Death of the genre

[Dion]

I know, I know, people have felt like this for ages and pure TTRPG players probably thought PbP forum roleplaying was cringe and would kill TTRPG, but I'm noticing a distinct shift in the PbP forums I visit:

• Forums are dying at an alarming rate, it used to be if a forum died it was a big deal, now it happens every week
• Surviving forums are slowly losing activity
• Most forums are arguably populated by the same community
  ^{I see people there that I also see here, it feels a little incestuous}
• A lot of the 1x1 advertisements now revolve around Discord roleplaying or Reddit roleplaying

I'm kind of curious how others have sought to cement themselves in PbP forum roleplaying? Or maybe some of you have given up and just hang out here for nostalgia's sake, and you do your Roleplaying on discord? Or is my vision just wrong and are RP forums doing better than ever?

[rabidbacon]

Out of curiosity, what do you mean by genre?
To me, I'd say, it's a bit more like... the death of a platform. Not that I'm saying this platform is dead, just saying that I think that the genre is very much alive, especially with the increase of interest in TTRPGs.

Just a few scattered thoughts:

Personally, Discord RPing and Forum RPing feels very similar to me - the only difference is the ability to format posts in a more customized way using BBCode. I usually write around four to seven or more paragraphs, and this length does well in both Discord and Forums.

Writing on mobile is way more manageable on the Discord app than on the mobile version of a website.

One-liner RPers might like the speed of Discord more, as the responses feel very real-time. I can also see the appeal of OOC chat in Discord servers.

I suspect that some Discord RP communities can also feel "incestuous", if you're in more niche fandoms.

Reddit roleplaying is something I have never considered or tried, and it seems like a terrible platform to write a long, continuous story on. I am curious to know how popular this is, and why it's popular, at least based on your observations.

All that said, I'm actually here for the specific RPs I've found on this site. It feels like Discord RPing revolves more around fandom-type stuff, and in forums like here, there's a bit more opportunity for original settings and characters to flourish.

[Carlyle]

Forums are an unfortunate casualty of the modern era shift towards Discord and other such apps for roleplaying, hence why advertisements are pushing more for those platforms. That being said, there is still a small effort to keep them alive--Jcink forums being a common example.

[BrokenPromise]

The fighting game genre is dying. Old fandoms are dying. The Tumblr art community is dying.

I think the reason why topics like this cause me to roll my eyes is because I have plenty of stuff to keep me busy. I'm running two group RPs, participating in a third albeit slower moving one, and I have a few 1x1 RPs going on. Despite this, I still come across a lot of stuff I could conceivably join. I do not visit other forums as I can barely keep up with what I do with this one. While you'd be crazy to not acknowledge that forums and forum roleplays are getting more niche, suggesting that they are "dying" implies that interest in them is going to all but evaporate.

There's a few reasons for their decline. We have discord, roll20, and tons of other platforms for RPing. And while they all do what they do well, they aren't a perfect replacement for PbP RPing. Discord has too many irritations for me to ever consider seriously writing on it, and acting out your character spontaneously in roll 20 isn't the same as writing and reading posts. So long as nothing works quite like PbP, it will never be replaced.

There is a second part of this discussion, which is the people who keep insisting that PbP is dying. I've noticed it's always someone who primarily RPs in 1x1 stuff. As someone who's tried both I can say that it can be difficult to find a 1x1 partner to write with. I even joke that the 1x1 section is the place to go when you feel like hating yourself. What makes for a good group interest check make for a horrible 1x1 interest check. Group roleplayers want to know that their GM has an idea of what the hell they are doing and would love to participate in some well constructed world with understandable rules. But 1x1 players typically want something that caters to their specific tastes. Having page after page of reference material will cause their eyes to glaze over as they back out of your interest check and look for something they can have more influence on. They want to be involved with the creation process and help decide how the bricks are laid.

Or they're gooners.

As for how I cement myself, I guess it's a combination of understanding what everyone wants and also a willingness to try things that aren't 100% in my wheelhouse. Magical girls are actually not something that I prefer to write about all the time, but I let my friends drag me into RPs and we end up having fun regardless.

[Lith]

Ancient topic beaten to death.

Truth is simple. In the earlier 00's, social media wasn't such an overwhelming force. Centralization of the internet wasn't either. Nor were smart phone apps, containerized internet experiences and the like. All that's happened now and trends for what people tend to do on the internet have changed.

Traditional forums, BBS and the like, have seen a massive spiral. Only the biggest ones, usually the type peddling products of piracy, still have real activity and have gobble monstered many thousands of their lesser variants that saw life "in the day." Then of that, a fraction still are RP oriented. In that, you typically see the ones with any "active" status be things like erotica.

Notice how many people coming here mention "I came from Discord RP" or "I came from Reddit."

It's just how things have trended. Doesn't help what lingers on in the pbp RP space is battered with nonstop pop-politics wagon dragging and nonsensical clique based drama, there isn't exactly a great "mentorship program" to onboard and keep the concept thriving for new generations.

Even with all this, it's still around and alive. I don't anticipate forum based roleplay will truly disappear anytime soon. Once people stop bellyaching about LLMs, I imagine that'll end up driving some minor growth into the space, if not here then elsewhere. Otherwise it'll retain its niche status until something technological makes barrier of entry such less significant in effort that more people poke at it.

Myself, I write when I want to write and don't when I don't. I only first came here to make fun of LeeRoy for losing in the Arena. Shock and amazement my extremely slow-burn RP on here is currently in the Arena, dealing with not one or two but nine disgruntled adults RP fighting. I see RPG as a fusion of roleplay on the forums and a conduit for collaboration on Discord but, doubt the sweaty arena stuff'll ever not be my focus.

TLDR: There's no perfect solution to any of this, just write.

[POOHEAD189]

I would give a more nuanced take, but I like my RPs atm and currently have some good partners like usual. I guess it's never been difficult for me to find people.

[Shu]

+

Just one time I would like to read a thread on general discussion of RP where someone does not throw shade at or even intensely grind an axe at 1x1 RP and spew the whole “group RP master race” pitch. (Seriously, it is as old as “are forums dead now?” if not older.”

I have been in group RP’s and I have been in 1x1 RP’s and I enjoy them both. Both have their pros and cons. Both can be great enjoyment when done right and also a dumpster fire when done wrong. People have their preferences and all. And while I do appreciate both group and 1x1 RP as I said I have seen more group RP’s go straight to the hells faster than most 1x1’s I have had on my plate.

Rather off-topic miniature rant over. ☕️🫖

[Lith]

@Shu

Gwahahaha

That's because those types tend to be involved with eRP focused 1x1 themselves and are self-loathing, so they project unto others.

In their insecurity they also feel better about their middling writing if they dump on what comes across to them as "easy targets." We have a nice, sizable chunk of third-rate losers here who stalk the interest checks and insult the topic creators or make shitposts aimed at them.

That, I wouldn't associate with activity in the medium dropping. It's always been common to have that type even when PBP RP was much healthier. Though it is unfortunate.

[BrokenPromise]

@Shu@Lith

I think the real reason 1x1 gets dunked on so much is because of the high turnover rate. A group RP can be expected to make it to the first few rounds of posts or even last a month or two in most cases. But in 1x1 it's pretty frequent to just have people ghost on you during the planning phase. It requires a different approach than group RP does, and different expectations too. Hence why I think it's always 1x1 RPers who question the health of the site/pbp/genre/etc.

[Lith]

Sure, one's preference will color their perspective. As an oldhead in things similar to this place's Arena before I ever looked at RPG, mine is that RP is like entering ancient ruins. And the excavating party has some zoomer going "but it's dead, and old!" in the back. You gotta crack him upside the mouth. He won't shut up about it.

And yet I think 1x1 in planning phase is rather active, at least compared to some other focuses.

I also don't think the insults aimed at it, or the goon squads stalking interest checks and dropping shitty one-liners while laugh reacting to posts, stem from a turnover rate problem.

Seems to me it tends to be people with questionable browser histories wanting to mock newcomers, of course suggestions of fetish content, and again that predatory urge since well. Easier to attack one person than an entire group now isn't it.

[Lexisheeps]

Forum boards, in general, aren't really a dying breed. Forums are just no longer growing in popularity.

One might claim that social media is the cause, but I don't think that's it at all.

I think the internet is overwhelmed with ✨ cool ✨ places to hangout.

So any potential userbase is already stretched very thin, as people find- or have already found, their preferred spot.

On a more personal level, I think Discord and Reddit are trashy af hangouts.

Discord has severe security issues and Reddit is a constant dumpster fire full of stupidity and clap backs trying to boost fragile egos.

Well, I mean... to each their own. But give me a slightly dead forum board any day, over other forms of social media.

With that all said, I haven't had any problems getting or starting roleplays here. There's been a few duds, for sure, but that hasn't discouraged me from playing.

[Letter Bee]

With all due respect, if someone like me, who isn't exactly the most-liked among some RP Circles here (and I admit I brought it on myself), can get enough players to keep a Group RP alive for two years and three months (and still ongoing), then the genre/platform/hobby isn't dying.

So, no, Forum RP isn't dying. My own game could use more activity due to some players being stalled by IRL matters (heatwaves, hurricanes, and stuff like that), but Forum RP as a whole isn't dying.

[Richard Horthy]

Forum RP is dead and we killed it.

[Carlyle]

Forum RP is dead and we killed it.

@Richard Horthy

ok yam

[Richard Horthy]

<Snipped quote by Richard Horthy>

ok yam

@Kuro

Bow before me, Murderer of Forum RPs

[Mole]

Maybe, you just need to change your attitude.

[mickilennial]

I'm kind of curious how others have sought to cement themselves in PbP forum roleplaying? Or maybe some of you have given up and just hang out here for nostalgia's sake, and you do your Roleplaying on discord? Or is my vision just wrong and are RP forums doing better than ever?

@Dion

Play-By-Post Role-Playing Message Boards have been on the downcline since the late 2010s due to a shift in how young writers engage with the internet.

We are in a sort of fanfiction boom, but play-by-post in itself (as in collaborative writing) has shifted to other mediums. This is not to say message boards as a whole are dying but they are not trending upwards at the moment. Chat/IM RP is likely "king" right now, or non-forum based websites. Message Boards as a whole have always had ehbs and flows when it came to usage, but they were dominant due to their ability to be more long form than chatrooms and instant messaging software in the early post-Y2K environment. I do not think they will ever be as big as they were during the 2001-2011 window, though I am optimistic for the medium.

[Dion]

The fighting game genre is dying. Old fandoms are dying. The Tumblr art community is dying.

I think the reason why topics like this cause me to roll my eyes is because I have plenty of stuff to keep me busy. I'm running two group RPs, participating in a third albeit slower moving one, and I have a few 1x1 RPs going on. Despite this, I still come across a lot of stuff I could conceivably join. I do not visit other forums as I can barely keep up with what I do with this one. While you'd be crazy to not acknowledge that forums and forum roleplays are getting more niche, suggesting that they are "dying" implies that interest in them is going to all but evaporate.

@BrokenPromise

I do sort of understand this point but it is hard to argue with the forum visitor numbers posted for all to see on the front page that has gone down considerably from what I consider the heyday of RPG (and other forums).

It's not as if I can't find RP's if I want to - rather, it is the opposite - but moreso that the amount of fresh blood is diminishing quite heavily.

There is a second part of this discussion, which is the people who keep insisting that PbP is dying. I've noticed it's always someone who primarily RPs in 1x1 stuff. As someone who's tried both I can say that it can be difficult to find a 1x1 partner to write with. I even joke that the 1x1 section is the place to go when you feel like hating yourself. What makes for a good group interest check make for a horrible 1x1 interest check. Group roleplayers want to know that their GM has an idea of what the hell they are doing and would love to participate in some well constructed world with understandable rules. But 1x1 players typically want something that caters to their specific tastes. Having page after page of reference material will cause their eyes to glaze over as they back out of your interest check and look for something they can have more influence on. They want to be involved with the creation process and help decide how the bricks are laid.

@BrokenPromise

Again I see your point, but I used to be a group-RPer only (and even looked down on the gooners in the 1x1 section) and the experience was only different because there was a million RP's back then (granted 50% of them were a variation of (Fandom) in Equestria, but soit). I'd kill for a group RP that works for me but my tastes are no longer satisfied by "Naruto: with a twist" so I do most of my writing on other forums now -- even there, though, the issue is persistent in that group RP's tend to die extremely quickly nowadays compared to before when a bunch of no-life kids sat around writing 5 posts a day. I don't think I look for a GM that has understandable rules, but I look for a GM that can just run the RP in a way where people stick around. It doesn't have to be super well constructed if it's fun and the GM is genuinely involved, which a lot of them don't seem to be (and never were! This is a problem as old as time, but back then you'd just replace it with a different one). That's more of a critique on the GMing styles that seem to be prevalent though, and less about the platform.

Forum boards, in general, aren't really a dying breed. Forums are just no longer growing in popularity.

One might claim that social media is the cause, but I don't think that's it at all.

I think the internet is overwhelmed with ✨ cool ✨ places to hangout.

So any potential userbase is already stretched very thin, as people find- or have already found, their preferred spot.

On a more personal level, I think Discord and Reddit are trashy af hangouts.

Discord has severe security issues and Reddit is a constant dumpster fire full of stupidity and clap backs trying to boost fragile egos.

Well, I mean... to each their own. But give me a slightly dead forum board any day, over other forms of social media.

With that all said, I haven't had any problems getting or starting roleplays here. There's been a few duds, for sure, but that hasn't discouraged me from playing.

@Lexisheeps

Good points, though I think the clapbacks are very prevalent on forums too.. actually I'd say a defining feature of forums is that there's a lot of ego's running around thinking they're the best gift to man to ever do it to 'em. I prefer forums, but it's not just PbP forums that are stalling out: some of my favorite hardware forums are slowing down too and, perhaps for the better, even 4chan is sort of slowing down a lot.

<Snipped quote by Dion>
Play-By-Post Role-Playing Message Boards have been on the downcline since the late 2010s due to a shift in how young writers engage with the internet.

We are in a sort of fanfiction boom, but play-by-post in itself (as in collaborative writing) has shifted to other mediums. This is not to say message boards as a whole are dying but they are not trending upwards at the moment. Chat/IM RP is likely "king" right now, or non-forum based websites. Message Boards as a whole have always had ehbs and flows when it came to usage, but they were dominant due to their ability to be more long form than chatrooms and instant messaging software in the early post-Y2K environment. I do not think they will ever be as big as they were during the 2001-2011 window, though I am optimistic for the medium.

@mickilennial

I agree, good points: what makes you optimistic for the medium though? The idea that people will come back 'as they always do' or that after this wave of IM/Discord RP people will return to 'retro' roleplaying?

[mickilennial]

I agree, good points: what makes you optimistic for the medium though? The idea that people will come back 'as they always do' or that after this wave of IM/Discord RP people will return to 'retro' roleplaying?

@Dion

Nothing concrete in terms of metrics, more of a gut instinct due to how trends fluctuate. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'd like not to be.

[Little Bird]

Things worth some thought.

Aging Demographics? It's hard to say without grounded data, but it does generally seem that pbp is largely an undertaking sustained by people whom came up on the mid-2000s to early-2010s Internet. Time goes on; people get old; life becomes busy and stressful; people inevitably find other things to occupy their free time (new hobbies, responsibilities to others away from the computer screen). The forum scene has slowed down on account of it being time-consuming for the "adults" and maybe not as appealing to the younger folks who came up more with Discord. But who knows, Discord could bring things back around as those RPing there come to feel contained or restrained by the platform's limitations (character limits, less customization options, generally clunkier thread management).

Insular Communities & Limited Rosters. Maybe it's just me; maybe I'm sseing the past through those rose-tinted glasses; or maybe my life wxperience had left me bitter and jaded. In recent years it's become somewhat more difficult to integrate into communities and groups. Memory of times lomg gone tell me that RPing was, at a time, open to amyome that could pitch a servicable character to the stories they were interested in; times when larger numbers of players might be seen in any givem RP.

But roster spots have become fewer as GMs have preferred to keep things smaller. Given there are fewer GMs running fewer RPs, the field has definitely shrunk. Being denied a spot in RP like being passed over for a job is more of a risk these days as GMs scrutinize more. Understandably, this is a play to keep things more manageable for GMs; small player roster and fewer character=less work to keep things together and everyome on the same page.

More detrimental are the experiences of joining something and being, in some way, kept out of the collaborative process. Seeing an RP you're in steamroll past your turn to post because your at work or in a different time zone and can't post on the same schedule leaves an aftertaste if disrespect; can't say that's happened to me here personally, bit it's happened elsewhere, prompting me to check out.

Being iced in OOC discussions and planning is also a thing, and I've spoken to a few people that I shared those experiences with (in the same RPs). Being ignored or dismissed by GMs isn't an endearing situations; especially when it leads to you being blamed for that indifference. When 4-5 players out of 9-10 actively cloyster themselves from the other half within a single RP, that's a bit of an issue. I don't doubt that it happens pretty regularly to others.

Ultimately, it all kind of ties into RPers getting older. Naturally, busy adult people will be preferrable towards keeping their hobbies within circles they trust. DnD players have their play groups, MTG folks have their preferred LGS they go to. RPers have their collaborative circles. But in that vein, might as well not front otherwise and save outsiders the negative experiences.

Overall if I were a new-to-pbp or new-to-forums person, I'm not sure I'd stick around long enough to find my niche through what I'm seeing. But I've been around a while, and I've learned that if I'm patient, something will come up eventually. Sometimes this means going dormant for stretches.

As an aside, I think that the mass diverting of OOC discussion to Discord (and previously other chat apps) hasn't dome forum world many favors. It does tend to create an ourward appearance that nothing much is going on on-site. While I understand the benefits of Discord, I think forum folks would do well to keep more active discussions in-house. I mean wr talk about the death of forums as if we aren't aiding and abetting the process by migrating to the new platforms.

In summary, things we can do/control to better help the situation:
- Stick with it, even if life gets crazy snd it takes a bit longer fkr things to get moving.
- Be patient. Getting through an RP is about endurance, not speed. (Seems like a lot of people duck out when things don't move quickly enough).
- Be open. Letting people new to the site, RP, or group can go a decent way in keeping the hobby alive.

Idk. Just me having 4am thoughts.