Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Archmage MC
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All I'm getting from this conversation is that Naruto has crappy writing, just like Bleach! xD. The first few arcs were good, but then it all went downhill.

At least Toriyama is trying with DB super, though no female majin fighter makes me sad. They're so adorable!
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by tex
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@dirty slimeIf you're going to use the 'lol timestop' argument, then I'd have to inquire as to how time stop even works. In both the final fantasy universe/Kingdom hearts multiverse, Time stop never actually 'stops time' but rather, ceases a target's ability to move for a set period. Not to mention, time stop doesn't work on bosses, so it's clear that it can be resisted with enough willpower. I'd infer that time-stop actually affects the person's soul/muscles/gravity in order to mimic the actual stoppage of time, something that many bosses in kingdom hearts, and certainly Kaguya, are/would be immune to.

Hades was clearly described as truly invulnerable while in his home, the underworld, and just like all Olympian gods based on their lore, can be harmed through not-exactly-godlike-means. It's even been shown through many other universes, so using their godlike prowess as a reference is not a very reliable source of knowledge in this situation. Respecting the kingdom hearts universe, it can be argued that Sora's keyblade and magic affects the heart directly, so it could possibly harm Kaguya, but the brunt force of his magic seems incomparable, and his durability is also completely incomparable, assuring that he would most certainly get two-shotted by Kaguya.

Lightning dodging? Happens in Naruto.

Xemnas situation? I'd still argue that his ability to harm and battle Xemnas is based soley on the power of his key blade. Despite being a key-blade master, he's still human with slight advantages in speed and strength. His 'trump card' time stop is worthless against powerful beings, and his ability to harm godlike entities is based solely on whether or not he can hit them enough before getting stomped.

I don't know anything about palpatine, but if he can move at the speed of light/sound then maybe he could kill Kaguya easily? Not sure how strong her perception is.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Mtntopview
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Gosh darned it you people are too fast
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by dirty slime
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@thewizardguy

Naruto lore is often inconsistent, especially near the end. I'm 100% sure the Ten Tails had infinite power. But yeah, it's definitely contradicted later on. Also I heavily doubt cell-level regeneration was an obstacle considering the insane powers her sons had (soul removal, gravity, destruction of all things with their black chakra weapons).

Apparently Soul Removal wouldn't be enough, otherwise Hagoromo wouldn't have had to seal her away (Because that's one of the Rinnegan's ability). Consequently, she has that same power but clearly surpasses practically any Soul Eater character via feats (at least from the anime, haven't checked the manga). The others I don't know their powers.

@dirty slime Speed of light or not, she could easily catch off guards two protagonists who used instant teleportation (Minato level). I don't think he'll get the jump on Kaguya, quite the contrary they'll keep trying to surprise each other and fail miserably. The only problem is that Kaguya can kill anything in one shot (that isn't some super immortal).

As for Sora. Ok, the instant he has to cooldown one of those, he dies. Lel.


Catching a teleporter off guard is easy when you're so much faster than he can react and he's completely unaware of you're presence. Same deal with just about anyone with powers that make them "invincible" so long as they actively use it.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Gun
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@thewizardguyI can agree with majority of that, but light as far as science is concerned is considered a fluctuating magnetic wave, if not packets of EM energy, which then creates photons. And the properties of M fields, which are a base component of this characters weapons are capable of displacing energy, which gives no adverse boon against light, but would still not allow them to be treated inferior based only on in-universe examples of a canon character. But he and I have already come to a consensus so no point in pursuing it further.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Archmage MC
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If anyone needs a summery of whats been going on in order to jump in, let me know.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Saint Girralo
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@Mtntopview

If you need a place to come in, Firing Solution Bravo could be a request for you to be air dropped on my position.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by tex
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If anyone needs a summery of whats been going on in order to jump in, let me know.


Please do. I have a feeling most of what's happening is more 'in the moment' than 'long term'
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Letter Bee
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@Lmpkio, I was allowed, so, thanks.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Letter Bee
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@Gentlemanvaultboy, up early; wanna talk on the link I gave ya?

@Everyone else, what's the debate about?
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Archmage MC
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<Snipped quote by Archmage MC>

Please do. I have a feeling most of what's happening is more 'in the moment' than 'long term'


This. From what I understand there are 3 or so groups.

Light, DoomGuy, Dirty Slime's group of digimon, gun's giant mec, Mustang, and Savato's robot are fighting in one spot near the front lines, though Doomguy is working his way into the bulk of the army/the base. This group is fighting near the front lines where most of the Resistance soldiers are.

Wizard's char and Gentleman's char are fighting in a different spot away from the first group. They are almost done with their fight and are in their own special area.

The third group is inside the base composed of Kid Flash, MC, Bayonetta, and Absolis's char. Kid flash had just got the base to kick to reserve power, MC blowing up a few sealed doors to get to Kid Flash.

Not sure where everyone else is.

2x Thank Thank
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by thewizardguy
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@dirty slime
Again, even with Force-augmented senses, there's nothing there that would indicate he's near to lightspeed.

Precog allows them to dodge those attacks. And even if they could dodge those things in person with no precog, that's Mach 1000 at best, not even 1% of lightspeed. So really, not even close.

Both of his feats of mind control were performed over an extended period of time. Kaguya's feat was instant. Big difference. There's no indication he'd be able to replicate that level of mind-control in battle, and most of his encounters seem to show that he can't. His greatest combat TP feat is using TP to make people dizzy in combat.

@Savato
If you're so certain, then show some evidence. If ten-tails had infinite power, she would never have lost it, as she could simply have prevented the action that caused her to lose her power. She's not omnipotent by definition, and therefore infinite power is a big stretch. Considering the feats later on, I'd say that while she's immensely powerful, she has no feats that put her on the infinite-power scale. Her best feat is planet level, and even then that never really happens. It's just implied.

Resistance to soular attacks, most likely. But do recall Cell was able to regenerate fully from having only a single cell survive.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by thewizardguy
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@Archmage MC
The female majins were bullshit. Majin Buu was a unique magical being created from pure hatred. It can't multiply, that makes no sense.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Letter Bee
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@thewizardguy, Again, what's the debate about?
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by thewizardguy
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@Letter Bee
The current argument is whether Sidious and Sora would be able to take Kaguya from Naruto.

Edit: Lol, you repeated the question just as I answered it.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Archmage MC
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@Archmage MC
The female majins were bullshit. Majin Buu was a unique magical being created from pure hatred. It can't multiply, that makes no sense.


I agree, but for different reasons. Toryiama didn't take the oppertunity to do some world building. Something as simple as Majin are denizens of the Demon Realm, a realm which has almost no lore, and are the servant class in that realm. Males are fat and the cooks, Females are a bit more serious and are easily entertained, but are probably more of the fighters. Majin Buu, or Kid Buu rather, was a mutant that Bibidi summoned from there.

Bam, Majin lore.

Toryiama's lore is that Buu read a porno and made a female Majin named Booby and well, do I need to explain further?
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by tex
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For affirmation.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by Letter Bee
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@tex, Do you have Steam or Skype?
Hidden 9 yrs ago 9 yrs ago Post by Savato
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@thewizardguy Kurama claims its power to be immeasurable. The evidence is both in the official translations in the manga and anime when Naruto attempts to sense its power via Sage mode, which is where Kurama makes that claim. It essentially has unlimited power. I don't remember the episode but if the wiki is right, it's in chapter 610.

As said before, the writing is very inconsistent in Naruto. On one side she needs to reload her chakra when doing a few jutsu but in another she can effortlessly manipulate the elements in a continental scale. And yes, she can technically use chakra in any way imaginable. Though she isn't omnipotent, she was just established to have an infinite amount of power to spare.

Edit: mangapanda.com/naruto/610/7

While Mangapanda doesn't have the most reliable translations, the official was more or less that.
Hidden 9 yrs ago Post by thewizardguy
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@Archmage MC
It wouldn't make sense with the official lore if he were to do that. The fat Majin Buu we know was caused by Super Buu absorbing the Supreme Kai, who lobotomized himself before being observed. This effectively reduced Buu to an infantile state, creating the happy stupid persona we're originally introduced to. The natural form of Buu is Kid Buu, and it's likely that anything of the same species would have a similar shape, or a completely different one based on what that Buu had absorbed.
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