Let me ask you a very fair question:

Do you think that there is even a small chance that your viewpoint is incorrect and that the people offering alternatives and solid advice here have a point?

If you are not willing to accept that you may be wrong, you are not here to be helped--you are here to be validated. You cannot be helped if you only want your worldview to be reinforced, not changed for the better.

If you're having issues try reading through these pages and pick a few people's suggestions that you think might help you. Now make an Interest Check (if you really want to GM a new RP) or type up a Character Sheet for an RP you want to join...while keeping these issues in mind. Consider it an exercise. If you focus on improving your writing on those basis...es you will likely see some improvement.

You might consider just writing a short story or two instead too. Short Stories make good Interest Checks. You could also always start another little Short Story Contest, or do like a Short Story Starter Thread where you post a Short Story, someone posts some feedback and a starter and then you post another Short Story based on that starter. Or you could do the same thing and trade off who posts the starters and who posts the stories. Good way to meet people and start getting known better.

@Tuujaimaa Well like you said it is a fair question to ask. My answer and reply to you is that I don't think my viewpoint is incorrect based on the experiences I had and feel like I need to defend myself from people that never gone through the pain to me of having the amount of RP's dead within a year at all.

I feel like I have to constantly fight for my side to be heard without feeling like I am valid to feel what I feel or say what I say without past experiences of people wanting to jump on me about it and then bury it/hide it like some sort of skeleton from the closet that they don't want out.

@Tuujaimaa Well like you said it is a fair question to ask. My answer and reply to you is that I don't think my viewpoint is incorrect based on the experiences I had and feel like I need to defend myself from people that never gone through the pain to me of having the amount of RP's dead within a year at all.

Then you should not be in this thread as you do not think you are doing anything wrong.

@Tuujaimaa Well like you said it is a fair question to ask. My answer and reply to you is that I don't think my viewpoint is incorrect based on the experiences I had and feel like I need to defend myself from people that never gone through the pain to me of having the amount of RP's dead within a year at all.

I feel like I have to constantly fight for my side to be heard without feeling like I am valid to feel what I feel or say what I say without past experiences of people wanting to jump on me about it and then bury it/hide it like some sort of skeleton from the closet that they don't want out.

Everyone in this thread has had plenty of RPs die. That's just how RPing goes. We do understand how you feel. The problem is how you're acting on those feelings.

@rebornfan320 Bruh, how long have you been RPing?

And I will be here @Ammokkx regardless of what you say.

@Celaira It don't seem like it whenever it seems more of a bum rush on me instead of actually understanding my side to things without wanting to hide it right away.

@yoshua171 I have been roleplaying for about a decade now but the past 3-5 years is when from the first site i had done RP's with was when my luck started to go bad and I feel it still is. From one site 85 dead in a year of joining that before it peaked at 95 and left there.
Joined here and got 45 dead rp's within a year but that number is at 63 and a third site where i got 20 dead there. Thought to catch you up and answer your question but overall I'm tired of feeling like I am made to feel like my side of things don't matter at all and anything i done hasn't worked to what i was told and nothing really sticking for me.

Oh, also, @rebornfan320, I don't mind if you dislike me on a personal level. That's fine, that's fair. But do notice that the things I am saying are not being said in a vacuum. I am mainly echoing what others have said, and the fact at least 1 or more people deign to leave a reaction on my posts should show that the words I say are sentiments echoed by not just me. It's fine if you don't want to take my words seriously, but if that is the case, I implore you to read them as if someone else who dropped a reaction on them had posted them.

Despite what you may think, I am genuinely trying to help you. The problem is that you need to first recognize the faults of your failures do not lie with your partners, but with you. I am sorry if this is painful, I am sorry if you have trouble believing that but it is the undisputable truth of the matter. Until you accept this and do some introspection, as well as be a bit more humble towards others, I fear that you will continue to fail time and time again.

Regardless of what any single individual here may feel about you, and regardless of what you may feel about them, each and every single one of us are trying to help you in some way. The best result, for all of us, is that you open your eyes to the errors of your ways and start actually engaging with the community on a level they are comfortable with rather than what you wish out of them. You will find us more receptive to you, and you more receptive to us, if you make an active effort to fix the problems we have pointed out to you multiple times.

My apologies for being rude to you at times, truly, but this olive branch we extend to you is going to wither and die eventually if you do not reach out and wrap your hand around it.

Nice to see the thread hasn't imploded yet.

On the topic of RPs n all, from my point of view, there's two ways in which players are drawn/stuck with a RP: the promise of a fun plot, and the potential for characters to grow. If you can formulate an idea that offers both ways, that's even better! To clarify what I mean, I guess I'll ram in some examples...



If you can convey the sense that such things are possible, AND the sense that you're able to offer that to players (which may really just be something dependent on something as intangible as the vibes that your post gives off), I think that there's a pretty good chance you'll have at least some interested folk, whether you're new or not. Presentation, of course, also helps a ton (I've become so visually-dependent that my mind shrivels up without A E S T H E T I C S to keep me engaged), while I'd say that branding your RP as based off something else (rather than just being inspired by it), is a double-edged sword in terms of getting people's attention. Pretty sure others make better points about it than I did though.

Also maybe someone already ninja'd me on these points too.

Oh well, at least I shilled.

@Ammokkx
It didn't feel like you were "genuine" on that help attempt as it sure felt like a attack on me and my stance on things from my viewpoint as you came off to me like anyone else, they didn't understand my viewpoint and came off rather rudely.

I feel it is more of my partners than myself because of them always ghosting and poofing off on me without any sort of warning or heads up whatsoever. I do feel like a target whenever I speak up on something that frustrates me as I expect I have to defend myself against a mob mentality and I got to fight against everyone else just to feel like I am getting through to people or even understood.

I don't see how what I am doing is wrong in retrospect when I look at it, I am doing my hardest to even get interest and any advice hasn't worked or stuck as effective or long as I expect you know? I feel like this “olive branch” could be like those other times and just filled with empty promises of things getting better for me when my luck and experience has shown me completely different. Like how am I supposed to trust the advice when the advice before failed? It's like I always have to fight for my voice and side to be even remotely heard I feel most times.

@rebornfan320 aight, so I gotta level with you man. If you started a decade ago, right, and then 3-5 years ago suddenly you started just...getting tons of abandoned RPs/ghosters etc, then something changed. Either every single person over literally 100s of threads (by your own count) were miraculously all just terrible at communication and had no regard for anyone else but themselves or something changed in you. The latter is more likely.

Further, people can understand where you're coming from, but not agree with you. This may make you uncomfortable, I'm sorry if it does, but it's true. Just about everyone in this thread has been at the very least on the Guild just as long as you, and who knows how long on Old Guild or websites prior to that, so the chance that all of us (and the 100s of people who ghosted you) are wrong is basically zero. The odds on that are definitely not in your favor my dude ^^;

Furthermore, idk about everyone else, but I've been RPing for roughly over 12 years and I've felt what you're feeling before. So I can definitely understand and empathize. I bet a bunch of other people here have felt this same way, I bet some portion of those people who have, also sometimes feel mad jaded by putting themselves out there and nothing coming of it. The difference though, between you and them is most people move on from it and try to do better, whereas you are dwelling on it and letting it be the only thing that is true to you.

Sorry man, other people also have experiences just as valid as yours--even similar ones--and just because they disagree, does not make what they're saying any less valuable or accurate.

But hey, I'm just some dude on the internet. Just a dude who has also been doing this for a ludicrously long period of time. Just a dude who sometimes feels this same way, but doesn't actually go and blame other people about it because it's more pointless than just...trying harder. I'm just some guy, what do I know, right?

This is also intended to be a general thread rebornfan.

If you want to have a long discussion about your personal issues try DMs. This is more intended as like a thread for folks to state things they have issues with or have friends who have issues with and then receive advice and then try to implement it. It's not intended as a Help Reborn thread. Sorry if that's kinda harsh but Ammokkx was right about that. Advice doesn't work if you don't want to implement it.

There are some gems of advice in this thread. @BangoSkank good job updating the OP to include them.

Just to jump in with my personal experience... A few months ago I celebrated my one year anniversary of joining this forum. During this time, I have been part of...

That number is only the RPs that made it passed the planning stages, and there are probably more I don't remember. Some are groups, some are 1x1s, and one I even GMed myself. Shoutout to ERode for bringing up Windfall which is not dead! I think the most important thing that's been mentioned so far is what Rapid Reader wrote:

You have to ask yourself, "what does success mean for me as a GM/RPer"?

For me, it's 100% about having fun, so as long as I had fun while the RP was active, that's what matters to me. I understand this isn't a sentiment shared by everyone, so now I'll share some stuff that attracts me as a potential player to people's roleplays, to help people looking for what they can do to attract more people and achieve the success they are looking for. I'm sure some of this has been mentioned already in the thread but bear with me.

Presentation is very important. That doesn't mean a lot of fancy bbcode, but it does mean taking a moment to present your ideas in a clear, concise way. For example, a large wall of block of text can be a big turn off, but breaking that wall down into multiple paragraphs is already an improvement to help with information digestion. Also, less is more! Especially when it comes to 1x1 checks, not to come off rude but... no one needs your life story. Make your RP ideas front and center, at least!

Passion for an idea can show through your interest check, so make sure you put your heart into it if it's an idea you really want to try, and don't give up! Even if it's a more generic idea, if you show you're serious about it, you'll have more attention.

As far as reputation goes, you'd be surprised how far a name and avatar change can go along with a dedicated plan to turn over a new leaf. If you're worried about your reputation putting people off, try on a new "brand" so to speak and work to change it, especially by reaching out to others. They say you get what you give, so joining other people's checks will give some good karma

Edit: there are some interesting things to read in this thread too about what people are looking for that may help with getting interest!

Here's a tip free of charge: don't keep a tally of your failed RPs, cause that's literally just a discouragement machine in the forefront of your mind. Anyone who's been RPing for a few years or more probably has dozens, if not hundreds, of failed RPs under their belt, but they also probably can't even remember most of them cause they moved on rather than dwelling on it.

Think of it this way. If we ranked hockey players by how many shots they missed and not by how many goals they scored, even the best of the best would look like hot garbage.

I get it Bango but it was for Ammo. I have done implementing advice before like i stated but it didn't work to my expectations either.

@rebornfan320 supposing for a moment that everyone understood your viewpoint, what exactly would that solve? I'm reading this thread and trying to wrap my head around why you keep falling back to that. What exactly do you want to hear, or for there to happen? Ultimately the outcome of a thread like this (or the 6 or so you made before, not including your many statuses about this topic), would be for something to change and for people to stop ghosting you.

I personally can't influence the actions of others, and I certainly can't make people stop ghosting in general (nor do I want to -- I'm of the unpopular opinion that you don't owe anyone anything and even a message to let me know you're dropping is just a respectful courtesy not owed to anyone) much less stop them from ghosting you. So, I suppose that that option is off the table -- namely that you make others change, and I expect you know that too.

But I am left confused as to what the purpose might be otherwise. I hate to assume that you are simply looking for pity, so I won't assume that -- but what exactly are you looking for in these threads + statuses?

Absolutely.

The one I linked in the OP was probably my favorite RP in recent memory and it failed huge. Mostly my fault. Big ass bummer but you don't track how many failed stories youve had, I can't even count that high. Murica.

Here's a tip free of charge: don't keep a tally of your failed RPs, cause that's literally just a discouragement machine in the forefront of your mind. Anyone who's been RPing for a few years or more probably has dozens, if not hundreds, of failed RPs under their belt, but they also probably can't even remember most of them cause they moved on rather than dwelling on it.

Think of it this way. If we ranked hockey players by how many shots they missed and not by how many goals they scored, even the best of the best would look like hot garbage.

Agreed, I had to go back and count my old saved characters to come up with the number it can definitely turn into a kind of self fulfilling prophecy. If you're focused so much on failing, you will continue failing.

@Odin Here's your answer.
Well if everyone understood my viewpoint, it would solve me always ending up a target in the negative feelings for me when it comes to me stating something. I would like to be on equals grounds of relatability with other people as a whole. Also something to change to make people stop ghosting me as it is dishonorable and cowardly to do that to someone as you hyped up their interest only to leave them hanging.

On a personal level, ghosting needs to be stop and likely punished in some way to dis-encourage it as I feel once you make interest for a RP known to someone I expect 100 percent commitment to it unless you state that you are dropping off respectfully or will be busy.

And never assume I was even looking for pity, I am looking to be understood with what I feel coupled along with what I say but every single time I do I get met with swords and pitchforks from people as it feels like everyone is against me for even speaking out about something that is clearly upsetting me.

Well at least you deigned to grace me with a rebuttal this time so I can actually have a conversation with you on your viewpoints. That being said, I tire of this just as much as you do. I'm going to go as in-depth as I can with this post as to why your way of thinking is flawed. If, after this post, you still remain unconvinced, then there is nothing me or anyone else is ever going to be able to do to you to help you. You might as well never ask for help or complain about anything ever again at that point, because nothing anyone can say to you will allow you to step over the hurdles you face. Also, I don't want to get this any more off-topic than I have.

@Ammokkx
It didn't feel like you were "genuine" on that help attempt

You know what? You're right. I am aggressive and off-putting. And, in the status bar, I was especially set on slamming some good dunks as I shitpost on that thing more than I do actually talk to people. But over here, each of my posts have had advice and critique not hidden beneath a veneer of snark. If you cannot take them as efforts to help you, then my words have no way to reach you to begin with. Even my "Then you have no reason to be in this thread" is an honest statement. As others have said, you are not acting like someone who wants help. You come across as wanting people to wallow in your pity. Again, I don't say this because I dislike you, I say this because it is what your words look like to other people. Make of it what you feel like making of it.

@Ammokkx
it sure felt like a attack on me and my stance on things from my viewpoint as you came off to me like anyone else, they didn't understand my viewpoint and came off rather rudely.

What it "feels" like to you isn't what it is. Death of the author may be a thing, but you're the only one that seems to share in the sentiment. No, I do understand your viewpoint. I may not be able to relate to a bunch of 1x1 posters ghosting me, of course, due to my penchant for group RPs... or can I?

Let me tell you, I was 13 at a time. 13 year old Ammokkx was on Tumblr, hosting an RP blog. Tumblr RPs are 1x1. I had a bunch of partners and, yes, I did get ghosted. It felt like I was being ignored. I tried so desperately hard to get people's attention but it seemed like nobody wanted to RP with me. At the time, I didn't understand why.

But in retrospect, I saw that I was insufferable to those around me. I powergame'd. My OC's were mary sues. I was a huge dick to people. I'm amazed I still have friends from that era at all, but the long and short is that I was very much the cause of my own downfall... in hindsight. I didn't see it at the time, and you do not seem to see it now. I understand how you feel, Reborn. Everyone understands how you feel. Feel free to not believe us if you like. But know this; It is because we know how you feel that we are giving this advice in the hope that those feelings push you to be better than you are. Even if many have given up hope to that end.

I feel it is more of my partners than myself because of them always ghosting and poofing off on me without any sort of warning or heads up whatsoever.

This is a problem that you're far from the only person who faces it. In fact, if you ask around, I'm sure you can find some people with 1x1 blacklists of notorious ghosters. Hell, I have a semi-official blacklist for group RPers with a penchant for ghosting. Those people do exist, but if you cannot hold a single RP? If you cannot retain a single friend? Please, Reborn. Please tell me you don't genuinely believe that there must not at least be the tiniest thing wrong with your approach if everyone treats you the same way. If you can only draw that crowd. I refuse to believe you are this blind to a simple matter of fact.

There's a crude idiom for this that rings true nevertheless. "If it smells like shit everywhere you go, check underneath your soles."

I do feel like a target whenever I speak up on something that frustrates me as I expect I have to defend myself against a mob mentality and I got to fight against everyone else just to feel like I am getting through to people or even understood.

The reason it feels this way is because the thing you are complaining about, the very thing that sparked this thread, is something I have called you out on in the past. You keep complaining about the same thing, and people keep telling you the same things. You then proceed to ignore what everyone tells you and do the thing you were previously doing, all the while complaining about the same subject again. You know the quote from Farcry 3? "Definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results" and all that? I feel it applies here. It is only a mob mentality because we have done this same song and dance time and again. If you go back and read your old threads, people were kind to you when you first asked. Even when you asked again, a third time, even in the post I called you out on! But then you keep doing it again, and again, and again.

At some point, we grew sick of hearing the same story. If you have nothing new to say, if you have no other insights... then, quite frankly, none of us want to hear it. I'm sorry. If you consider this to be mobbing, then the mob is never going to end. You choose to keep bringing this up, so we push back.

I don't see how what I am doing is wrong in retrospect when I look at it, I am doing my hardest to even get interest and any advice hasn't worked or stuck as effective or long as I expect you know?

I do know. I really do. While not the exact same, I have trouble retaining interests in my RPs. People just don't want to post after a while when I GM. I am desperately looking for the source of the issue, even when I can't find anything I am doing wrong. It is an ongoing struggle and it is a flaw I am all too aware of. It is why I have an aversion to GMing, it sucks! But I don't blame other people for it, you know? I don't turn it into a "me vs. them" issue. I never blame my players for losing interest, I look inside of myself and think "What could I have done better in hindsight? How could I apply this to my next idea going forward?"

I take huge breaks in between GMing for this very reason. It is, quite frankly, not fun to have something crash and burn, nor is it fun to have something which was once so lively be on life support at the end of its days. But I always had a part to play in that. You do too.

I feel like this “olive branch” could be like those other times and just filled with empty promises of things getting better for me when my luck and experience has shown me completely different. Like how am I supposed to trust the advice when the advice before failed?

But have you truly applied the advice? When we ask you to add colour or image, you reject it vehemently. When we say you aren't too pleasant of a person to talk to, you disagree and deny it. To me, at least, it doesn't look like you're actually applying any advice at all. But you don't have to take my word for it. Ask one of the nicer people to coach you, to run through the motions with you. But you have to understand that you will have to make changes to the way you do things. If they tell you "do this" then you do it, no questions asked. You don't push back. You don't fight it. The moment you fight it, you prove that you don't want to be helped.

I will not claim to know things better than you. But there are people that can claim as such. Listen to them. Listen. Don't argue.

It's like I always have to fight for my voice and side to be even remotely heard I feel most times.

No, Reborn. We hear your voice. We understand your side. You have made it loud and clear. But nobody agrees with your perspective and we're not going to start any time soon. What we see out of you, the vast majority of us, runs counter to the narrative you try to spin. At that point you need to ask; if everyone in the world is crazy except for the one sane man, is the one sane man truly sane? In that same respect, if literally everybody tells you the opposite of what you tell yourself, is your perspective truly the right one? My answer, as you can guess, is no. Yours should be no too, but it is up to you to recognize that.

That's it. That's my final post for this thread, or at least, on the subject of your personal failures. Do with it as you wish. If you don't want to listen to what I have to say, then I have nothing I can say to you.