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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Simple Unicycle
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Put me down as being opposed to the second character idea – and I mean, no ifs, no buts, fully opposed.

I don't think as a community that we've shown we can support games while splitting our attention across multiple characters. In fact, all of the evidence up to this point has shown the exact opposite. I don't think it's worth endangering what we have here – a formula that is working – to indulge secondary ideas people have that they aren't committed to enough to drop their primary characters to pursue.


Well, I suppose Chow Yun-Castle had a good run.

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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Retired
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Red breasted booby.

...heh, booby.


What's the scariest type of insect?
A booby.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Morden Man
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Well, I suppose Chow Yun-Castle had a good run.



'My name is @Simple Unicycle, king of kings;
Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair!'
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by mickilennial
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For the record, I never meant open up secondary characters now. We've got a good thing here. Good momentum. And no core built up enough to justify it. Season 2 or Season 3? Yeah. I'd suggest opening it up then and only then. We've got a decent window for stories here and we should stick to it.
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by AndyC
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Put me down as being opposed to the second character idea – and I mean, no ifs, no buts, fully opposed.

I don't think as a community that we've shown we can support games while splitting our attention across multiple characters. In fact, all of the evidence up to this point has shown the exact opposite. I don't think it's worth endangering what we have here – a formula that is working – to indulge secondary ideas people have that they aren't committed to enough to drop their primary characters to pursue.


Heh, that isn't even the half of it. I've had to bite my tongue and hold off on like eight different RP concepts since this one started.
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by mickilennial
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Heh, that isn't even the half of it. I've had to bite my tongue and hold off on like eight different RP concepts since this one started.

I've pretty much put the Gotham game we were planning on indefinite production hell/pause. So, I feel you.
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Nib
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Got a post up. Not that happy with it, but I got it up in time.
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Retired
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For the record, I never meant open up secondary characters now. We've got a good thing here. Good momentum. And no core built up enough to justify it. Season 2 or Season 3? Yeah. I'd suggest opening it up then and only then. We've got a decent window for stories here and we should stick to it.


Season two is only a month away. It's not like that's a significant amount of time for things to change and be better suited for multiple characters per player.

I think Morden nailed it on the head when he said that historically, evidence shows that additional POVs are too tempting for too little yield. It's the same thing I said a little over a month ago when I brought it up. It distracts from constant posting in the majority of cases and encourages players to divide their attention. All of which easily sends us tumbling down the usual hole of players backing out, unable to commit to the deadline, or holding up other players. And subsequently leading to the death of the game.

And, really, why do we need that? Aside from people having other concepts they want to try out, what real purpose does it serve in this game to allow secondary characters in the future?

I am personally very much of the mindset that as soon as secondary or villainous PCs are enabled, that's when we are signing this game's death warrant. There are proven to be far more downsides than benefits, and I'd hate for this thing to die as soon as the second season begins.
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Master Bruce
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If I were further along with my Batman story and were finishing the season with even half of my arcs done, I've made it no secret that I'd be throwing in an application for Daredevil. But I haven't, the season's gonna be over next month, and I still have too many stories to tell with Bruce. So on a personal level alone, I couldn't rightly endorse a second character slot anytime soon. Getting Byrd and Morden in as co-writers was the only way that I could keep The Surfer arc going.

As a GM, however, I feel obligated to take any and all opinions on the subject into consideration before making a final decision. If a decent argument could be made to allow them, I might be able to be swayed. But I don't think Morden's point is really arguable, right now. We're still too fresh of a game, and with the season's end looming and the beginning of Year Two right around the corner, it still feels too early. I doubt that'll change in a few weeks' time.

Now, opening up villain PCs for Year Two is something I'm a little more willing to engage. It'd require that already committed players drop their characters, but I do understand that not everyone thrives on playing a good guy. Though, I also get that committed villains are a rare commodity in these games.

But yeah. Those are my thoughts. No official decree or anything, but I definitely lean towards supporting Morden's opposition. We're doing good, and we have to preserve that. If that means letting concepts for other characters go in favor of a singular focus, so be it. You gotta be able to commit to making concepts stick, and that starts with what you got.
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Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Byrd Man
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villainous PCs are enabled,


I'm going to disagree with that comment. I want to play a villain. It's a lot more interesting to be a villain protagonist. Problem is, a lot of people have to be attached to the hip to whatever hero the villain is paired with. When done right, ala Spectacular Foes of Spider-Man or Secret Six, they can be done right. But since when have RPers done things right?
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by mickilennial
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Given all of the story beats that are required to go through by the end of September, I have little doubt that this season may last longer than we have planned it to.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Mao Mao
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Wait, are you guys talking about playing a second character or supporting characters?
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Byrd Man
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Wait, are you guys talking about playing a second character or supporting characters?


...

Are you ignoring the last few pages of the OOC thread?
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Master Bruce
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Wait, are you guys talking about playing a second character or supporting characters?


Playing a second character.

There are no restrictions on supporting characters, really.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Simple Unicycle
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Honestly, I feel like I'm getting close to the end of Frank's personal arc. He's found his purpose, and that's to bring justice to the criminals the law can't - or just doesn't - touch. I might be able to wrap up things nice and neat at the end of the season, or sometime early in season two, without having to just kill him off so that I can switch to the Question (who, I feel, has a lot of potential from what I've been secretly cooking up). We can all just assume Frank's doing spectacular feats of gunplay in the background. And hey, if secondary characters do become a thing, then I can have the best of both worlds and do both.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by mickilennial
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I think Morden nailed it on the head when he said that historically, evidence shows that additional POVs are too tempting for too little yield. It's the same thing I said a little over a month ago when I brought it up. It distracts from constant posting in the majority of cases and encourages players to divide their attention. All of which easily sends us tumbling down the usual hole of players backing out, unable to commit to the deadline, or holding up other players. And subsequently leading to the death of the game.

And, really, why do we need that? Aside from people having other concepts they want to try out, what real purpose does it serve in this game to allow secondary characters in the future?

At the end of the day it depends on how many players we have and how much time they have to commit to different concepts. But at the end of the day, we're in this to test out concepts in a quasi-concurrent fanfiction enviroment. This isn't a linear RP where stalls with other characters endanger the RP's momentum in quite the same way. I don't disagree with you and Morden in that it divides player attention – but eventually players are going to have divided attention anyway. What's stopping people from doing other RP's if they are disallowed from experimenting? I already have a large schedule when it comes to hobby writing so I won't be doing it, but just like food for thought.

This game has the momentum we didn't have in other games, not because we are limited to one character (though I'm not ruling it out as a contributing factor) but rather we were missing marque members of the Hype and RPG community that made these games work in 2013 and earlier. We've never really respected the games to give the time it needed outside of very few exceptions. Again, I'm not saying open up the concept of secondary characters now or even in October. But supporting the playerbase and their expressive want to experiment is probably a good idea in the end run.

I'm just not convinced that secondary characters or villain POVs is a bad idea in itself. It's just timing, motivation, and dumb luck. We've just had a long run of unfortunate consequences in the past.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Retired
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<Snipped quote by Retired>

I'm going to disagree with that comment. I want to play a villain. It's a lot more interesting to be a villain protagonist. Problem is, a lot of people have to be attached to the hip to whatever hero the villain is paired with. When done right, ala Spectacular Foes of Spider-Man or Secret Six, they can be done right. But since when have RPers done things right?


You're right in that villainous protags can and tend to be more interesting and fun to play. I should have worded that final portion better when I said what point do they serve; that was more referring to secondary characters. However, that problem you mention is the biggest obstacle. No matter how interesting, no matter how fun, it won't matter once a player gets hung up on an arc because the other player who wrote a major villain disappeared on them. I fully recognize that there are some who could handle this, but the vast majority of the time this problem becomes reality. And as much as it sucks to limit those who may be able to handle it, I honestly feel it's better for the game to do so in order to prevent such scenarios.
Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Byrd Man
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I can switch to the Question (who, I feel, has a lot of potential from what I've been secretly cooking up).


Hidden 6 yrs ago Post by Simple Unicycle
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<Snipped quote by Simple Unicycle>



Don't taunt me Byrd, I know you're already filling the low budget detective character slot.
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<Snipped quote by Byrd Man>

Don't taunt me Byrd, I know you're already filling the low budget detective character slot.


Season two, we're gonna have a Q-off. Me and you, boy.
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