NYC to use his political power to supplant Fisk as Kingpin. Instead, after a couple posts, I floundered.

Of course, there are going to be exceptions. But, generally and largely, I find this to be the case in each and every one of these games.

@Retired

In the same game I did the same with Vulture and Mr. Sinister so I fully see your point. I've always been in favour of players adopting villains on a case-by-case basis to fulfil a use, rather than have them ran to the same standard as a heroic character. That, I'd think, would minimise the lingering on the sidelines or lack of things to do with them generally.

[Sep]

<Snipped quote by Master Bruce>

As for a case-by-case basis, I definitely understand where you're coming from with that. And my comment of it always causing issues wasn't to infer that everyone who multis causes a problem, but that in each game there are enough that do for it to matter.

In regards to villain PCs, every single comic game that I've joined since 2012 - using that date as that's when I first applied to ASM and began RPing with this loosely-defined group - there has been one or two people who apply as a villain, and then either immediately or after a handful of posts flounder on what to do. They have their original concept, but as soon as it comes down to hammering out posts, there's either one issue or another. Whether that be losing direction, having no one to interact with, trying to start inter-player events that no one responds to, trying to just jump into someone else's arc to try and get that interaction, etc. In that first ASM I joined I did the same; as Tombstone, I had a clear plan I wanted to do that would take him on his journey of running for mayor of NYC to use his political power to supplant Fisk as Kingpin. Instead, after a couple posts, I floundered.

Of course, there are going to be exceptions. But, generally and largely, I find this to be the case in each and every one of these games.

@Retired

I actually share this sentiment, which is why I think Villains should be tied closely to the player controlling the Hero that is connected to them, if they then chose to go terrorise someone else that should be something discussed between them. In an ASM rendition, or two I think, I went as Doom and despite having grand plans, it is hard not to flounder. As the whole fun of being a Villain is doing bad things, but it's far less fun when nobody tries to stop you forming the Latverian Empire out of smaller European Countries.

[Retired]

<Snipped quote by Retired>

In the same game I did the same with Vulture and Mr. Sinister so I fully see your point. I've always been in favour of players adopting villains on a case-by-case basis to fulfil a use, rather than have them ran to the same standard as a heroic character. That, I'd think, would minimise the lingering on the sidelines or lack of things to do with them generally.

@ErsatzEmperor

I remember well.

But, yes. I think that's how it should be, as well. For a smaller scale example: Thor fights the Absorbing Man in his debut, then months later X player tangoes with him. Or, on a grander scale, as Master Bruce inferred, Spider-Man deals with Kingpin now, and perhaps in two years Fisk decides to make a comeback that involves pushing for territory in Gotham, thus running across the Batman in a larger arc.

[Morden Man]

There's potential there for something since they have a tendency to come across extra-dimensional entities that either are or could be described as demonic.

@Retired

I like the sound of this. Let's revisit this idea once you've got your feet under you a little in the IC thread.

Also, a little unrelated, but as much as I love shit-posting, I find it almost refreshing to talk openly about what we have planned in the OOC thread. It's nice to discuss ideas with people out in the open rather than in PMs or on Discord. I know we all like to have the element of surprise (and I know I certainly fetishize "reveals" a little bit) but it can sometimes be a little isolating to see people posting day after day as if ideas come to them like manna from heaven, when really it's because they thrash everything out behind closed doors.

We should do that out in the open more often, I think. Inbetween the GIFs, memes and dick jokes, obviously.

[Sep]

So my internet died and considering I should have been asleep ages ago I'm taking this as a sign.

Can't wait to read 5 pages of discussion and spam, someone save me the cliff notes

[Retired]

<Snipped quote by Retired>

I like the sound of this. Let's revisit this idea once you've got your feet under you a little in the IC thread.

@Morden Man

This is the politest way anyone has ever said "start posting more, you little shit!" to me.

[ErsatzEmperor]

<Snipped quote by Morden Man>

This is the politest way anyone has ever said "start posting more, you little shit!" to me.

@Retired

At least people are polite to you.

[Master Bruce]

As for a case-by-case basis, I definitely understand where you're coming from with that. And my comment of it always causing issues wasn't to infer that everyone who multis causes a problem, but that in each game there are enough that do for it to matter.

In regards to villain PCs, every single comic game that I've joined since 2012 - using that date as that's when I first applied to ASM and began RPing with this loosely-defined group - there has been one or two people who apply as a villain, and then either immediately or after a handful of posts flounder on what to do. They have their original concept, but as soon as it comes down to hammering out posts, there's either one issue or another. Whether that be losing direction, having no one to interact with, trying to start inter-player events that no one responds to, trying to just jump into someone else's arc to try and get that interaction, etc. In that first ASM I joined I did the same; as Tombstone, I had a clear plan I wanted to do that would take him on his journey of running for mayor of NYC to use his political power to supplant Fisk as Kingpin. Instead, after a couple posts, I floundered.

Of course, there are going to be exceptions. But, generally and largely, I find this to be the case in each and every one of these games.

@Retired

We'll see, for sure. I definitely don't worry about that at the moment, due to the fact that I'm very hardline committed to never allowing second characters and PC villains into this season. But you may be right and it may be something to more carefully consider for future seasons than I might've previously thought, because I am starting to reflect on some games I've been apart of in the past and see some of the same issues pop up in my recollection.

Maybe if a compromise can be worked out that limits the amount of play that secondary or villain characters get? I don't know.

That's honestly a problem for another day, and I'd like to work it out with the community rather than just dictate what the game will be if we get to a Year Two. Once we cross that bridge, I'll open up a dialogue about it and see what everyone thinks to weigh out the pros and cons. But I am definitely starting to think it's an issue to be considered more seriously than I had before.