Fabricant451

What shows/movies are you watching?

I love that a movie where a dude shoves a buttplug trophy up his ass and a dog is used as a flail weapon has the most Oscar nominations of the year including Best Picture

Movies are fucking dumb I love them

See you space samurai... A space opera

i heard i could be a genetically enhanced catgirl

Video Games: The General Discussion & Community Thread Number Two

We've talked about worse to be fair

Video Games: The General Discussion & Community Thread Number Two

<Snipped quote by Dark Cloud>

I MUST KNOW NOW. Is it made out of Pink? Or made for Pink?

@PerfectThought

A shitty pink sauce made by a tik tok influencer that had terrible packaging and looks like pepto bismal.

Rank Your Favourite Movie Sets

I'm going to give the definitive ranking of the Star Wars movies (only the movies not the shows, who has time for that) because me ranking the MCU movies will take much more effort. So here it is the definitive cannot be denied ranking of the 11 Star Wars movies you may not like it but you can't deny it is definitive and correct.

1: Star Wars: The Last Jedi
2: Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back
3: Star Wars
4: Star Wars: The Force Awakens
5: Star Wars: Return of the Jedi
6: Star Wars: Attack of the Clones
7: Star Wars: Revenge of the Sith
8: Solo: A Star Wars Story
9: Rogue One: A Star Wars Story
10: Star Wars: The Phantom Menace
11: Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker

Official and undeniable

Anime & Manga! Oh my! (Anime/Manga Thread)

I have a very complicated relationship with One Piece where I haven't really enjoyed it as much as I did in the pre-timeskip days and the most recently finished arc was an absolute slog for me that I questioned if it was even worth it or if I was sunken costing it but then he puts out a banger chapter and I'm back in.

What shows/movies are you watching?

RRR was so good it made me want to punch British people

Video Games: The General Discussion & Community Thread Number Two

Stray always seemed like a game that started and stopped with the pitch of "you play as a cat!" and that appealed to a certain group of people who really like cats but then it's like how do you make that interesting and the answer always came back to "but you play as a cat!"

This is based solely on second hand information but literally no one I've talked to who has played it has been able to sell me on it without going "well I like cats and you play as a cat!"

What shows/movies are you watching?

<Snipped quote by Fabricant451>
Since we both posted about that movie in this thread. I'll assume you're in on the gag, and already realize that multiple movies had used the multiverse shtick this year.

@SleepingSilence

Damn I knew I should've said Beavis and Butthead Do the Universe. Foiled by my own pretentiousness

To avoid arguing against the same fallacious 'argumentum ad populum' that I already know won't stay consistent. (Since no one universally believes "well this is popular, well this is profitable, so it can't be criticized/poor in quality" once its something *you* don't like.)

I wouldn't claim all studios are the same. But some don't even seem to care about making money, nor critical and audience reception. (And not only those "we'll get a tax break, if we fail" kind of movies/scam projects.)

Though Illumination Entertainment's goal is obvious from the movies they make. And the reception of their movies (looking at places like IMBD) is on a downward trend. So since it's their studio making the hypothetical movie we were discussing. I want to know if you think they'd actually make a good Legend Of Zelda adaption? Or is the argument that they'd make a profitable movie?

I'm gonna let you in on a little secret: I've never even fuckin' seen an Illumination movie, I just know of them because Minions are unfortunately a thing and Minions 2 was a meme but also a profitable one. That said, would they be my first choice? No, but my first choice would likely be a 2D animation studio because I prefer it, or at least something more visually creative like Into the Spiderverse. Illumination movies are generally safe which is fine if a little uninspired and it makes sense why a company as notoriously protective of its IP would go with them.

I can't make a qualitative statement on Illumination movies but I don't see why they couldn't make a good Legend of Zelda adaptation because as a studio they clearly have talented animators. I think the Mario movie will be fine and I have no reason to think their hypothetical Zelda movie would be anything less than that. Whether or not that translates to good is up to the individual. It is undeniable they'd make a profitable one and something tells me that that was what motivated Nintendo to work with them on Mario.

So yes I think they could make a good Zelda adaptation but I would prefer any other studio. I just like to give things a fair shake even if I acknowledge that some decisions from studios are made with not the best intentions for quality.

It's almost cliché to point out that Hollywood has no original ideas, and only continues to abuse the same trends. So yeah, I'm not exactly alone in feeling burnt out.

But, I'm human too. John Wick and Spiderverse still have my interest as well. I'm just not expecting much out of them.

And aside from a few long-standing creatives like Christopher Nolan creating Oppenheimer, with a star-studded cast. I don't think I've even heard of most of those movies. (And I'd wager the same is true for most people in general.) Since its seems more and more movies come out with little fanfare. Maybe because fewer people are watching online ads?

It's because, and this is surely going to add to the cynicism, with more and more studios being owned by bigger companies, they will spend assloads of money to make sure that tentpole and franchise pictures get engagement. Social media clicks, trailer views, ads during sporting events. Ant-Man is out in like four weeks and like two weeks after it comes out the machine will turn to Guardians of the Galaxy 3. It's less that movies come out with little fanfare and more that studios will bet on a sure thing. Horror movies cost less (generally) to make and so can spend more on advertising. This is why most times when people see the Best Picture nominees it's like "I have heard of two of these movies what the fuck?".

The deeper problem is that franchise movies will box out smaller movies, especially if you live in a smaller town. It is not uncommon for a movie theater to have like nothing but Marvel movies all day and then like three screenings of something else at like 10 pm. And with the rise of streaming services, studios are also trying their hand at 'limited release then immediately to streaming' but that's only serving to make customers not see the movies period because to most normal people 'streaming service' starts with Netflix and stops with maybe Amazon Prime.

I love movies I just kinda hate the system that produces them. But I'm fortunate enough to live in an area where I can see the big dumb blockbusters on a big dumb screen and still have a theater where they show the quality shit that makes me remember why I studied the fucking things in the first place.

All I'm saying, as an admitted cynic, while I'd imagine the quantity has only increased for movies and shows alike. (And perhaps it's not unique for Hollywood that there's more bad products, than good ones.) The decreasing tolerance for (and ability to engage with) basic criticism, is at an all time low on the internet. (But this is more obnoxious in the gaming space. So I'll leave it at that.)

Believe me I've been the film cynic. But I also got real tired and exhausted with the poor state of film criticism/analysis and media literacy on the internet and social media that I basically turned into a debate lord over fuckin films for a while (and still kinda do but believe me I used to be worse) because I care a lot that it pained me to have people start trying to objectively state when movies were bad or good or shit like that.

And like I don't care if people don't like a movie (even if sometimes I get aggro but hey who doesn't defend the things they love...other than sane people) but I also want to stress to people that it's not all bad. There are good movies out there!

Point being, I'm sure you would not be the only one using The Minions Movie of all things to defend the idea of another video game movie adaption being produced. But for me, that only adds on to this feeling.

I think video game adaptations in general are kinda dumb even if I liked those Sonic movies especially because way too many western games are still chasing this weird 'video games as cinematic experience' high where like obviously the first episode of The Last of Us will be well received, the game was basically 50 percent watching it anyway!

Video Games: The General Discussion & Community Thread Number Two

That is partially true. But things that stick to a winning script also tend to do better than things that twist in the winds whichever direction they may blow. Game of Thrones and the prequels. The Witcher Seasons 1 & 2 compared to that new one that's flailing. Peter Jackson's LOTR compared to the Rings of Power. Watchmen The Movie compared to Watchmen the sequel tv series.

But even so I'm not arguing what is most likely. It is quite likely they will shit the bed and do exactly that. Cast for famous names and agendas. I'm arguing what would produce the best product. The best representation of the thing they're trying to build off of.

@BangoSkank

Both Watchmen adaptations were bad but they were bad for different ways. Peter Jackson did LOTR and then he also did The Hobbit. Also the LOTR movies weren't a 1:1 adaptation because a good adaptation uses the source material as a bible not an instruction manual. What do you mean cast for agendas? No one in the Mario movie is cast for an agenda other than the agenda of making even more money than a movie called 'The Super Mario Brothers Movie' is already going to make.

Popularity is not quality.

Didn't make that statement. But name recognition helps make money.

Money good because studios want money.

WoW is an immensely popular game but it is unlikely to make lists of greatest masterpieces of all time. Fortnite is incredibly popular but it's not going to be on a lot of lists of best games of the 2010s/2020s.

World of Warcraft is absolutely already on the list of greatest games of all time it was a groundbreaking, landmark game. Fortnite will probably have a sizeable entry as well. Regardless of WoW's current state, it is still a popular game whose influence is such that it is still the top of an entire genre of games. It is the standard bearer.

Cumberbatch as The Grinch is a great pick. He's got the weird voice and does great faces and impressions. He can work great as just a voice or in costume or via CGI.

Jack Black is a pretty decent Bowser if Bowser is going to have a voice and from what I've heard he's neigh impossible to pick out as Jack Black.

Chris Evans was a terrible pick for Buzz Lightyear instead of Tim Allen and the movie suffered for it, among other things.

The Lightyear movie was fine and it wouldn't have made sense for Tim Allen to do it because it's not the same character. And if you heard Jack Black and Bowser from the movie they would sound similar because all Jack Black is doing, likely with the help of movie magic, is talking in a slightly deeper register.

People in general acknowledge this. It's why often times someone can tell you "we cast X as Y" and you can immediately say "oh my god yes. Fuck he/she was born to play that role" or "whaaaaaaaat? They cast whoooooo? What were they thinking?"

It is why you referred to "stunt casting" because some casting is clearly stunt casting.

There is not a single actor that has been cast that I have thought "Wow they were 100 percent perfect for the role" and in many cases, including the ones you're about to list, the role became them not the other way around. Hugh Jackman was not a great pick for Wolverine at first and neither was Heath Ledger as Joker (seriously, literally everyone thought it was bad) and then the movie came out and people were like "Oh hey wow they did pretty good" because an actor can convince you that they were right for the part. That's why they're actors.

Also I've been talking about voice acting.

Examples below, clearly just smack yourself in the face great casting.

Consider:

Henry Cavil as Superman / Geralt
Gal Gadot as Wonderwoman
Chadwick Boseman as Black Panther
Ryan Reynolds as Deadpool
Halle Berry as Storm
Jon Bernthal as The Punisher
Hugh Jackman as Wolverine
Patrick Stewart as Professor X
Robert Downey Jr. as Ironman (at the time a has been)
Chris Evans as Captain America (at the time a relative unknown)
Benedict Cumberbatch as Dr. Strange
Margot Robbie as Harley Quinn
Chris Hemsworth as Thor (at the time an unknown)
Chris Pratt as Starlord (at the time "that fat guy from Not The Office")
Robin Williams as Genie in Aladdin
Heath Ledger as Joker (at the time a teen heart throb)
Joaquin Phoenix as Joker

I mean fuck, Daniel Day MOTHERFUCKING Lewis as Abraham Lincoln/Butcher Bill

Great castings.

And yet, every single character has been played by other people (and better, in almost every case) and in some cases they are the worst person who has played them. Also you're putting live action and voice acting together here. Also Daniel Day Lewis could play anyone and be perfect for it he's Daniel Day Lewis.

But hey.
Daisy Ridley would probably make a good Wonderwoman. People loved her in Star Wars right? Right?
Kevin Hart is very popular right now, make him New T'Challa
Doja Cat could be the new Storm, maybe she can do a song on the show.
Daniel Kaluyaa was great in NOPE have him play Professor X
Dune did well right? Let's have Timothee Chalamet play Superman

There are objectively and obviously better and worse castings.

Why couldn't Kevin Hart voice T'Challa. Why couldn't Daisy voice Wonder Woman? Why couldn't any of these people voice those characters?

If Kristin Stewart voices The Joker she's gonna be worse than Willem Dafoe.

How do you know? She could be good.

In the Legend of Zelda show/movie

If Joe Pesci voices Link you know he's worse than Timothee Chalamet
If Taylor Swift voices Zelda you know she's better than Viola Davis
If Eddie Murphy voices Epona you're probably actually watching Shrek 5

Timothee Chalamet and Viola Davis in anything would be better than Taylor Swift and Joe Pesci, especially Joe Pesci of these days.

Pharrell Williams doesn't fit musically into Legend of Zelda, neither does Beyoncé, neither does Ozzy Osborne, neither do The Beatles, neither does any song from Guardians of the Galaxy

And yet, the composer for the Mario movie is literally working with Koji Kondo, the composer of the Mario games (and also the Zelda games) so literally all this chicken little hypotheticals are based on nothing other than Pharell doing some song work on the Despicable Me movies. Not even the Minions movies. If the Mario movie is going to have a licensed song it's going to be in the end credits which is like the most nothing thing ever.

There is no reason to think that a Zelda movie or indeed the Mario movie would be like a movie from 2013 especially when the studio is working so closely with the parent company.

Bottom line: Cast people who fit the character. Don't reimagine the character folks already love because you want to cast the Billboard Top 10 and the tabloids Top Sexiest Men and Women of 2022 or for any other similarly stupid ass reasons.

This doesn't happen.