Since the actual cinema thread is long gone, I'll just post here.

Saw "The Menu" last night. It's about a bunch of rich/popular people + foodies that get invited to a super expensive restaurant on an island when things don't go exactly as planned for them. You'll get what I mean if you ever do watch it. Anyway. I thought the film was fine, decent even, but it does seem to sputter out halfway through. It starts off pretty great only to end off a "well, it's okay enough to watch" IMO.

Doing a rewatch of the MCU + the shows I've been slacking on watching. So far I've finished:

- Captain America 1
- Iron Man 1 + 2
- Captain Marvel
- some of Agent Carter

I'm trying to watch them in timeline order, not so much "phases". But I'm kind of bouncing around a bit because I didn't start Agent Carter much later, though it's before the first Avengers so I need to watch it anyway.

Really into 'The Rookie'.
It's a clever take on the police procedural. It does unique things like some of the scenes are shot as though through the officers' body cams or dash cams. The teaser at the start of every episode tends to have the best of randomness in what the officers are dealing with.

The characters are well done. It's the first show I've watched I think, where a character who at first seemed like a jerk and least favourite, I turned my opinion around of him as the show let us get to know him, and now he's one of my favourites.

Also getting through Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Roughly 2 and a half seasons to go. I had tuned into it when it first aired, but kept getting interrupted when it was on and I fell out of tuning in. Then just last year, after watching all the MCU movies on Disney+, but other Marvel and some D.C. fare, we checked out S.H.I.E.L.D. and were binging until we paused for the holidays.

That show is slick! I think the Framework plot was the most so (so far).

Oh, and also into 'Pretty Hard Cases', it's a procedural dramedy about two female cops - they're just great. Appealing soundtrack across the episodes, too. That one's a Canadian production, so if you're American you probably wouldn't have heard of it as to my knowledge it doesn't play on your stations. It kind of busts some norms, like stereotypes and stuff. For instance in the first season, there was a white lady who was into criminal activity. She had a biracial son, and it was the black grandmother who was the stable force in the boy's life. And when the cops went to bust some drug manufactuers, the majority of them were white. The comedy lands most of the time.

I've also been going through X-Men animated series, like the original. Found the Anime on Netflix just in time (it's not on there, now), and I lucked out just the other night finding an excellent site that has all the episodes of X-Men Evolution in proper quality!

Puss In Boots: The Last Wish is cute and occasionally amusing.

Wouldn't exactly call it a masterpiece. But at least it's not incredibly boring like the original...

Four episodes in, and Andor is kind of a mess. Better than shit like Moon Knight (and likely anything else they’ve ever made) by a mile. But I’d be hard pressed to call it anything special. There’s nice shots and the set design can be nice. But then the CGI is ugly, and you can always tell when the characters are standing in front of a green screen. (Though it’s passable enough to use your suspension of disbelief.) The acting is a bit wooden, and the dialogue is rarely interesting or clever. The plot is plain and obvious. (Being predictable in a bad way.) Yet several scenes don’t make a whole lot of sense either. (Usually when the conflict is supposed to happen.) And even the ends of each episode feel like the creators didn’t know how to end them satisfyingly. (Or at least on a cliffhanger that made you want to keep watching.) Though I wouldn’t simply call it “boring”. Like I’ve seen so many others claim it to be. Not that the show’s own lines, like “must everything be so boring and sad”, do it any favors...

But for its attempt to be a gritty show with consequences and gravity “because the protag kills two guys, and those deaths really truly matter.” (Rings a little hollow, after he blew up a dozen more people and didn’t care.) So I can only assume it's like a 10 hour version of Rogue One, where the ending is “everyone dies and it becomes ‘adult’ in its body count alone.”

Edit: Tried to watch Scooby-Doo! Mystery Incorporated for the hell of it. (Because Velma.) Since it's so highly reviewed. And um...I guess it's so ridiculous that it can be amusing at times? But it feels like Ryan Johnson wrote these characters. Because it's being praised for being well developed. When they're somehow even more one-dimensional than before, and everyone but Scooby was made to be stupid and unlikeable. (Because that's clever...somehow...)

Velma is so bad that every side of the culture socio-political spectrum can hate it for different but also valid reasons. Thanks, Velma, for bringing people together to make fun of your genuine awfulness.

Velma is so bad that every side of the culture socio-political spectrum can hate it for different but also valid reasons. Thanks, Velma, for bringing people together to make fun of your genuine awfulness.

I checked it a few days ago and the show was resting at 10% on Rotten Tomatoes. By the time I woke up the next day it dropped to 7% audience rating. Literally any place you look (Metacritic, IMDb, Google User reviews, etc.) there isn't a lick of goodwill towards it.

<Snipped quote by Fabricant451>

I checked it a few days ago and the show was resting at 10% on Rotten Tomatoes. By the time I woke up the next day it dropped to 7% audience rating. Literally any place you look (Metacritic, IMDb, Google User reviews, etc.) there isn't a lick of goodwill towards it.

I gave it the benefit of the doubt when all there was to go on were character designs. But like within three minutes into the first episode I was regretting even trying to give it a fair shake. It is so bad and worse it thinks it's being clever with constant wink and nods to tropes and references but none of them work at all. It's like those "And then Deadpool walks in!" Reddit posts except written by Twitter.

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@Fabricant451 What fun new movies are you looking forward to this year? John Wick 4, Trolls 3, Insidious 5, Spiderman 2, Another f*cking internet found footage movie, The Nun 2, The Meg 2, Insert every marvel and DC movie here, Mission Impossible, Hunger Games, Indiana Jones, Transformers...(I could keep going.)

But more seriously, is there anything you're actually expecting to be of excellent quality?

Going to bat for Multiverse of Madness are we? Man, you'll argue contrarian for just about anything, won't ya?

Except I'm not going to bat for Multiverse of Madness. I'm going to bat for Everything Everywhere All At Once.

That's nice. But I want good movies.

And whatever one considers "well received", doesn't exactly make it good, nor worth the multi-millions that it cost to produce.

Audiences loved Minions 2. So did the box office. Which one do you think a studio cares about when weighing the worth of what it costs to produce. I'm sure the critical and audience reception (both generally positive) is what they care about and not the fact that it was the fifth highest grossing movie of 2022 and almost made a billion dollars on an 80 million budget.

Yes, I alone think this.

And the way you described how they'd make the movie (by making a few random references with '''an elf''' guy) already sounds terrible enough. Though I'd bet all the money imaginable, that it wouldn't even be *that* well versed in the end product.

I said the elf part because that's how Link and the Hylians have been described and why they have pointy ears. Because they are elf-like. And if you show anyone who doesn't know anything about Zelda a picture of Link they will call him an elf. Because he has elf ears. Because they're elf-like. The original game had its scenario writer and director inspired by Tolkein. For all intents and purposes, Link is an elf and calling him a Hylian in the movie won't change that everyone will just go "oh he's an elf guy".

@Fabricant451 What fun new movies are you looking forward to this year? John Wick 4, Trolls 3, Insidious 5, Spiderman 2, Another f*cking internet found footage movie, The Nun 2, The Meg 2, Insert every marvel and DC movie here, Mission Impossible, Hunger Games, Indiana Jones, Transformers...(I could keep going.)

But more seriously, is there anything you're actually expecting to be of excellent quality?

I get that you're trying to make a statement on movies not being fun or new because sequels but unironically yes I am looking forward to John Wick 4, Mission Impossible 7, and at least one Marvel movie and it's not the one that's out next month or the one after that and also Spiderverse 2. I don't even like any of the other franchises you mentioned other than I like two Indiana Jones movie but don't really care to see a fifth one. You also forgot Fast and Furious 10.

But to answer the second part, I think Mission Impossible is the best present American action franchise so I fully expect that 7 to be just as great as 4, 5, and 6 have been. John Wick is reliably enjoyable. I'd be shocked if I give any MCU movie over 3/5 other than the one I am hyped for for personal reasons, but a 3/5 movie is totally watchable.

As for what I think to be of excellent quality, other than Mission Impossible 7 I can list a few, sure.

-Oppenheimer
-Beau is Afraid
-Next Goal Wins
-Dune Part 2
-Killers of the Flower Moon
-Barbie
-Chevalier
-Polite Society (admittedly the trailer made me less optimistic but eh)
-Pain Hustlers
-Creed 3
-Asteroid City
-Inside
-Havoc
-Finestkind
-The Killer

The thing is it's hard to judge upcoming movies so early in the year because apart from the franchise stuff that you mentioned, which studios obviously put the focus on because money makes things spin, most stuff kinda just comes out with little fanfare other than word of mouth. Half the stuff I listed is on there because I like the director (Wes Anderson, David Fincher, Greta Gerwig, Ari Aster, Christopher Nolan, Martin Scorsese) and they have a higher chance of putting out something I continue to like. But my favorite movies of any given year are never the big blockbuster stuff, I just enjoy a popcorn movie. I can watch something like Broker or Red Rocket at home and be fine but a movie like Avatar 2 or, yes, Multiverse of Madness (which was textbook mehhhh) are enhanced by the theater experience. I generally try to see smaller movies in theaters too but that's getting harder and harder these days for reasons both personal and because my theater doesn't have as many screens anymore and so prioritize the money makers but that's a whole other conversation.

I don't think franchise movies are bad. In some cases I think they can still be genuinely great (like Mission Impossible). I am well aware that this year has an abundance of franchise movies but that's what happens when you have delays and such finally catching up. Ideally the fucking drought that was last year's theatrical releases leading to fucking Top Gun being in theaters for like 9 months will convince studios to put shit out. Either way, I doubt I'll even watch any of the DC movies in theaters because who gives a fuck now that James Gunn is trying to salvage it for like the third time.

Except I'm not going to bat for Multiverse of Madness. I'm going to bat for Everything Everywhere All At Once.

Since we both posted about that movie in this thread. I'll assume you're in on the gag, and already realize that multiple movies had used the multiverse shtick this year.

But I already know that I didn't have the same overwhelming positive reaction that others did with Everything Everywhere All At Once. Though I at least understood the appeal. Unlike other "masterpieces" like 'The Northman'.

Which one do you think a studio cares about when weighing the worth of what it costs to produce.

To avoid arguing against the same fallacious 'argumentum ad populum' that I already know won't stay consistent. (Since no one universally believes "well this is popular, well this is profitable, so it can't be criticized/poor in quality" once its something *you* don't like.)

I wouldn't claim all studios are the same. But some don't even seem to care about making money, nor critical and audience reception. (And not only those "we'll get a tax break, if we fail" kind of movies/scam projects.)

Though Illumination Entertainment's goal is obvious from the movies they make. And the reception of their movies (looking at places like IMBD) is on a downward trend. So since it's their studio making the hypothetical movie we were discussing. I want to know if you think they'd actually make a good Legend Of Zelda adaption? Or is the argument that they'd make a profitable movie?

I get that you're trying to make a statement on movies not being new, because sequels.

It's almost cliché to point out that Hollywood has no original ideas, and only continues to abuse the same trends. So yeah, I'm not exactly alone in feeling burnt out.

But, I'm human too. John Wick and Spiderverse still have my interest as well. I'm just not expecting much out of them.

And aside from a few long-standing creatives like Christopher Nolan creating Oppenheimer, with a star-studded cast. I don't think I've even heard of most of those movies. (And I'd wager the same is true for most people in general.) Since its seems more and more movies come out with little fanfare. Maybe because fewer people are watching online ads?

All I'm saying, as an admitted cynic, while I'd imagine the quantity has only increased for movies and shows alike. (And perhaps it's not unique for Hollywood that there's more bad products, than good ones.) The decreasing tolerance for (and ability to engage with) basic criticism, is at an all time low on the internet. (But this is more obnoxious in the gaming space. So I'll leave it at that.)

Point being, I'm sure you would not be the only one using The Minions Movie of all things to defend the idea of another video game movie adaption being produced. But for me, that only adds on to this feeling.

<Snipped quote by Fabricant451>
Since we both posted about that movie in this thread. I'll assume you're in on the gag, and already realize that multiple movies had used the multiverse shtick this year.

Damn I knew I should've said Beavis and Butthead Do the Universe. Foiled by my own pretentiousness

To avoid arguing against the same fallacious 'argumentum ad populum' that I already know won't stay consistent. (Since no one universally believes "well this is popular, well this is profitable, so it can't be criticized/poor in quality" once its something *you* don't like.)

I wouldn't claim all studios are the same. But some don't even seem to care about making money, nor critical and audience reception. (And not only those "we'll get a tax break, if we fail" kind of movies/scam projects.)

Though Illumination Entertainment's goal is obvious from the movies they make. And the reception of their movies (looking at places like IMBD) is on a downward trend. So since it's their studio making the hypothetical movie we were discussing. I want to know if you think they'd actually make a good Legend Of Zelda adaption? Or is the argument that they'd make a profitable movie?

I'm gonna let you in on a little secret: I've never even fuckin' seen an Illumination movie, I just know of them because Minions are unfortunately a thing and Minions 2 was a meme but also a profitable one. That said, would they be my first choice? No, but my first choice would likely be a 2D animation studio because I prefer it, or at least something more visually creative like Into the Spiderverse. Illumination movies are generally safe which is fine if a little uninspired and it makes sense why a company as notoriously protective of its IP would go with them.

I can't make a qualitative statement on Illumination movies but I don't see why they couldn't make a good Legend of Zelda adaptation because as a studio they clearly have talented animators. I think the Mario movie will be fine and I have no reason to think their hypothetical Zelda movie would be anything less than that. Whether or not that translates to good is up to the individual. It is undeniable they'd make a profitable one and something tells me that that was what motivated Nintendo to work with them on Mario.

So yes I think they could make a good Zelda adaptation but I would prefer any other studio. I just like to give things a fair shake even if I acknowledge that some decisions from studios are made with not the best intentions for quality.

It's almost cliché to point out that Hollywood has no original ideas, and only continues to abuse the same trends. So yeah, I'm not exactly alone in feeling burnt out.

But, I'm human too. John Wick and Spiderverse still have my interest as well. I'm just not expecting much out of them.

And aside from a few long-standing creatives like Christopher Nolan creating Oppenheimer, with a star-studded cast. I don't think I've even heard of most of those movies. (And I'd wager the same is true for most people in general.) Since its seems more and more movies come out with little fanfare. Maybe because fewer people are watching online ads?

It's because, and this is surely going to add to the cynicism, with more and more studios being owned by bigger companies, they will spend assloads of money to make sure that tentpole and franchise pictures get engagement. Social media clicks, trailer views, ads during sporting events. Ant-Man is out in like four weeks and like two weeks after it comes out the machine will turn to Guardians of the Galaxy 3. It's less that movies come out with little fanfare and more that studios will bet on a sure thing. Horror movies cost less (generally) to make and so can spend more on advertising. This is why most times when people see the Best Picture nominees it's like "I have heard of two of these movies what the fuck?".

The deeper problem is that franchise movies will box out smaller movies, especially if you live in a smaller town. It is not uncommon for a movie theater to have like nothing but Marvel movies all day and then like three screenings of something else at like 10 pm. And with the rise of streaming services, studios are also trying their hand at 'limited release then immediately to streaming' but that's only serving to make customers not see the movies period because to most normal people 'streaming service' starts with Netflix and stops with maybe Amazon Prime.

I love movies I just kinda hate the system that produces them. But I'm fortunate enough to live in an area where I can see the big dumb blockbusters on a big dumb screen and still have a theater where they show the quality shit that makes me remember why I studied the fucking things in the first place.

All I'm saying, as an admitted cynic, while I'd imagine the quantity has only increased for movies and shows alike. (And perhaps it's not unique for Hollywood that there's more bad products, than good ones.) The decreasing tolerance for (and ability to engage with) basic criticism, is at an all time low on the internet. (But this is more obnoxious in the gaming space. So I'll leave it at that.)

Believe me I've been the film cynic. But I also got real tired and exhausted with the poor state of film criticism/analysis and media literacy on the internet and social media that I basically turned into a debate lord over fuckin films for a while (and still kinda do but believe me I used to be worse) because I care a lot that it pained me to have people start trying to objectively state when movies were bad or good or shit like that.

And like I don't care if people don't like a movie (even if sometimes I get aggro but hey who doesn't defend the things they love...other than sane people) but I also want to stress to people that it's not all bad. There are good movies out there!

Point being, I'm sure you would not be the only one using The Minions Movie of all things to defend the idea of another video game movie adaption being produced. But for me, that only adds on to this feeling.

I think video game adaptations in general are kinda dumb even if I liked those Sonic movies especially because way too many western games are still chasing this weird 'video games as cinematic experience' high where like obviously the first episode of The Last of Us will be well received, the game was basically 50 percent watching it anyway!

>I wrote this yesterday while I was half asleep and never posted it.

I'm gonna let you in on a little secret: I've never even fuckin' seen an Illumination movie.

I can't make a qualitative statement on Illumination movies, but I don't see why they couldn't make a good Legend of Zelda adaptation because as a studio they clearly have talented animators. I think the Mario movie will be fine and I have no reason to think their hypothetical Zelda movie would be anything less than that.

I don't know if I've ever been impressed with Illumination's animation. (It's not ever been particularly strong.) But you couldn't call them anything other than savvy businessmen. So I understand and can relate, that my own limited viewing experience means I can't say for 100% certain whether a movie will be good or not. I'd simply state that pattern recognition makes me less positive/enthused about the idea. (But the Mario movie will probably be the answer to whether or not it gets made. Regardless of who makes it.)

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I love movies. I just kinda hate the system that produces them. But I'm fortunate enough to live in an area where I can see the big dumb blockbusters on a big dumb screen and still have a theater where they show the quality shit that makes me remember why I studied the fucking things in the first place.

I won't even pretend that movies are my main source of entertainment. I'm a weeb at heart, and I'm still always behind on the "I need to watch this" trend. (If anything, it's only saved me a whole hell of a lot of wasted time.) Especially nowadays, where supposedly great shows (1899 for one instance) have been getting the early axe. (Or this trend of finished things getting cancelled before they're even released.)

I'd say the one positive trend thus far, is how foreign movies and shows are starting to become more popular. (Yeah, the weeb would say that.) Though RRR was probably my Everything Everywhere All At Once. But all the ones I did watch, were certainly far more entertaining and likable than any of the western media I consumed.

But that's neither here nor there.

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But I got really tired and exhausted with the poor state of film criticism. I basically turned into a debate lord over fuckin films for a while. (And still kinda do, but believe me I used to be worse, because I care a lot that it pained me to have people start trying to objectively state when movies were bad or good or shit like that.)

And like, I don't care if people don't like a movie (even if sometimes I get aggro, but hey who doesn't defend the things they love.) But I also want to stress to people that it's not all bad. There are good movies out there!

I think video game adaptations in general are kinda dumb, even if I liked those Sonic movies. Especially because way too many western games are still chasing this weird 'video games as cinematic experience' high. Where the first episode of The Last of Us will be well received, the game was basically 50 percent watching it anyway!

Objectivity aside. I know that merely pointing out flaws and problems with anything is easy to do. Thus, the poorest of critics do tend to have most of their work handed to them on a silver platter. Though I'd love to see more in-depth counter discussion, versus what still tends to happen. (Usually outright dismissal.) I just wish this "7/10 IGN means barely playable" mindset wasn't so normalized in film too. To the point where Zoomers' word for I dislike this/something bad is "Mid".

#MakeAverageMeanWhatIt'sSupposedToMean

And ‘The Last Of Us’ showrunners, telling actors not to look up or be familiar with the source material they're making the show from, tells me all I would need to know. If I want zombies. The Walking Dead has sixteen billion seasons for me to watch already.

I honestly can't stand this ongoing trend of "we don't like or care about the things we're adapting" shtick. (And I'm usually not even the target for their nostalgia traps.) But I still can't help but question why they continue to do it so blatantly. (I can only imagine we have a staggering number of Tommy Wiseau's in modern entertainment. Where inflated egos and personal drive defy all common sense to make products they genuinely believe to be hot sh*t.)

RRR was so good it made me want to punch British people

I love that a movie where a dude shoves a buttplug trophy up his ass and a dog is used as a flail weapon has the most Oscar nominations of the year including Best Picture

Movies are fucking dumb I love them

Oppenheimer does look sick as fuck

I've been rewatching a lot of Star Trek, and got caught up on Strange New Worlds and Lower Decks.

I watched You People and I know the year just started but that's a real front runner for the worst shit I'll see all year

The plot summary just made me consider a rapid violent headarectomy.

It looks horrible. I'm sorry you put yourself through that. You deserve better. Probably. Maybe. Fuck I don't know, but no one deserves that.

Yesterday I watched Bullet Train.

What a fun fucking movie. It's no masterpiece but I liked it, the choreography was good, humor was good, the "fate" theme came together while watching it (some of it pointed out with a heavy hand and some just subtle things you have to find yourself). Worth a watch if you're into silly action movies.

Finally watched the 2nd Avatar this weekend in theaters. Both visually and in regards to the setting the movie is stellar, but the writing is the weakest link to the entire movie, I feel. It's a 3 hour film with no resolution and almost feels like a slog fest at times.